Are Chief Delphi users thin-skinned?

[anna~marie]

my first experience on Chief wasn't very encouraging at all because I posted something and I got 3 neg. rep things simply because I had accidently brought up a thread that hadn't been talked on in a while.

[Cody Carey]

Ok... Let me word this differently, for those of you who quoted me.


In REAL life, You make snap decisions... but those snap decisions are based on what YOU think... Not what hundreds of people before you thought and made known. I give myself reputation based on how I act towards one person. My facial expression and body language are part of it, but right now you have absolutely no idea what I look like. All you have to go by are my words... and what the people before you thought. Without my body language to referance, you could easily not be reading what I meant to write, and start reading what you feel I meant... largely based on my reputation. In my case, that is not an entirely bad thing, but in doug's case, everybody saw one green box and assumed, "hey, he's new, I'd better show him (with negative rep) that he shouldn't post things like this."

[Brandon Martus]

Originally Posted by Cody C

but in doug's case, everybody saw one green box and assumed, "hey, he's new, I'd better show him (with negative rep) that he shouldn't post things like this."

My opinion on this is .. you should give a neutral rep, PM, e-mail or instant message giving some kind of pointer/tip/explanation. Only after that, and some kind of reply, would it be ok (to me, at least) to dish out some negative rep. the next time it happens. I'd hope everybody would follow this, but it's not that important to make enforceable just yet ..

.. and they're just dots.

[KyleGilbert45]

Originally Posted by pyro20911d

Yesterday when making a post about rookie teams I got walked all over
What Does everyone think? After getting trampled and receiving -120 rep points i could use a little help

I think if you read the threads I PM'ed you then you would probably understand why some have given you negative rep. Just in case you didn't get them the first time, here they are:

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/announcement.php?f=16

If you start here, then you're off to a good start to understanding what is expected on these forums when you post.

[Rich Kressly]

Negative Rep may or may not be a good way to give feedback, but it's not a matter of being thin-skinned at all. Rude and insensitive comments about freshman, rookies, or any other group aren't tolerated, period.

In the popular culture of the US it has become way too easy and way too common for individuals to poke fun at or even taunt others. It's one thing to joke with an individual you know, but it's quite another to poke fun at groups of people, especially since our founder tells us every year to HELP start new rookie teams so more people can be a part of FIRST and feel welcome. I chose not to confront/post/PM/negative rep the thread the first time I read it, but I am a mentor of a rookie team. I left a very successful veteran team to start a new one. I believe that's what our founder and leaders wanted me to do and it was a change that I was ready for. I was and I still am offended that someone, even in jest, would suggest here that rookies and/or freshman have less value than others just because they are "new" or have different needs.

While the thread in question ( http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...?postid=450960 ) may have been an innocent mistake and a rain of negative rep may not have been the best way to get through to this one individual, everyone who posts on Chiefdelphi as a member of a FIRST team needs to understand something simple, yet difficult...

FIRST is about changing the popular culture. It's about coopertition, gracious professionalism, learning skills that will help us solve society's hardest problems, celebrating an inclusive way of advancing the culture. If you are here and are part of a FIRST team, then the assumption is that you understand this. Don't believe me? Ask Dean Kamen, Dr. Woodie Flowers, Dave Lavery (do you know the dollar figure NASA puts toward rookies every year on purpose?), the board of directors, FIRST HQ Staff, regional directors, senior mentors, ...

Different folks react differently to posts/threads that are in direct contrast to the mission and goals of FIRST. Some will PM. Some will post. Some will negative rep. Some will report posts to moderators. However, you can be assured that such behaviors will not be ignored, they will be confronted. While in many other places in our culture poor behavior will be let go, in FIRST it will be dealt with in one way or another.

Pyro, it's my sincere hope that you see this as a learning experience and move forward. While you might not like the way others handled their responses, you sure can admit that your thread did cast a negative light on both rookies and freshman. As far as I'm concerned, you have now had a chance to learn and understand the big picture. Let's move forward, more positively.

Namaste.

[Cory]

Originally Posted by pyro20911d

Yesterday when making a post about rookie teams I got walked all over


What Does everyone think? After getting trampled and receiving -120 rep points i could use a little help

I think you need to learn a bit about behaving yourself in public.

If you come on here and say "Do you hate rookies like you do freshmen? I know they don't all suck, but most do", you should be fully aware that many people will not like what you've said.

When you make comments like that, you make yourself and your team look stupid. If you want to talk with your friends about how much everyone sucks, feel free. But don't come on here and do it, where the whole goal is to make rookies/new people comfortable in a community where we can all share information.

[Cody Carey]

Originally Posted by Cory

I think you need to learn a bit about behaving yourself in public.

If you come on here and say "Do you hate rookies like you do freshmen? I know they don't all suck, but most do", you should be fully aware that many people will not like what you've said.

When you make comments like that, you make yourself and your team look stupid. If you want to talk with your friends about how much everyone sucks, feel free. But don't come on here and do it, where the whole goal is to make rookies/new people comfortable in a community where we can all share information.

OK... I don't know about you but because one person makes a mistake becaue he is new to a forum... I don't pass judgement on an entire team !!
I also don't appreciate the fact that in a passive way, you called both Pyro, and team 306 stupid. We people on chiefdelphi ARE SUPPOSED TO BE EACHOTHERS FRIENDS, and therefore we are supposed to be able to talk to eachother about subjects that don't really offend anyone. Also, Pyro is a rookie/ new person to this forum... Do you think that -120 rep points made hime feel comfortable or welcome???? No. I tried to help him, but my meager 13 positive rep points did absolutely nothing. As can be expected.

Aren't you glad that I didn't give you negative rep for posting something that I didn't like?

Remember, Being on this forum for a long time lets you learn not to post truly what you feel, but a watered down version of it so that you will not get flamed ( not exactly Right in my eys, by hey, Who cares right?)... Pyro hasn't learned this yet.

[meaubry]

Good question -
I'd have to say that some are and some are not.
Some just want to protect the integrity of the website.
Some just want to keep the threads topics above the flame wars and name calling level.
Some use the ability to negatively rep a poster to send a message.
Some have never used negative reps (me for one).
Every year someone (usually a rookie or trouble maker) gets slammed with negative rep after posting comments that match what we have warned everyone about (see the stickies all over the place???).

I have advocated on many occasions to reduce the number of forums - particularly the ones where the flame wars and troublesome posts usually turn up (Chit Chat, in particular) and I am continually reminded that the posts wouldn't go away - they would be posted on a different inappropriate forum. So, we leave the troublesome forums "out there".

Every year, we hope that the new visitors (not always rookies) read the advice that our long standing users have provided and take heed in the warnings about what and how to post (behave) in order to keep things operating smoothly.

Most of the time - it goes pretty well, but once in a while we have moderators that have to deal with issues.

I do understand the protective nature of the folks that want this site to be managed "within" and at a standard that their grandmother would be proud of - the mantra of a very smart person associated with FIRST. I'd like to think that we do everything we can to do just that.

In closing, I also recognize that "new folks" that may not be aware of "how it works" on this site might need a break for a short while until they read the sticky posts and get used to what the expected behavior is. So, I will inquire to our web master what it would take to modify the rep capability so as to limit the amount a person can get, based on the certain criteria (time as a registered member, number of posts, ect.)

I'm sorry that you got so many negative reps from that post about "freshman" - my advice is to try and make sure that what you post won't be taken as objectionable by others, and to keep using this website as a tool to improve your overall FIRST experience (it really can be a valuable resource if used properly).

Mike Aubry
Engineering Mentor Team 47

[Madison]

Originally Posted by Cody C

Remember, Being on this forum for a long time lets you learn not to post truly what you feel, but a watered down version of it so that you will not get flamed ( not exactly Right in my eys, by hey, Who cares right?)... Pyro hasn't learned this yet.

I've been on these forums since the second day they were live and used the old forums before that. I have not once posted a watered-down version of anything and I certainly don't go out of my way to placate people. If you take the time to construct intelligent, thoughtful arguments, there is nothing to 'flame', simply put.

Is ChiefDelphi too sensitive? We largely close threads that have no demonstrated useful purpose and did that here. In response, the original poster says that we need to toughen up and deal with things better? I think a quick glance into a mirror may be appropriate.

[Cody Carey]

NOTE: I didn't write this to make people angry, so please don't read it as though I did, I just wrote it to Try and show my opinion on some touchy matters




Quote:
Originally Posted by M. Krass
I've been on these forums since the second day they were live and used the old forums before that. I have not once posted a watered-down version of anything and I certainly don't go out of my way to placate people. If you take the time to construct intelligent, thoughtful arguments, there is nothing to 'flame', simply put.

Is ChiefDelphi too sensitive? We largely close threads that have no demonstrated useful purpose and did that here. In response, the original poster says that we need to toughen up and deal with things better? I think a quick glance into a mirror may be appropriate.






I have ... numerous times . Those of you who haven't had to do that haven't because you have been here since the beginning, People see eleven bars of positive rep and say to themselves "Wow, they are a tank, what can my 6 negative rep points do?". So you guys pretty much have nothing to fear on this forum.

I assure you that Doug (pyro) was not trying to aggravate anybody with that post, and he was in fact just trying to make friends in an unfamiliar place by posting a thread about a subject that he thought he would have similar opinions on as a lot of other people. This much is obvious... and If Someone cannot see this, then they are in fact "thin skinned".

Or maybe they just want to reprimand someone on the forum so that they can get good rep points for doing it... either way... It is something that should be changed, because I don't care what anybody says... everything is political, even if it is rooted in GP.

In real life... There is no Negative rep, you can't close a person's Ideas like you can a thread, and you DO have to learn to live with Ideals that may be different than your own. That's what a lot of us (me included) on chiefdelphi have to learn to deal with, whether we like it or not.


And once more... If you have a problem with this post, please take it up with my inbox and NOT my rep box.


I thought about this quite a bit... And it is at least 50% intelligent

[Billfred]

Originally Posted by Cody C

In real life... There is no Negative rep, you can't close a person's Ideas like you can a thread, and you DO have to learn to live with Ideals that may be different than your own. That's what a lot of us (me included) on chiefdelphi have to learn to deal with, whether we like it or not.

I beg to differ. There are red and green dots in the world--but the stakes are far higher.

I live in Preston College here at USC. I do a lot of things, from being a member of the Selection Committee to running the web site. All of these things lead to a positive reputation amongst the folks who run the show, which has come in handy when I need something like a job reference. That reputation has paid off for me, as it's led to being able to launch other things in the building.

Now, suppose I go two doors down, bang on the Principal's door, and start cussing him out. Not only will I immediately be unable to do anything of value for the building, but I'm willing to bet that I'll also find myself in the falling-apart Towers as one of the final residents before they get torn down in the summer.

Similarly, suppose that I'm applying for the job at Apple. While in the interview, I start ranting and raving about how the iPod is going downhill and PlaysForSure is going to own everyone and that Steve Jobs needs to quit with the turtlenecks already. (Those aren't my real opinions.) Not only am I going to lose any chance of getting the job (and thus that source of income), but the word also gets around that I have this attitude. Next thing I know, it's a whole lot harder for me to get a job in the town.

Moral of the story? Think before you start saying things. This very post went through two or three revisions to make the points clearer--and if you apply it to anything you say or do, you'll be better for it.*

*Of course, there comes a point where you have to shoot the linguist and say the darn thing.

[Chriszuma]

I just think it's kind of funny how that happened; he managed to offend the group of people who have the least experience with the reputation system, and are therefore most likely to give negative reputation.

[Cody Carey]

Originally Posted by Billfred

I beg to differ. There are red and green dots in the world--but the stakes are far higher.

When Two people have a dissagreement, does a red dot appear over one of their heads that lets every single person that sees them know that "He is a bad person because he has a red dot above his head, no. "reputation in real life is between two people... also, You didn't comment on the thread closing that I mentioned, yet you still told me to think about what I post... I just want to let you know that it took me at least 6 diffeerent revisions of that post to get one that was fit for this forum.

[Adam Richards]

Originally Posted by Cody C

When Two people have a dissagreement, does a red dot appear over one of their heads that lets every single person that sees them know that "He is a bad person because he has a red dot above his head, no. "reputation in real life is between two people... also, You didn't comment on the thread closing that I mentioned, yet you still told me to think about what I post... I just want to let you know that it took me at least 6 diffeerent revisions of that post to get one that was fit for this forum.

Not necessarily. The op/ed section of a newspaper is quite useful for this function. If a writer goes out and publically criticizes a person, the person's reputation and credibility can be seriously harmed as a result.

Also, Billfred was talking about red and green dots figuratively, not literally.

[Conor Ryan]

I've been posting on CD frequently now for about a year, and I've noticed a few things about it. The major thing though is timing, you posted a touchy thread right in the middle of build season. And in build season, everyone has a short temper, why? We have 6 weeks to go from start to finish, its a very high pressure situation for all of us.

That was probably the main reason why as many people gave you Negative rep as they did, but hey lets go review how exactly reputation works

Originally Posted by Negative Reputation FAQ

What are good and bad things to give negative reputation for? Negative reputation should be given if the person is posting something that detracts from the conversation. If the post is rude, inappropriate, breaks forum rules, is not gracious, etc; these are all good reasons to give negative reputation. If you have a personal grudge with someone, their team, etc, is it not appropriate to give them negative reputation for no reason. Giving negative reputation because you don't agree with what was said is not an appropraite use of the reputation system. People are entitled to their own opinions, and just because you don't agree doesn't mean the user was wrong or not contributing to the conversation.

I hope that explains it some more, the rep system is full of Grey area, my best advise is most definetly, THINK BEFORE YOU POST, my second best is, does this offend anyone? and my third would be Does this post benefit from discussion?

Of course you can always review the stickies (*gasp*!) what a concept