Pre-Ship Scrimage Results

[Travis Covington]

Originally Posted by sanddrag

The highest scoring bot I saw was one that parked under the ball dumb got ALL the balls, drove over to the ball chute, and deposited them all.

Got any pics? I would love to see that!

PS. Sorry we werent there.. i wanted to see what you guys have been up to!

[ArJubx]

We (#1463) went to the DC afternoon session. We mainly went for the learning experience. This is our first year so it was quite helpful. Although we didn't manage to do much because of poor decisions caused by lack of experience, we managed to get a good idea of what we need to do to fix our issues.

DC had some arena controller issues, so there radio channel conflicts because not many teams brought thier own compitition simulating control box thingy (us included). Also most teams didn't have autonomous code yet (we didn't, I just did all that today after school). The few that did, did barely anything, #225 drove forward like 5 feet and stopped, another team just spun in circles.

Those balls at DC were really messed up, they were smaller and heavier than the regulation ones. So alot of ppl's shots went right between the PVCs because of the reduced size and added mass. We kept rolling right over them....our bot is about 2 inches off the ground....

When we were there, 2 teams managed to hang...1 team took over 4 mins to do it tho, but #225 did it quite fast (1 min or so for the whole process), so they are a team to watch out for. There were many other teams that tried to hang, but either broke or just couldn't do it. From reports of the mourning session only 1 team managed to hang then.

About capping those big double point balls. Most teams had issues getting them. 1 team who used a suction cup jammed the ball all the way down into the mobile goal, another team with a giant metal bowl like suction cup managed to pick it up but held on only for about 2 secs. A few other teams tried to get it, but failed.

While we were there, a team tried that catch all the balls as they fall strategy...only once did they manage to catch more than 2/3 balls.

Our bot is a ball gatherer. We were way too fast (First round I hit the side gate and knocked it off lol, in the process getting our bot stuck on the side lip thing), and had ball control issues (being fixed tommorrow). Second round....we rammed a ball sooooo hard it flew out and hit some ppl in the crowd, lol. We also had some control issues...high speed turning was backwards (right was left, left was right). Even with these issues, we managed to gather a few balls each time, and with our good shooter we managed 35-50 points a couple of rounds.

For those at DC that might not remember who we are...we are the bot that start standing and then proceed to fall over...

[Elgin Clock]

Originally Posted by Ogre

No. There were a few teams that went up the 6" step, but it was much slower than the tiny stairs. Ther were also alot of teams that attempted going up the 6" step but didn't make it.

All the hanging bots had some sort of arm that extended up with a hook on the end. Like this and this. Both of those were on the platform when they reached for the bar.
There was one robot that tried reaching from the carpet (178). When then hooked the bar and started putting weight on their hook, it snapped off.

Thanks Ogre!!

[Tytus Gerrish]

In the Swamp shop 179 180 and 1251 got some full scale practice done. swampthing worked fine it caps and uncaps balls with no troubble. Spam had some control broblems, tho they blew us all away with their Holonomic Omni Drive. and 1251 got their Lasso device broken by swampthing and i helped them make an aluninum pice to make it work better.

GO TEAMS!!! I Had great Time An were All Glad you came

[robot180]

Originally Posted by Tytus Gerrish

In the Swamp shop 179 180 and 1251 got some full scale practice done. swampthing worked fine it caps and uncaps balls with no troubble. Spam had some control broblems, tho they blew us all away with their Holonomic Omni Drive. and 1251 got their Lasso device broken by swampthing and i helped them make an aluninum pice to make it work better.

GO TEAMS!!! I Had great Time An were All Glad you came

Thank you to team 179 for hosting that. It really helped us. We weren't really having control problems exactly; we just moved things by hand so that we could be there to stop or catch anything if it didn't work. The switches have been tested and work fine. The driving of the omni-directional drivetrain was a little crazy, but we tweaked it a bit. Most of the problems are getting used to driving the thing since it is very different than tank treads. Our drivers got a lot of practice on your field today and we think we got the science down, for now. Lets see if that is still true at UCF.

[tiffany34990]

yeah we had problems but we'll figure them out-- it's not a spam bot without a million problems

but thanks swampthing for letting us test!!! spam luvs u guys

[Robert Hafner]

Unfortunetly, the scrimmage ran behind due to field problems, so they stopped the matches and went the finals after the teams had only two matches. The teams who didn't get picked were kind of grr about that, understandably.


On a brighter note, my team managed to get both the lowest and highest score of the day!

[Ken Loyd]

Originally Posted by Joe3

I wasnt fortunate to make it to one of these scrimages today, as we just had too much to do on the robot. However, I was wondering how they went. In the past, they have shown significant insight into the game. So, if anyone can post some reflections on them, I think it would be a great help to all. Thanks.

Team 64 would like to thank the 10 teams from the Phoenix/Tucson area who came to our 7th Annual "Duel in the Desert". The action was much better than I expected with almost a week to go before shipping. Several teams were able to gain axcess to the platforms. Three teams were able to hang. No one used the IR beacon in auto mode, though a few teams said they were working on it. Most robots (even the rookies) showed exceptional speed. A few teams realized how top heavy they were (tipping over was not uncommon especially when carrying the big balls.) Many teams used the pneumatic tires. Special acknowledgement to Team 1011 for their "Swerve2" driving system.

What suprised me the most was how little time two minutes is when you are trying to accomplish just a few things in this years game.

Ken loyd
Team 64

[ReggieB]

The one in DC went well, except for the radio channel problem. They had to be set manually, and some couldn't get off the default channel.

There were at least two that did the big ball, and two that did the chinup. Here we are:http://www.mbhs.edu/~aajohnso/robo04...20(Medium).JPG
(bad lighting, fuzzy, but that is 449 haning)

We were able to just drive up the 6" step, but we also drive up balls, goals, robots, etc, so we need to do something about that (we came home and started fabricating). There was some big event there, which first was a small part of, so there wasnt much room and a lot of people.

[Rickertsen2]

Ok this is great and all, but what did you you learn about the dynamics of the game? Not to whine, but this thread has gotten a bit of topic, and us teams who weren't able to make it to a practice scrimish would really like some insight into things.

How big of a hazard were the small balls?
How did autonomous go?
How much contact was there?
What strategies were sucessful?
What strategies weren't?
Was hanging big?
How important were the smalls balls and the big balls?
What sorts of mehcanisms proved effective and inneffective?
What were the common characteristics of high scorign robots?
What were the biggest challenges for most bots?
How important was speed? Torque? Control?
Were alot of people able to get up the ramp?
.......... etc, etc, etc.....

[Tom Bottiglieri]

ok pretty much what it came down to was....

1) Gathering balls takes too much time and proved not to be worth it
2)who ever hangs wins

then again, most teams didnt have new bots or didnt have their new ones worked out, so we still have to wait and see

[Gui Cavalcanti]

At DC I pretty much got the impression that the balls are actually very small, cuddly landmines. When all of them are dumped, all hell breaks loose on the playing field. It doesn't matter if you have a little ground clearance or a lot of ground clearance, you start riding up on balls simply because they're so grippy on aluminum. Teams were being dissuaded from hanging or grabbing yellow balls simply because a little red ball was smack dab in their way. This has gotten so bad that I've told my autonomous guys to work out a "ball-bocker" program that doesn't allow the bonus point balls to be hit!

Hanging looks to be the major issue. Teams simply couldn't pick up the yellow multiplier balls (thought that has to do with the fact that the balls weren't exactly to spec), and very few could hang. Those that could hang generally went from the very top platform. Very few teams at DC were doing much of anything.

Nobody at DC had an autonomous, and it didn't seem to matter.

[Robert Hafner]

How did autonomous go?
Although some teams had a semi-working autonomous mode, most didn't have anything yet.

How much contact was there?
meh, not too much, especially compared to previous years.

What strategies were sucessful?
if you can shoot, and you can hang, you can win.

What strategies weren't?
pushing balls wasn't as big as I though it would be.

Was hanging big?
Oh yeah. When my team hung, we won (haighest score of the day! w00t!). Those 50 points add up.

How important were the smalls balls and the big balls?
Not as much as I thought, but still very important, particularly the small.

What sorts of mehcanisms proved effective and inneffective?
lots of the big ball grabbers weren't working right (ours wasn't even attached yet) however I think it'll have to wait until the first regionals.

What were the common characteristics of high scorign robots?
hang, climb, and not break.

What were the biggest challenges for most bots?
Getting the robot to work. Not many autonomous modes worked, and there was a lot of unfinished robots.

How important was speed? Torque? Control?
I guess it all depends on the strategy involved. Balls were everywhere, so speed wasn't a big deal there because you didn't really have to fight for them. Most robots kept to their own side.

Were alot of people able to get up the ramp?
I didn't see that many doing it.


One thing that I noticed that was majorly different from last year was the penalty system. It killed a lot of teams (we were penalized for part of our robot entering the corral, buzz had part of its bot out of the field and was penalized, lots of teams got into some trouble)




My team will be putting up information for individual teams (with their permission, of course) that we gathered at the scrimmage on our website (http://www.team96.org is the main site, and out scouting database is http://www.team96.org/scouting/) and some teams have already registered and put their information up themselves. It;ll give you a better idea about what other teams are doing.

[rswsmay]

Originally Posted by Rickertsen2

Ok this is great and all, but what did you you learn about the dynamics of the game? Not to whine, but this thread has gotten a bit of topic, and us teams who weren't able to make it to a practice scrimish would really like some insight into things.

How big of a hazard were the small balls?
How did autonomous go?
How much contact was there?
What strategies were sucessful?
What strategies weren't?
Was hanging big?
How important were the smalls balls and the big balls?
What sorts of mehcanisms proved effective and inneffective?
What were the common characteristics of high scorign robots?
What were the biggest challenges for most bots?
How important was speed? Torque? Control?
Were alot of people able to get up the ramp?
.......... etc, etc, etc.....

Well we attended the Peachtree regional at SciTrek this past Saturday. We along with the majority of teams there had their share of mechanical problems, but we thought it well worth the trip out to see our defiencies on a playing field.

1. Small balls were no hazard.... not sure what hazards you might be thinking of other that maybe excessive bouncing around the field or maybe a bot running over one.

2. The scrimmage was not setup to replicate the conditions conducive to good autonomous operation, but several teams did take a stab at it. I don't believe anyone was able to effectively track the line, or IR beacon.

3. As it turned out, there wasn't very much contact for the bots that made it to the field. Most ended up concentrationg on doing their own thing. The majority of contact was made between bots and walls, bots and platforms, bots and the floor, bots and mobile goals, etc.

4. I believe that the key question is which bots were successful in their strategy, as a consequence of a good design and implementation. There were some that were built primarily to herd the balls, others that went straight for the bar, one that focused on manipulating the 2X ball, and one that was very good at grabbing the mobile goal and ball herding. All could be effective given the complexity and dynamics of the game.

5. The converse holds true for ineffective strategies. For us, we never got a fully trial of our strategy since we were one amongs the many that had mechanical problems. We did manage one scrimmage round where we fielded 4 of the 10 pt balls. However our competitors managed 1 of the 10 pt balls plus hung from the bar for 60 points. It will pay to scout out the strengths and weaknesses of your opponents to be flexible in your competitions strategy.

6. Out of the approx 8 bots there, about 3 had mechanisms to do bar hanging, but only one did it at all and did it more than once.

7. Big balls are only as effective as the small balls in the goal. 2x ball times zero small balls is still zero.

8. For us our 4 wheel drive train was modified when we returned from the scrimmage. Too much side friction to over come, so we have the pneumatic tires for drive on the rear and casters on the front now. (All that wasted time ). One team had similar problems with treads, the side friction was causing their treads to disengage. I was surprised to NOT see an effective ball hearding design, including ours. It was good to see however that the use of pneumatics was good for most teams.

9. Too few functional bots at the time and too few scrimmage sessions to make the determination as to common characteristics of high scoring bots.

10. Biggest challenge was manuvering/negoating the field to get up on the platform, or grab the mobile goal, or herd those rubbery/bouncy balls to the corral.

11. A good balance of speed and torque is always good. Of course if your goal is to heard the 10 pt balls, you can't do that with too much speed. They go all over the place. I would give up some speed and torque to get better control for our strategy.

12. Ramp...? What ramp...LOL. No need to get up the platform unless you plan to hang from the bar, or block another bot from hanging from the bar. I guess if a 10 pt ball ended up there you could be going after that, but most remained on the main playing field since their strategy required that.

Hope that helps...... We missed you guys at the regional. See ya on the 18th - 20th.

[KevinB]

Originally Posted by Rickertsen2

Ok this is great and all, but what did you you learn about the dynamics of the game? Not to whine, but this thread has gotten a bit of topic, and us teams who weren't able to make it to a practice scrimish would really like some insight into things.

Rickertson, Why didn't you guys come to the Georgia Tech-hosted scrimmage at Scitrek? It was loads of fun.