Prove yourself about a water game

[John Gutmann]

So for a while now I have noticed alot of people talking and joking around about a water theme game in the upcoming season. Now my question is, how would you design your robot? A couple things to think about are, manuverability, pushing match w/ another robot, and if it will beable to go under water. This is all i have right now for things to think about(or all that i could remember, ADD) if you hasve anything else please add.

[Veselin Kolev]

It all depends on if you have to go UNDER water, or your robot can just be like a boat. Maybe there will be some sort of underwater aspect, that if your robot is totally submerged by the end of the round you get 25 points or something along those lines.


If you only need a boat robot, I would make it out of fiberglass. Carve a big piece of styrofoam, coat it with fiberglass, remove foam, bingo, you have a shell. I would make it about 1/8" to 1/4" thick. The reinforce that with aluminum beams so you can ram people . But then bad times if you ever get flipped over and sink, electronics would go nuts. You could just make the robot like a boat with a sealed top, so it can flip over and still work, kindof like having two boats glued together. But then you need to worry about how to get inside it, how to seal everything, how you're gonna drive yourself... etc. I think it would be major problems for rookies.

As for underwater... not too hard actually. Just need to waterproof the electronics. Otherwise you would have a regular frame, welded aluminum, and fans to power your directions. The tricky part would be to figure out how much boyancy you need to stay at a constant depth. After that, its fun and games.

As for my opinion on which we should have, I say underwater. If you make a boat robot and it sinks, you will not be very happy. Especially if it keeps sinking, every round. But I think people could pull off some really cool themes with boat robots, like have an aircraft carrier or a floating car robot. The change itself to a water arena would be awesome, but I dont think its practical for FIRST. My $.02.

[John Gutmann]

yea I about the boat i would do that same thing, I do that for making exotic speaker boxes for my friends cars, it is the best way i have found for making weird shapes.

One thing I would be concerned with is to find somewhere to test an under water bot.

[mechanicalbrain]

You know last month I went to an aquarium and I spent a bunch of time looking at the mammals (dolphins, sea otters, and sea lions) and all i could think of was "Good god thats fast" after seeing that video I posted on the robotic fish I think it would definitely be the way to go. It seems to me that you get superior speed and maneuverability at high speed. I made a design for a underwater robot and its three on my things to do list.

[Eugenia Gabrielov]

I think it would be feasible to have a game component that's try, and a game component in water, such as a pool in the middle of the field with a retrievable prize.

This combo of wet and dry would allow rookie teams who prefer to start dry to succeed, but also let all teams stretch out their technique to test material durability, balance, etc.

A robot that could swim could easily gaurd the pool.

[John Gutmann]

Originally Posted by mechanicalbrain

You know last month I went to an aquarium and I spent a bunch of time looking at the mammals (dolphins, sea otters, and sea lions) and all i could think of was "Good god thats fast" after seeing that video I posted on the robotic fish I think it would definitely be the way to go. It seems to me that you get superior speed and maneuverability at high speed. I made a design for a underwater robot and its three on my things to do list.

wow as i was read that I had an awesome propulsion idea, if you have something shaped like a fish but simpler like an ellipsoid or a extruded ellipse it would make it fast(hopefully). You would just have like a pneumatic cylinder that would move back and forth, but on the cylinder you would have a fin type thing that would hing only like 90 degrees. Now when the pneumatic cylinder pushes forward it would go along the body and be flat(no drag) but when it pulls it would hing out from the water an hopefully pull the fish.

I an uncertain whether it would work good or not, but it would be worth a try because the same type of things work with fish(I think, I am no marine biologist)

[Andrew Blair]

Ohh man......I just wonder what magic smoke looks like underwater...... Or maybe underwater inside a watertight polycarb shell ..........

[Alan Anderson]

Originally Posted by sparksandtabs

wow as i was read that I had an awesome propulsion idea, if you have something shaped like a fish but simpler like an ellipsoid or a extruded ellipse it would make it fast(hopefully). You would just have like a pneumatic cylinder that would move back and forth, but on the cylinder you would have a fin type thing that would hing only like 90 degrees. Now when the pneumatic cylinder pushes forward it would go along the body and be flat(no drag) but when it pulls it would hing out from the water an hopefully pull the fish.

It'll work, but it won't be particularly fast compared to other methods. It would be the water-propulsion equivalent of walking, where a flapping tail is more like roller skates. For efficient speed, you actually want to apply motion sideways to the direction of motion, using something like a wing or propeller, rather than simply pulling the water past. That's why fish propel themselves using a back-and-forth motion of their tail.

The other option is the equivalent of jet propulsion, which is used by squids.

[JoeXIII'007]

Originally Posted by Andrew Blair

Ohh man......I just wonder what magic smoke looks like underwater...... Or maybe underwater inside a watertight polycarb shell ..........

If the motor gets hot enough, it could boil the nearby water and cause steam to rise. So I wouldn't expect to see magic smoke, but I would expect the packagers of the motors to include bubbles in the packaging. No pun intended.

On to the Watergame Debate, it probably won't happen. IF it does, I'm going to be researching the design of that one water racer that was on TechTVs Techno Games. All I remember is that it had a real smooth black shell and on the inside it had an ultra fast flipper system that churned the water real well and propelled it to first place. Whether or not the rest of my team would like the idea is still a question to be answered.

[John Gutmann]

Originally Posted by JoeXIII'007

If the motor gets hot enough, it could boil the nearby water and cause steam to rise. So I wouldn't expect to see magic smoke, but I would expect the packagers of the motors to include bubbles in the packaging. No pun intended.

On to the Watergame Debate, it probably won't happen. IF it does, I'm going to be researching the design of that one water racer that was on TechTVs Techno Games. All I remember is that it had a real smooth black shell and on the inside it had an ultra fast flipper system that churned the water real well and propelled it to first place. Whether or not the rest of my team would like the idea is still a question to be answered.

I too doubt the water game to happen, but I just made this whole thread to generate more ideas and so i can have more stuff to day dream about in enligh and us history/government

Also partly on the whole "all talk and no walk" thing, because people always say they want one, but i wanna see what they will do when/if it gets thrown at them

[Denman]

if it was underwater, i would agree in building a light frame and then some pc fans or something to power it around. if you had a few on the top bottom sides and front / back , you could program it such that to turn left you turn one back fan on on the opposite side etc
if anyone has made a flying hovercraft in garrys mod for hl2 you will know what i mean, and there is a good tutorial on the garrys mod wiki.

[John Gutmann]

Originally Posted by Denman

if it was underwater, i would agree in building a light frame and then some pc fans or something to power it around. if you had a few on the top bottom sides and front / back , you could program it such that to turn left you turn one back fan on on the opposite side etc
if anyone has made a flying hovercraft in garrys mod for hl2 you will know what i mean, and there is a good tutorial on the garrys mod wiki.

I don't see how you could use pc fans because they are not water tight, water would get into the motor itself.

i have never tryed it but i am sure it would work, and please correct me if I am wrong.

[Denman]

Originally Posted by sparksandtabs

I don't see how you could use pc fans because they are not water tight, water would get into the motor itself.

i have never tryed it but i am sure it would work, and please correct me if I am wrong.

i meant that sort of thing, obviously pc fans arn't watertight but i meant the whole fan idea

[Andrew Blair]

Argh, watertight will be the biggest issue, because if you misplace the seal in just one between match checkup, you're screwed.

As a side note, how would you get a bot from the bottom of the tank after it sinks, then proceeds to fill with water? Haha, ditch the ifi guys at the competitions, we'll need a dive team!

[tiffany34990]

Originally Posted by sparksandtabs

One thing I would be concerned with is to find somewhere to test an under water bot.

i guess being in Florida helps... pool??? just not so heavily filled w/ chemicals...

all wellz...i remember when i was younger there was a toy that you could build stuff that could be played in water..but i don't believe it was to go underwater just on the surface..the motors and stuff were in plastic cylinders. (sorry my memory escapes me right now)

in my opinion think how subs work and how they are constructed..and of course looking at elements of dynamics to propel through the water like a torpedo..and would there be currents to add?

the world of water opens up great questions... i wouldn't be surprise if it is something later on but not now... one place still that is being explored besides space is the oceans..

well that's just some of my 2 cents on this matter...

happy thinking y'all..