Disney Extortion!

[Drew Krause]

I've been sitting here reading all these posts getting madder and madder. How many people can honestly say that going to the "Championship Event", In Disney , is not one of the most enjoyable experiences of the robotics season. Disney is providing FIRST a place to host their competition and people aren't staying on their property. Disney is a bussiness, first and foremost. They are out to make a profit. I personally am grateful for such a great place to hold the event and would gladly pay the extra 75 dollars to stay off the property. Disney is willing to make a profit cut for us to be there, they close off all of Epcot for the wrap party, and everyone who is their has a lot of fun. If you don't want to pay the extra money, Disney could easily say that teams wanting to compete have to stay on the property wich would cut the number of teams that could compete significantly, and from all the complaining that came up when FIRST set their restrictions earlier this year, that wouldn't make anyone any happier. Disney is in a lose/lose situation here so cut them some slack. Be thankful for what we've got. Don't look a gift horse in the mouth. And to those of you complaining about the cost of food, IT'S NO DIFFERENT THAN AT THE REGIONALS! That goes back to companies trying to make a profit.

[Mike Norton]

I am lucky we are not going to the nationals ( odd team) there is no way disney should be treating FIRST as 3rd class people

I have been going to the national for the past 6 years and we made out better everytime we went not using the package deal. but a deal that disney offers every non FIRST group.

to give you example we are going to disney after the KSC regional we got a 4 day park hopper for $138 and a room for $94 a night that is $232.00 per person with 4 per room Disney cost is $389. We saved $157

you take this price an times it by the students we are taken 16 kids that is saving $2562.00 just on the kids alone

for a single room for 4 nights with a 4 day park hopper it cost us $514 disney charging $688. this is a saving of $174

So just looking at the numbers, Disney is taking FIRST teams for a ride. But you have to know FIRST gets so many rooms for free.

this is just the start I can go on forever with all the stuff disney does not do for you as a FIRST team compare if you went down and booked your team as something else.

[Madison]

Our team opted for the 5 day package at Disney's Caribbean Beach Resort.

The cost? $443.69 per person assuming four people to a room.

If I were to book this same thing independently, accounting for everything included in the package, for four people, this is what I came up with:

Room: Regular season rate of $154/night. We'll round to $160 and be generous about hotel taxes and things.

So, one hotel room for four nights - $616.00

Park Media: Four day park hopper pass, adult rate - $203.52 +tax. I'm ignoring tax.

So, passes for four people - $814.08

Food: The package provides for 3 breakfast coupons and 3 lunch/dinner coupons per person. I'm assuming prices, and being a bit generous here. So, I'm making each meal coupon a value of $10.

6 meals, four people, $10 per meal - $240.00

Commemorative Gift: We get a t-shirt.

4 T-shirts @$20 - $80.00

Grand total? $1750.08
Price per person? $437.52

What're we paying again? $443.69. ~$5 more.

So, as best as I can see (unless I'm overlooking something huge here), things on the Disney end of things seem Kosher. This neglects to mention of course, the costs passed on to each person to cover the costs associated with the event's infrastructure, and all of the rippling costs that Disney and FIRST presumably absorb.

Seems like a good deal to me.

[Mike Norton]

Grand total? $1750.08

If you do your homework you will find that the prices you have are not the prices you can get.

4 day park pass $138.00 Rooms at allstar resort $94.00

Commemorative Gift: you can get anything you want in the book they give you.

You should call Disney youth group. they have all the prices you need.

you can save per person on tickets $65.00

food coupons are $9.00 a ticket. 9 x 24 =$196.00 save $24.00

If you are a school that is a non-tax you do not have to pay any taxes.

I don't know the price of the room but I can bet you it will be at least $40 less a day than you have listed. 40 x 4 =$160.00

given you a total saving of $111.00 per person off of your plan.

I do not think you have done your home work

I don't know how many people on your team is going but if you have 10 than that means you could of saved $1,110.00

do you get pool side rooms? Do you have to pay to store your bags for your team? Do you have to wait in a line somewhere else than the front desk to get your rooms?

those are all the negative things you will have to deal with in your package if you book using FIRST name.

Everyone is entitled to thier opinion, but I have to remark that I have noticed that in this post most of the arguments for the extra fee are coming from the teams that can afford to stay in disney in the first place...... and while you may have a secure sponsor and a large enough budget, there are many teams out there that just cant afford 75 more dollar per person..... what happens to them? they eventually drop out.... didnt Dean say himself that the way to keep long term sponsors was to keep the costs down?

you see, the teams that dont stay inside the park would already be staying in the park if they could afford it because its much much closer.... trust me its no fun driving for 45 minutes to the competition at 7am...... the problem is we cant afford it and this 75$ per person fee is disneys way at getting back at us because we dont have the money to stay in thier park. I understand disney couldnt just throw the party or run the competition without financial benefits.... but out $4000 entrance fees should more than cover any costs for that. Besides the entire competition brings a surge of business to disney and they also have a monopoly over the very unreasonably priced concession stands

i would think that FIRST would want to spread its influence to poor intercity high schools and provide opportunities where there are so few...... but this fee is just one more thing working against that

in my opinion disney is not exercising the gracious professionalism that it is supposed to be promoting
i hope they rethink this one

Becky

also about the prices.... there is no way my team could afford the proposed 443 dollars per person........... we stay at an inexpensive hotel thats a little bit of a distance from disney that costs nowhere near 160 per night......... and we go to the supermarket and make sandwhiches for lunch to cut the costs.... we come out waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay lower than that

FIRST is probably a tax write off for disney as well.... not to mention advertising (i mean, arent they making a movie about it?)

[mnkysp6353]

Disney is in this to make money and nothing else. They only do this to make money. Everyone may say oh no there not making money. They are a major corporation and wouldnt do anything without signifigant financial gains.

[Herodriver]

Ok, i've gone through all the posts and i've got something I want to add. I havent heard of this fee until now and I must say i am outraged! I live in Orlando....less than 20 minutes away from Disney. Now they are telling me I need to pay them $75 because i'm not staying in thier hotels??? You've got to be kidding, this is just rediculous. First of all, there is no way in my right mind that I'd pay for a hotel when I live so close, AND even if I did stay in a hotel, there is no way I'd pay for Disney's outragous prices. When you consider who they are charging...even those who live locally....it starts getting silly.

[Madison]

Originally posted by Mike Norton



If you do your homework you will find that the prices you have are not the prices you can get.

4 day park pass $138.00 Rooms at allstar resort $94.00

Commemorative Gift: you can get anything you want in the book they give you.

You should call Disney youth group. they have all the prices you need.

you can save per person on tickets $65.00

food coupons are $9.00 a ticket. 9 x 24 =$196.00 save $24.00

If you are a school that is a non-tax you do not have to pay any taxes.

I don't know the price of the room but I can bet you it will be at least $40 less a day than you have listed. 40 x 4 =$160.00

given you a total saving of $111.00 per person off of your plan.

I do not think you have done your home work

I don't know how many people on your team is going but if you have 10 than that means you could of saved $1,110.00

do you get pool side rooms? Do you have to pay to store your bags for your team? Do you have to wait in a line somewhere else than the front desk to get your rooms?

those are all the negative things you will have to deal with in your package if you book using FIRST name.

A few things. . .

First, I realize that there are discounts available, both to regular guests as well as groups. I chose the baseline Disney numbers merely as a quick comparison, as I don't have the time to shop around and explore all possible savings.

Did you book as a group? I'd imagine you did, as you'd be hard pressed to get prices that low on parkhopper passes. Also, it's worthy to mention that the passes given to groups are different than those given to the general public.

My numbers revolved around staying at Disney's Caribbean Beach Resort, a moderate category hotel. The All-Star Resorts are a value resort and are cheaper by default.

We're not paying a whole lot above what someone booking at published rates might. We are a group, so those same discounted rates are in effect for our team as those you may have gotten. As such, I'd consider that the difference goes to subsidizing the cost of the event, which is what this whole thing is about anyway. Our package subsidizes the cost of the event, while booking separately does not.

Bottom line? We're happy with out choice, and even with paying a bit extra for the convenience and experience of staying in one of Disney's resorts.

[RicNic_team930]

i'm on a rookie team. we have been fundraising tons because we are going to nations. we are staying in the sports hotel inside disney. were lucky we have such great sponsorers

[Mike Norton]

Bottom line? We're happy with out choice, and even with paying a bit extra for the convenience and experience of staying in one of Disney's resorts.

Some teams don't have the choice of having the money to pay for the better hotel or even the low price hotel.

The point is a group should be a group no matter what group you are with like the FIRST group.

the point is teams are paying $4,000 and getting very little. some team have only 10 people going to the nationals while some bring 100s. but they all pay the $4000 fee plus another fee disney is putting on them.

If disney want FIRST to be at disney they need to put in more.


in the past the shows and the food at disney were great. last year show was not the top ten on my list.

everything comes down to money. so tell these kids that if you want to make it in this world you better do what you can to get money because with out it you will not see the big show.


I can go on about this subject but I will bite my lip and move on.

im sure every team would love to stay at a hotel that supports FIRST........ but the main point it they dont all have the money to do it and no matter how you look at it even with group discounts, disney is way more expensive.......... this 75 dollar fee is being put on the teams that cant afford it (no matter how much they wish they could)

[Madison]

Originally posted by Mike Norton



Some teams don't have the choice of having the money to pay for the better hotel or even the low price hotel.

The point is a group should be a group no matter what group you are with like the FIRST group.

the point is teams are paying $4,000 and getting very little. some team have only 10 people going to the nationals while some bring 100s. but they all pay the $4000 fee plus another fee disney is putting on them.

If disney want FIRST to be at disney they need to put in more.


in the past the shows and the food at disney were great. last year show was not the top ten on my list.

everything comes down to money. so tell these kids that if you want to make it in this world you better do what you can to get money because with out it you will not see the big show.


I can go on about this subject but I will bite my lip and move on.

A group is a group is a group. Booking through the FIRST package, we are being assessed group discount rates just as you might be if you booked outside of the package. The only reason we pay more than you is because our team is being charged an additional fee to cover the event costs. Your team is not being charged this same fee within the price of your package, so FIRST and Disney add an additional charge of $75. In effect, it seems similar to me, so I don't understand what the big deal is.

Your $4000 entry fee is assessed irrespective of the size of your team. Just as your initial $5000 does nothing to cover any travel costs that may be associated with attending a regional, the same is true of Nationals, of course. This, I believe, is the most fair way of handling this. I'd much prefer it over being charged an entry fee based on your team size. . . that would, after all, very effectively limit how many students this program involves.

I don't know FIRST's budget offhand, but I feel that I can pretty safely say that very, very little of the entry fees are passed on the regional developers. There are folks around here that know more about that than I, though. So, it's really up to those charged with planning the events that need to somehow gather enough funds to do it. If Disney chooses to cover those costs by assessing a small fee, that's fine with me.

Further, I have been quite satisfied with my experience at Nationals in both 2000, and 2001. If you and your team have not been as impressed, you always reserve the right to not attend. After all, money speaks, right?

Finally, I'd beg to differ about your final note. Everything does *not* come down to how much money you have. It's what you do with it (or without) that counts.

you seem to be missing the point........ as impressed as everybody is with the competition, not everyone can afford $75 dollars a person or to stay on disney property....... and its not because we arents spending the money wisely, its because we dont have enough money
i mean it would be one thing if a team was complaining about the fee and showed up with a titanium robot........ but thats not the kind of team that this is affecting

and you are absolutely right this does limit the amount of students that can attend........ pretty much any team thats been struggling by without a sponsor wont be able to afford this....... and intercity schools where opportunities are few to begin with

you go tell those people they have the choice to go or not go when they cant even afford to replace a peice of plywood or make tshirts


i do understand that there are teams that bring massive amounts of members and disney is trying to make it fair by having them pay more since they brought more people....... but maybe the way to do this is instead to have the registration fee cover the driving team and 5 other support members so at least every team can compete without extra costs and have any additional team members pay