2006 NJ Regional

[Mark McLeod]

Full resolution of the Finals and Semifinals have been uploaded. The files are 37-45MB and compressed somewhat.
http://team358.org/history/2006/videos/NJ_Regional/

[Elgin Clock]

Originally Posted by Mark McLeod

Full resolution of the Finals and Semifinals have been uploaded. The files are 37-45MB and compressed somewhat.
http://team358.org/history/2006/videos/NJ_Regional/

Any possibility of offering (even a really low quality) windows media version of the match vids?

[Mark McLeod]

Originally Posted by Elgin Clock

Any possibility of offering (even a really low quality) windows media version of the match vids?

I just have to crank them through Adobe Premere I suppose.
Any in particular you're most interested in?
I don't have a lot of spare time, since we're getting ready to visit you guys in Hartford on Thursday.

P.S. According to Premere it's going to take 2 hours to convert just one of the full resolution Finals videos. I'll try one of the low-res files first (~20 mins).

PPS: That's odd, I cannot seem to view wmv files. As a test I also downloaded other peoples posted wmv videos and I only get a black screen with audio.

[JoeCallahan]

Originally Posted by Mark McLeod

Full resolution of the Finals and Semifinals have been uploaded. The files are 37-45MB and compressed somewhat.
http://team358.org/history/2006/videos/NJ_Regional/

Finally someone hosting the first finals match =p Thanks

[Spikey]

Thanks for posting the videos! Of one concern I saw the video of 25 pushing SPIKE(293) over! SF 1-1 My goodness I am surprised they did not get a penalty! In the video 293 and 25 are fighting each other, 25 almost tips over during the pushing fight, but 293 backs off and lets them balance, but it appears that 293 moved back so quickly that 293 tipped up and 25 drove under them. Then from the video it looks like 25 does not back off and let 293 balance, but they continue to drive forward and push 293 over! They were under 293 for a good 3 seconds why did they not back off and let 293 balance like 293 did when 25 was tipped? Not very nice in my opinion..

[Koko Ed]

Originally Posted by Spikey

Thanks for posting the videos! Of one concern I saw the video of 25 pushing SPIKE(293) over! SF 1-1 My goodness I am surprised they did not get a penalty! In the video 293 and 25 are fighting each other, 25 almost tips over during the pushing fight, but 293 backs off and lets them balance, but it appears that 293 moved back so quickly that 293 tipped up and 25 drove under them. Then from the video it looks like 25 does not back off and let 293 balance, but they continue to drive forward and push 293 over! They were under 293 for a good 3 seconds why did they not back off and let 293 balance like 293 did when 25 was tipped? Not very nice in my opinion..

Personally I think 293 blew and should have finished them off quickly. You don't let a robot like that off the hook.

[Spikey]

Originally Posted by Koko Ed

Personally I think 293 blew and should have finished them off quickly. You don't let a robot like that off the hook.

Excuse me???? Are you suggesting that we play dirty and push 25 over, thats not very GP at all...

[Koko Ed]

Originally Posted by Spikey

Excuse me???? Are you suggesting that we play dirty and push 25 over, thats not very GP at all...

Are you kidding me?
Have you ever noticed that the play gets more physical in the tourney? It was that way in Stack Attack. It was that way in FIRST Frenzy: Raising the Bar and it was that way last year.
You cannot be that naive to think that people are going to just back up and leave you alone especially Raider Robotics. You want to label them Graciously Unprofessional? Go ahead, it's a free country but I guess the refs didn't see it that way and their opinions the one that counts!

[Spikey]

Originally Posted by Koko Ed

Are you kidding me?
Have you ever noticed that the play gets more physical in the tourney? It was that way in Stack Attack. It was that way in FIRST Frenzy: Raising the Bar and it was that way last year.
You cannot be that naive to think that people are going to just back up and leave you alone especially Raider Robotics. You want to label them Graciously Unprofessional? Go ahead, it's a free country but I guess the refs didn't see it that way and their opinions the one that counts!

Excuse me sir, but you read my comment the wrong way. I said it would BE UN GP IF WE FLIPPED THEM.....

I never accused them of playing unfairly, yes they do have a history of pushing other teams over, that should not excuse pushing us over. Yes I understand the game is physical and robots will fall over, but if pushing robots over is fine then I point to last years Philly regional in the finals where a robot was flipped and the whole alliance got DQ'd.

For a forum that touts the holiness of Gracious Professionalism I am amazed at your comments. Of course its a free country, but FIRST has rules, and refs, sure they did not call the play, but that still does not make it right. I happen to know the head ref, he is a stand up guy, if he did not make the call that is fine, all I am saying is that there is a point to which pushing is fine.

By your reasoning we should have pushed 25 over, and not just once, at every chance we get, now what kind of response would that get here? People would be screaming how UN GP it was that we pushed them over, and how we played dirty.

[Wayne C.]

Originally Posted by Spikey

Excuse me???? Are you suggesting that we play dirty and push 25 over, thats not very GP at all...

"I never accused them of playing unfairly, yes they do have a history of pushing other teams over, that should not excuse pushing us over."

Time to put an end to this now. If there is a problem with the performance of my team then have the decency to take it to my face and not flame them here on CD. The implications of the above statements are very clear. As for our "history", who are you to judge?

This game is not a science fair. Nobody is going to sit there and let you shoot at the goals and nobody is going to let you push them around without pushing back. Thats what the bumpers are for. Thats why you design a robot that is not easily tipped over. And you live with the design you build.

There was never any intention of our guys going out to knock over other robots. But frankly, a lot of them didn't need too much help to be tipped over. When we went over we recognized it was a part of the game. I've been watching the videos over and over and I see more robots repeatedly flying at us over and over rather than the opposite.

Time to drop the subject. Its over. Good luck with the rest of the season.

WC

[Spikey]

Originally Posted by Wayne C.

"I never accused them of playing unfairly, yes they do have a history of pushing other teams over, that should not excuse pushing us over."

Time to put an end to this now. If there is a problem with the performance of my team then have the decency to take it to my face and not flame them here on CD. The implications of the above statements are very clear. As for our "history", who are you to judge?

This game is not a science fair. Nobody is going to sit there and let you shoot at the goals and nobody is going to let you push them around without pushing back. Thats what the bumpers are for. Thats why you design a robot that is not easily tipped over. And you live with the design you build.

There was never any intention of our guys going out to knock over other robots. But frankly, a lot of them didn't need too much help to be tipped over. When we went over we recognized it was a part of the game. I've been watching the videos over and over and I see more robots repeatedly flying at us over and over rather than the opposite.

Time to drop the subject. Its over. Good luck with the rest of the season.

WC

Alright lets get a few things straight:
1. I did not attend the regional, I am reacting to video, I am at college
2. If I personally had an issue with what was at stake, yes I would spoken to someone directly, I can't do that when I am at college
3. I retract my statement about the "history of pushing" a bad reaction to a previous user comments
4. I am a 5 year veteran of FIRST, I have seen many competitions, if anyone thinks I am naive on the subject of pushing you are mistaken
5. I am not here to flame anyone, I am simply raising an issue that concerned me as a person who respects GP and competitive game play.
6. I had no intention whatsoever of labeling someone un-GP, if anyone thinks that or asserts that, they are putting false words in my mouth
7. If anyone wants to challenge my assertions or has questions and wants to see me in person I will be at the Annapolis Regional PM me

[George A.]

Let's just back away from our keyboards for a second and relax before someone does something that they're going to regret. Arguing on here does nothing, and won't get us anywhere.

Especially after the NJ regional thread from last year was locked because of bickering...I don't think that's a tradition that we should continue.

Let's be thankful that we actually have the opportinunity to compete in FIRST and reap its benefits to the best of our ability, instead of argue whether or not somehing is GP or not. We're all human, in the heat of competition things happen or are said that people wouldn't do under normal conditions.

Let's just forget it and look forward to the remaining weeks of competition.

[sw293]

I wasn't surprised to see no penalty there and I wouldn't have called one were I the ref. While intentionally tipping another robot ought to be grounds for some sort of penalty, I think a ref ought to be most conservative when making this call. If the ref has any reason to doubt the intent of the driver's actions, the best call is no call. I've been on the wrong end of an arbitrary disqualification in a final round match at a regional, and it's not a nice place to be.

The call made was the right one for the situation, and the only consistent one with the way the head ref at Trenton had called the matches not just throughout the competition but throughout the last three years. The Trenton Regional head ref should be congratulated for yet another job well done.

I cannot and will not speculate as to the intent of team 25's drivers during the match because that would be irresponsible. Unless they--and they alone--say otherwise, I will assume that they were playing clean and that the thought of intentionally tipping our robot over never crossed their minds. I can say with confidence that our driver saw that we were tipping 25 over and that he backed off in the interest of fair play and the spirit of gracious professionalism. While I am in no place whatsoever to condemn team 25's drivers, I think it is appropriate to commend team 293's driver for his actions and I would encourage others on this forum to do so rather than criticizing him for not "finishing off" the competition.

In summary, I think the video of that round shows a whole lot more what's right with FIRST (and the Trenton Regional) than what's wrong with FIRST.

[nuggetsyl]

ok guys i am team 25's drive team coach (I was on the feild) and i can tell you for a fact that 293 being knock to the ground was a suprise to us when it happened. We had no clue that they were on top of our robot when we went foward because not only were they in front our our robot when it happened another robot was between us and the drivers. What are the chances of you robot being on top of ours right after we were almost flipped. Our only goal was to get to the other side to score points.That is why we spent sooooooo much time loading up the hopper. Sorry to say but we are not going to waste time to play bumper cars with you when we can unload another 30 points and end the game.


shaun

[Rich Kressly]

thread closed
cool off, have a snack
we'll try again tomorrow
_____________________

OK, it's close enough to tomorrow. Thanks to all of you who responded so positively to PM comments! Please note that the overwhelming majority of posts in this 13 page thread celebrate the wonderful qualities and machines of the NJ Regional teams. For now, posts in this thread will remain unmoderated. Let's keep it that way.

Also, intent of overly-aggressive play is nearly impossible to prove, thus not worth talking about. After viewing all of the video, I must say it was as exciting as all of the finals I've seen there in person. Passionate, hard fought, and solid strategy.

A little food for thought as we reopen the thread:
-GP is something to apply to yourself and your own team. It's never a tool to judge others.
-Having someone make a spirited and possibily controversial post is nothing new. Answering such a post with comments that obviously irritate the situation while adding no real value to the thread, send it down the tubes in a hurry.
-Think twice, post once. We exist here to recognize and inspire while changing the culture for the better. Even if you worked your butt off and didn't "win", don't get caught up in the trash-talking mentality that pervades and degrades popular culture.
-Have fun and celebrate the special thing we have here called FIRST.