fundraising and beer companies

[Pierson]

Originally Posted by Stephen Kowski

not necessarily....look above and read my discussion on the genetic engineering of the blue agave....there are other examples, but i do not have time/energy enough to find them all....i guess if you would like to get technical in this example it is a distillery, but I am considering them one in the same.....

I recently went on a tour of UPS's West Coast Air Hub in Ontario, California. Conventional logic would say, "UPS only has package sorters at their facilities." Not true, they have a full time industrial engineering division at each major facility across the United States. Their mission is to increase efficiency within the facility and on everything originating from that facility. I would think that breweries and bottling companies would operate on the same concept of continuous improvement.

Just some food for thought...

--Pierson

[nobrakes8]

Originally Posted by richardp

Its a hard choice. While their is nothing against it, that is the current situation. This might happen although I doubt it I would not want to be the team that makes FIRST create a ruling against sponsors. Also casinos in Las Vegas sponsor teams out their so I think you will be OK.

It's a touchy issue with people. Some people are annoyed that our school has coke machines and have major problems that we have Coca-Cola logos all over our gym because of obesity (can't spell), so I bet you'll have a hard time gaining support from parents and stuff about a brewery.

The reason why I quoted the vegas message, how many times during school do we (students) play cards for money or roll dice? Look at the NCAA bracket, the teachers have their secret tourny pools, and the students have their own as well, thats gambleing and it has gotten some of my friends in trouble financially.

I mean if they allow casinos to sponsor teams anybody could argue that they lead to gambleing when in reality haveing a casino on the side of your robot probably won't influence anybody to gamble if they don't want to.

Drinking is the same way, just because we see Dale Earnhardt Jr. driving a budweiser car or thinking the taste loss commericals are funny, that dosen't mean we're going to drink. The #1 thing about teenagers is, most of us choose on our own or to peer preasure to drink and smoke, not advertiseing, and when kids do that stuff, they go for the cheapest stuff they can buy, not the sponsor of a robot or their favorite nascar driver or anything like that.

If FIRST and your school OK it, as a student I really wouldn't care, and I don't think it would lead anybody to drinking just beacuse we saw some kids with Bud logos on their shirts.

[KenWittlief]

make no mistake, advertising works. Its a billion dollar industry and the cost and returns are carefully measured

you may think it doenst 'work' on you, but you would be surprized. I know we all laught at commericials and advertisement, thinking the companys are throwing their money away. Believe me, companys dont give ANY money away unless they are getting the results they expect.

I think of casinos as an entertainment industry. You go there with money in your pocket, have a good time, and if by some chance you still have money left when you get home thats all the better.

Ive spent tons of money at WDW, and always came home with empty pockets, but I expect that.

some people have gambling problems, but you could say that about any industry.

[Kevin Sevcik]

I think the real point here is that a beer company might be sponsoring a team for the exact same reason that NASA and Lockheed and others do. These companies have no products to sell to the public, they're just interested in encouraging kids to be engineers or to go to college and be something.

First off, engineers most certainly work at a brewery full time. There's a awful heck of a lot of mechanical equipment there, and someone has plan maintenence schedules, decide when to replace things, analyze process data for any excursions, etc. Breweries aren't that much different from chemical plants. The only difference is that you can drink the stuff that comes out of breweries.

Secondly, FIRST isn't just about engineering. I've seen quite a few students come out of our chairman's award team with a healthy interest in business. There's even an entreprenuership award. And beer companies certainly need business people.

So, I think a beer company sponsoring a team is only a problem if the company is advertising beer. A Bud Light logo on the side of a robot is bad. An Anheuser-Busch logo probably wouldn't be.

[David Kelso]

Our team has discussed this issue too and we decided to leave it alone. We considered the TYPE of ad. I feel there would be far less of an issue if the ad said something like "drink responsibly" or your robot could have "Don't Drink and Drive" with the beer companies name below it.

[Chris Fultz]

We could not do it - the school rules would not allow any type of endorsement from an alcohol or tobacco company. I agree with the restriction.

[Peter Matteson]

Originally Posted by KenWittlief

Engineers are involved in the design of modern breweries, but I would be very surprized to find any engineers on full time staff.

Fun Fact:
Wachusett brewery in Mass. was founded and is run by a group of WPI engineering alumni.

My personal feeling is that alcohol should not be a sponsor of FIRST. It is not in the spirit of the competition. We here in CT have the ability to solicit many alcohol importers like Hueblien, (pronounced hugh-bline) that are based here. I feel that getting sponsorship from them is not right because you are not accurately saying the type of advertising you will provide. Distributors are a grey area because many alcohol distributors also sell candy, and tobacco. The easy way around this is just don't solicit them. They may have money, but the real question is do you feel right about taking it?

[Kevin Kolodziej]

I have had the same dilemma here in Milwaukee. We have Miller Brewery right here, but is it right to go after them for sponsorship? They do sell more than just beer (their root beer is great....too bad its not available around here ), but the beer is what they are known for.

On the other hand, there is the Sprecher Brewery that also does both beer and root beer (and some other types of soda). Some people know them for one while others know them for the other. I didn't know they did beer until recently...I thought the root beer was it.

Either way, I'm not sure what the school policies are around here and I've never looked into it. Even though the 1064 team's motto was BREW (Better Robots Engineering Wisely) we never even discussed getting a brewery as a sponsor.

Its one issue that I'd rather just not touch.

[Mark Pettit]

As a coach at a private school, I'm quite certain that I would have my administration's support if I could secure a sponsorship from a beer company.
Public schools, though, would likely have a problem with a Bud (or other) logo on your team's shirt or robot.
I'm under the assumption that the school entity, not FIRST, would be the deciding factor.
NASCAR recently started allowing hard-liquor sponsorships on race cars. Previous to this season, these were not allowed because (obviously) the combination of drinking and driving doesn't seem to work. Sponsorships for teams are increasingly hard to come by, even at that level. This past off-season, there were enough teams that had potential sponsorships from companies like Jack Daniels and Smirnoff that NASCAR had to re-visit the issue and, in the end, the sponsorships were approved.
I don't think that FIRST should disallow these adult-oriented sponsorships. These decisions should be left up to the school system.

[Kevin Sevcik]

I submit the following link for the consideration of the masses:
A-B 2003 Contributions

A few orgs that I note on that list: Big Brothers/Big Sisters, Boys Club of St. Louis, Girl Scout Council of Greater St. Louis, Herbert Hoover Boys and Girls Club, Logos School, Boy Scouts of America.... The list goes on for quite a way and I kind of got tired of typing. It's pretty darn impressive, though.

I submit that if their money is good enough for the Boy Scouts, it's probably good enough for us.

EDIT: For those interested - A-B Corporate Contribution Guidelines

EDIT2: I'll stop researching after this: Miller Brewing Contributions in and around Milwaukee. Of note: St. Coletta School, St. Joeseph High School.

[KenWittlief]

no one is doubting these companys make dontations to many good charities and other community service projects

sponsoring a FIRST team is different. Would the students be working on-site inside the brewery, like many other sponsor companys allow students into their facilities?

[Kyle]

Originally Posted by KenWittlief

no one is doubting these companys make dontations to many good charities and other community service projects

sponsoring a FIRST team is different. Would the students be working on-site inside the brewery, like many other sponsor companys allow students into their facilities?

Since when did brewery's have a machine shop? Also if you have ever been to a brewery you might notice that the huge tanks that the beer is distilled and made in don't have taps for people to walk by and drink from, so working in a brewery would be like anywhere else. I really don't think that the kids if they ever did build there would be allowed anywhere near those areas anyway.

[Kevin Sevcik]

Yes, the original post was concerned with legal issues surrounding being sponsored by beer companies. I think it's obvious someone with such concerns would make sure the team wasn't getting in-kind donations or something. Just money and mentor support. I think the issue is fundamentally an issue for the team and the school to decide. I don't think FIRST has any business deciding who can be sponsors.

I think the most productive course would be to approach the principal and ask him/her. And make sure you note that it's the brewing company that will be funding the team in the interests of engineering education. Not the beer brand in the interests of advertising.