[Official 2006 Game Design] Game Elements and Subtasks

[EricH]

Here's an unusual idea (not that there aren't too many already): a POWERED field element. For example: one goal of some form wanders around the field on one of several paths. Teams get twice the score for any object placed on it that they do for anywhere else. However, it also acts as an interference bot against both alliances, only depending on who is in the way. Another example: a swinging gate of some form that you have to wait for.

The problems: the main one is that FIRST would have to design this element, give it power (which means either extension cords (for the gate) or a large supply of batteries (for anything mobile)), and program it. Then again, it would add at least one level of difficulty to the game.

[Kyle Love]

Heres my off the wall idea. Use tires or something like the "LIVE strong" and "VEX" wristbands just on a bigger scale, and make square or rectangular goals in the center that are elevated 7 and 10 feet off the ground. (3 goals, 2 7feet 1 10feet in the center) Have a 2 foot tall gap under the goals so teams could go under the bridge. Have 5foot tall goals at the red and blue alliance home zones. Still have it 3vs3. 1 Autoloader per alliance and have a suspened "tire" hanging on a hook on the side of the field with a green panel in the center (similar to this years vision tetra) for the CMU. Also, have a human player area with a 3'x3' box on both sides to distingush the "loading zone".

My paint drawings can be found here

-KL

[sanddrag]

I like the idea of using tires for a gamepiece. The shape would make them easy to put on a pole or something, but the weight would make it very challenging to maniupluate. I'm thinking along the lines of something like a small car spare tire or a small trailer tire. Also, they are very durable. Almost no chance of breaking. But they might be a little pricey. Used or reject tires maybe?

Or maybe part of the playing surface can be covered in tires like this http://www.eddabney.com/confidence_c.../Dan_tires.jpg but no horse and smaller tires.

[Ryan Foley]

Originally Posted by sanddrag

I like the idea of using tires for a gamepiece. The shape would make them easy to put on a pole or something, but the weight would make it very challenging to maniupluate. I'm thinking along the lines of something like a small car spare tire or a small trailer tire. Also, they are very durable. Almost no chance of breaking. But they might be a little pricey. Used or reject tires maybe?

Or maybe part of the playing surface can be covered in tires like this http://www.eddabney.com/confidence_c.../Dan_tires.jpg but no horse and smaller tires.

Check out the 1997 robots, they had inner tubes that year. 111 in particular had a very cool way of picking them up.

I love the idea of all or part of the field being covered in tires. That would make a great all-terrain style element, however, teams with very good drivers could avoid the holes and only have to worry about getting onto the tires and riding the edges. A lot more tank tread robots would appear I imagine.

If you want to be really evil however, make a wall of tires standing upright. I would love to see a robot try to fit through the hole in the center.

[sanddrag]

Originally Posted by Ryan Foley

If you want to be really evil however, make a wall of tires standing upright. I would love to see a robot try to fit through the hole in the center.

Or maybe even better yet, make some sort of mound of tires (attached/connected/rigid/stable) that you can climb to the top of in order to get points. I'm still a big fan of kind of the hill. We just need a more interesting hill.

[sanddrag]

What about a midfield barrier of large proportions. Maybe like 5-10 ft high but not quite vertical, maybe like 70 degrees referenced from the horizonal (on both sides, so it would look like this /\ ) And then there could be some sort of horizontal bars on it (like rungs of a latter almost) for helping to get over it. And maybe there could be a bar high above it to winch off of or something.

You'd have to have an alternate option of getting to the other side of the field but it can't be too easy because then people wouldn't do this. There must be great scoring incentive for scaling this wall and getting back down to the other side.

[Ryan Foley]

Here's an interesting idea for a midfield barrier.

Place a 2ft diameter pipe on it's side, spanning the width of the field. For robot scoring, robots would have to climb on top and not be supported by anything but the pipe.

Options:
1) fixed pipe on ground
2) freely rotating pipe (about an axle of course) only raised enough off the ground so it doesnt contact the carpet. Some interesting defense could be played if teams could get on top and then start using their wheels to spin the pipe. Log rolling competition anyone?*
3) Cut out some parts of the pipe, so that there are tunnels leading to the other side.
4) raise the pipe off the ground (perhaps a smaller diameter, like 1ft or 1.5ft would be better if this was done). Imagine the 2001 or 2003 limbo bar, just a lot bigger.
5) put another one (same diameter) at least 8 feet above the first one. Then teams could hang off that one for points, climb on the bottom one for more points, or use the the higer one to pull them up and onto the bottom one.

Interesting Combinations of options mentioned above:
A) 1 and 3
B) 2 and 3 (it would almost be like something out of mini-golf, could be fun)
C) 2 and 4
D) 2, 3 and 4. The clearance under the pipe could be 8inches, and under on of the holes could be 16in, that way you dont have to be less than 8in to get under.

*= I'm not suggesting anything about water when I say "log rolling"


PS: this midfield barrier also keeps the piggy-back robot option that seems to be applicable to every game since 2001 in some way. Check out 111's 2001 robot if you don't know what I mean by "piggy back robot"

[Kyle Love]

Bike tires! Then you can stack TONS at one time!

[sanddrag]

Originally Posted by Kyle45

Bike tires! Then you can stack TONS at one time!

Great idea. Those would be great scoring objects. Light enough to handle yet large enough to be exciting.

[Billfred]

Proof that you get inspiration from robots slugging their brains out as well...

Anyone who watches Robot Wars is familiar with the technique to open the pit (a robot, competitor or house, hits a switch made of a tire and a panel, triggering the pit to open). Suppose that a similar device on a FIRST field enabled a device to release a more valuable object.

To apply the example to a prior FIRST game, suppose that beside the ball dump in FIRST Frenzy was a small side chute, containing the mythical 25-point ball. This ball would only be released if a button on the field were held down for a given amount of time (say, ten seconds). Ten seconds is a really significant amount of time in a two-minute match, so teams would have to decide whether going for the more potent ball was worth the time investment. Especially if, in this scenario, their human player was shaky.

[JP_1163]

I see robots walking. I see them stepping over objects of varying heights and widths to reach a goal. I see robots manipulating objects and then returning to their originating spot. I see robots engaged in cooperative ventures where the sum of the parts is greater than the whole. I see robots that don't bash and crash but work together to complete a complex task requiring all partners to work in concert to achieve their goal. I see the scoring based on the number of successful tasks completed within a 2 minute period.......

Wait......wait...... sorry crystal ball is on break......

[anna~marie]

when do we get our clue?

[Billfred]

Originally Posted by anna~marie

when do we get our clue?

Traditionally, the hint goes out a week or so before Kickoff.

[phrontist]

Originally Posted by Billfred

Traditionally, the hint goes out a week or so before Kickoff.

Traditionally, everything Dave says is a hint, but no one has any clue what the game will be.

[Billfred]

Probably tremendously late, but imagine the following.

Suppose that there were some objective that you want to happen for your alliance, and you don't want it to happen for your opponents. However, neither of you want it to happen to nobody.

As an example, imagine there was a goal from Zone Zeal at midfield. In autonomous, robots would attempt to displace this goal from the middle of the field, bringing it back to their side of the field. If an alliance succeeds, a randomly-selected robot on the other alliance is disabled for ten seconds. If neither alliance does it, a randomly-selected robot on both sides is disabled for ten seconds. Nobody wants to have their power robot disabled, right?

(If this actually makes it into the game, I apologize. )