Omni Mania

[Frank(Aflak)]

lots of info about various omni drives can be found in this thread.

This thread includes listings of all applicable drive trains, discussion and debate about the various strengths and weaknesses of each drive, a place to obtain good omniwheels, etc. etc. Even some argument over whether or not a 4-wheel killough can deliver 100% power.

read up in there.

[SpaceOsc]

Thanks that is more useful

[SpaceOsc]

I read in the past threads about 111 wildstang being a serve drive... i thought it was a true omni drive with omni wheels

Can someone verify of clarify?

[Bill Gold]

In the 2002 and 2003 seasons Wildstang (111) has used a crab steering system. Their drive system was powered by 2 Drill motors and 2 FP motors (one motor driving a different wheel), and their modules were rotated using 2 Globe motors. Check here for 2003 pictures http://www2.wildstang.org/2003/inven...otographs.html

In 2003, The Sea Dawgs (258) used a similar system, but we used 2 Drill motors and 2 CIM motors to drive (1 per wheel), and 2 Globe motors to rotate each pair of modules.

<edit>
That link into Wildstang's Inventor Award submission is a really neat place to look at the intracacies of their robot. Their 2002 submission was great, as well.
</edit>

<edit_2>
I'm going to find a few pictures of 258's 2003 system and link to them a little later.
</edit_2>

[JVN]

Originally posted by Bill Gold

<edit>
That link into Wildstang's Inventor Award submission is a really neat place to look at the intracacies of their robot. Their 2002 submission was great, as well.
</edit>

Any chance the 2002 submission is still out there somewhere? I'd love to see it. Heck, I'd keep a copy on my computer if I could.

I'd love to see more teams publish inventor awards of this quality. I think we'd see an overall increase in bot construction and technology if everyone shared like 111.

[KenWittlief]

which team had the ball drive - looked like a giant backwards mouse ball - was that in 2002?

I dont know how well it worked in the games, but that is what I think of when I hear omni-drive - it could go in any direction without first having to point the wheel (there were no wheels)

[KyleGilbert45]

Not to get this off subject or anything.....

We (team 45) had a ball drive last season, but we did not use it an any competitions. Team 909 did use the ball drive while in Chicago due to the fact that their robot was not operational.

here are some links

Team 909 using the ball drive

Thread about the Ball Drive "Mighty Mouse"

[Dave Scheck]

Ken - TechnoKats (45) had the ball drive.

I'm looking into finding our 2002 Inventor submission. I'll post a link if I find it.

I wasn't on the team then, but in 2001 our robot (Rampbot) had BUPODS (omni wheels) on the front. Mike Soukup can probably fill in any details.

This picture shows the BUPODS. There may be closer shots in the 2001 gallery, these were the first two I saw.

http://www2.wildstang.org/gallery/2001_Build/P2100004
http://www2.wildstang.org/gallery/2001_Build/STUDEN_2

[Sachiel7]

I've designed an "omni drive" that we probably will end up using this year. It can function as a Skid steer, Crab, Car, and Angle drive systems, all at the simple push of a button. It should be pretty durable too. I'm not going to post any specs on it until after we build it.
I've prototyped it several times using Lego's/edu bot parts, etc, and each time it's worked very well. Since it can function as any system, we won't lose anything walking into kickoff with the designs waiting. If there isnt any reason not to use it, then we'll probably go through with it.
It costs about $800 for the chassis, drive components, and some spare parts. It's estimated weight is around 40lbs. (w/o electronics)
Anyway, I'm putting together a video presentation on my system, to show my team. I might post it up on CD later...

[Tytus Gerrish]

I Think Im coming down with it...

I think ive gOT OMNI FEAVER!

Oh NO! NoT the Crab sTRAND Thats the Most Contageous!

[ajlapp]

here was our omni-drive killough from 2002, we loved this drivetrain. its super maneuverable and very easy to program, but we had no traction. we didn't need the traction back then though, so it wasn't a problem......this video is worth watch though.

we never got caught up in definitions when we built our drivetrain............

since there is so much talk about omni-drives, i thought i'd let you know that we're still waiting to use our next generation Kiwi Drive............stay tuned, its been two years in the works.

for now, check out our old video from the pre-season of 2002, this was a video we unveiled before competing with our reworked chassis. it was more fun to drive than to watch.

the first and last FIRST Killough, for now

http://stuweb.ee.mtu.edu/~alkrajew/FIRST/kiwi.mpg

[KenWittlief]

anthony - that video is just awesome

im wondering why you say you didnt need a lot of traction in the 2002 game?! that was the one with the 180 lb goals that had to be dragged into your zone to score

and the finals pretty much turned into a goal dragging contest.

so...... im confused (as usual :c)

[Bill Gold]

Originally posted by JVN
Any chance the 2002 submission is still out there somewhere? I'd love to see it. Heck, I'd keep a copy on my computer if I could.

I'd love to see more teams publish inventor awards of this quality. I think we'd see an overall increase in bot construction and technology if everyone shared like 111.

I've got a copy of it on my computer. My AIM is bi24ll, contact me sometime and I can transfer the pics/vids to you. I'll be out until late tonight, though. I'll be around tomorrow.

[Joe Ross]

Ken,

I thought about addressing this when you made your other post in this thread, but never made the time for it.

Each year, there are many ways to play the game. Last year, you could stack, or you could play for the top of the ramp. The year before, you could grab, move, and steal goals, or you could do balls. Each year has had a break down like that. These past two years, the scoring has been biased toward having a powerful robot, but I don't believe that was intentional.

Last year, team 67 had one of the best stackers, and they also had a swerve drive which helped them immensely. Looking back, we (73) really could have benefited from a swerve also.

in 2002, the kiwi drive was used on a ball collecting robot. I never saw their full robot in action, but I can guess that they paid little to no attention to the goals. Did they win any competitions? No. But they did build an awesome robot.

Most teams find out the game, then choose a strategy, then build a robot to meet that strategy. However, other teams choose something new to try, and then figure out what part of the game they can use it best at. I can almost guarantee that there will be some part of the game next year where a very maneuverable robot will have an advantage.

Some of my favorite robots (Beatty 2002 being the best example) were designed specifically to suit the game. But who knows if their walking design was designed in the first weeks of the 2002, or the summer before, or 5 years before.

The Kiwi drive and the ball drive are both very beautiful designs. One was used in competition, the other wasn't planned to be. Who knows when their team might win the championship because of their ultra-manuverable drive system developed earlier.

I certainly wouldn't discourage 702 from working on a swerve drive, whether or not they design their robot around it. They have the added bonus that they would be only the 2nd team to have a working swerve on the west coast (258 being the first).

[Mike Soukup]

Originally posted by Bill Gold
I've got a copy of it on my computer. My AIM is bi24ll, contact me sometime and I can transfer the pics/vids to you. I'll be out until late tonight, though. I'll be around tomorrow.

Bill passing Wildstang pictures & videos to John & the rest of FIRST....hmm....that sounds oddly familiar

We're currently looking on the server for the 2002 inventor submission and will hopefully have it up again in a day or so.

SpaceOsc: Our 2002 robot used a 4 wheel swerve/crab drive without omni-wheels. Dave posted pics of our 2001 robot that had a set of omni-wheels. There may be better pictures around our gallery, and I'm pretty sure Matt Reiland has some good closeups too.

ajlapp: I'm still amazed at how cool your Kiwi drive is and also how simple & elegant the control system was. Great job with that bot.