1549's stratagy...

[Validius]

Greetings from GLR!!!!!

The regional was amazing this year, team 1549 had a VERY interesting experience and I thought it was worth sharing.

On practice day we very quickly realized that there was no way we cold score in the center goal, period. We had to totally rethink our stratagy. With an air of defeat we decided to go 100% defense. Our halftrack drivetrain made the robot very apt to this (that is, snowblower tracks in the back with casters in the front). On Friday we won all but one of our matches. 'It was coincidence' i thought, we wernt that good. Must have been the alliance. Come Saturday we start winning again, even with poor alliances and I begin to study the matches and the scorebord. While most matches ended up having scores of 40+ to 60+ our matches had scores of 10+ to 30-50+. We were winning everything and never scoring apart from a few one pointers in autonomus using our impotent shooter.

Next thing i know all the matches are over and its time for alliance picks in finals. We were #4!!! Needness to say the entire team was stunned and joyous. We picked team 66 and 68 for finals-both good shooters. The first round we won both matches with a scores of 19-58 and 15-54. The vast majority of the points scored against us were scored in autonomous mode! We simply parked in front of the center goal and didnt let anyone line up a shot! Well, in the semifinals equipment finals and worthy advisaries knocked us out of eliminations.

We took on a stratagy that noone else was using, all defense. Noone was prepared to deal with us. Remember, a defense wins the game. Think about how many shots you can stop vs how many you can make. It worked for us!

Oh yea, props to 66 and 68, we were a great team.

[akshar]

hate to say this but this strategy was used by a team at BAE, and it worked but we didnt get picked in the alliance pickings because we were a very low ranked team even though we had the best defense, it doesnt matter, boston is only 2 weeks away, and we have a new strategy, that can not be shared at this time....

[Jeff K.]

Originally Posted by guju4life2005

hate to say this but this strategy was used by a team at BAE, and it worked but we didnt get picked in the alliance pickings because we were a very low ranked team even though we had the best defense, it doesnt matter, boston is only 2 weeks away, and we have a new strategy, that can not be shared at this time....

We also used that strategy. We made an important decision 2 days before ship to scrap the shooter because we were overweight and just make it go for corner goals. We realized it would be better to dump balls early on and go defense for the rest of the match. Our drivetrain had been pretty powerful, as we could push any robot there, even team 40 with their traction plate . It got us ranked 9th at BAE and into the Quarterfinals. We also got "The Punisher Award" by Team 40 for Best Defensive Robot.

[Dan Richardson]

At the Florida regional 710 was a defensive bot, they could score in the low goals in auto or whenever they needed to, but they rarely did. They were a hardcore defensive robot, a strong drive train and a shot blocker arm that came up to block gravity feed bots from far away was an innovative idea and they were extraordinarily good at it.

[danield710]

yea we did pretty good, altho i think most of the teams didnt like us if we were blocking them, we had to keep the bot simple cuz we built it out of my garage without a sponsor, except for the school, i guess our strategy worked out, team 86 denied pink the chance to form an alliance so they could pick us, our robot was one of the simplest but one of the most effective, the simplest ideas always work the best

[shamuwong]

I must say, I was stunned when I first saw 1549's base. Most of the time, I was in the pits and got to see few matches. When I was on the pit crew for the elimination matches, I saw 1549 get stuck on the lexan shields on the ramp, exposing their treads. I was blown away by the sheer powerful-looking-ness of it. Especially since I first saw casters up front, I didn't know how they could play defense so well.

Very few robots were able to use the camera effectively at GLR, and those who could couldn't respond fast enough to defense. In this game, with the precarious objective of putting balls through the air into a goal, defense will definitely play a major role in team strategy. As a matter of fact, finals just seemed to be 1 scoring robot and 2 defensive robots against a similar alliance. I don't see any robots that can be moved somewhat easily making it very far, unless they have ridiculously fast camera tracking or bodyguards.

[the_short1]

I can definately see the value of defence, with the tripplets (1114,1503,1680) on the loose, and other robots taht are capable of emptying 10+ balls in just a few seconds, being able to deflect the robot, making every ball miss is very key as it can cause a 30point swing! Congrats to 1549 for not giving up!

I know we were able to do that once or twice (with our primarily offensive robot) and it definately let us win the match, but with a 50/50 split between offence and defence, im sure it would have been easier!

But on the other hand, being pure defence (not designed to score), is not a great way to "Aim high", as packing a lot of weight, and a solid tank drivetrain isnt much in the end of engineering and innovation (IMHO), and it also leads to very brutal "battle bots" in some, but not necessarily all.

-kevin

[themagic8ball]

A good defense will beat a good offense.

Proof? St. Louis Regional.

547 was designed for low goals but come elimination rounds we designated them to defend our shooters (71 and 537) in offense and defend against the other teams shooters by nocking them off course. It was a very effective strategy and won us the regional.

[Dan Petrovic]

Team 151 had the same situation as you guys. They couldn't shoot very well so they decided to play defence. In autonomous they put their 10 in the side goals and then play defense up until the end where they got on the ramp.

They were seeded #1 when alliance picking came around.

[StephLee]

Friday evening, I was standing in our pit with a few of the mentors, discussing the standings. At that point, we were ranked 4th; all 3 robots ranked higher than us were defenders. None of them had a shooter. I commented on this, and one mentor said "Who would have thought defense would be so important?" I smiled my evil little "I told ya so" smile and said "I did."

I wanted a solid defensive drivetrain from the start, but we went for scoring at the expense of defense. The reason we were finalists was because we had two good defensive bots with us, both of which had excellent drivers. They'd defend us while we shot, both in autonomous and during the main match. 393 also made sure we'd win autonomous; their dump was really consistant in auto.

[Dusty]

We to had a robot that could play very good defence, unfourtionatly the only problem was that we were a little short and could not block the shots of the taller robots. However do to the style of our robot we could quite easily push most of them around. I think that we were one of the solidist robots at FLR, (that's just my opinion, it could be a little bit bias). Even though we were solid though we still had a decent shooter and in some of our matches were our alliances leading scorer. I agree however that if you can control your opponents points well you leave your self a good chance of winning.

There are a few pictures of our bot here although it was not completley finished.
www.team1901.com

[otimos]

Originally Posted by the_short1

being pure defense (not designed to score), is not a great way to "Aim high", as packing a lot of weight, and a solid tank drivetrain isn’t much in the end of engineering and innovation (IMHO), and it also leads to very brutal "battle bots" in some, but not necessarily all.

-kevin

As the driver for 1549 and having taken a large hand in design and fabrication of the drivetrain I disagree with the 1/2 track design being low on the innovation scale. The 1/2 track implementation offers a robust application of a purpose engineered track assembly with a extreme ability to resist lateral (off drive axis) force; a design flaw which befell many of the full track drivetrain configurations at GLR. Although not outwardly visible, thus understandably omitted, the placement of the gearboxes utilizing a robust tensioning method allowed for the collapse of a transmission casting and still proved reliable tensioning utilizing the secondary mechanism for the majority of the final day having yet to fail in competition.

drivetrain innovation is a challenging class to judge as many subtle features incorporated are difficult to notice thanks in part to the durability which they provide.

as a comment I would like to point out we had no problems pushing around any other drivetrain presented at GLR at least we were equally matched in the rare occasion. If you have video proof of 1549 being pushed around head to head I would love to study it.

[Validius]

Originally Posted by shamuwong

I must say, I was stunned when I first saw 1549's base. Most of the time, I was in the pits and got to see few matches. When I was on the pit crew for the elimination matches, I saw 1549 get stuck on the lexan shields on the ramp, exposing their treads. I was blown away by the sheer powerful-looking-ness of it. Especially since I first saw casters up front, I didn't know how they could play defense so well.

Very few robots were able to use the camera effectively at GLR, and those who could couldn't respond fast enough to defense. In this game, with the precarious objective of putting balls through the air into a goal, defense will definitely play a major role in team strategy. As a matter of fact, finals just seemed to be 1 scoring robot and 2 defensive robots against a similar alliance. I don't see any robots that can be moved somewhat easily making it very far, unless they have ridiculously fast camera tracking or bodyguards.

You guys were great too.

Our tracks came from an old Sears snowblower. We had all but decided to go with timing belt tracks when I just picked the blower up on a whim. We never looked back.


BLAST THOSE LEXAN SHIEDS. From now on we are going to go backwards if we try to defend in autonomus. If we would have gone tracks first that would not have happened.

[Starke]

from watching many webcasts and being at the Finger Lakes Regional, i can see what the main strategy seems to be for everyone (correct me if i am wrong).

it is necessary to win autonomous this year. if you win autonomous, you already have at least a 10 point head start. generally autonomous came down to one or two robots coming across the field and stopping their opponents from making 3 point shots. then just stop your opponents from scoring during their offensive time. during your offensive period score a few to make sure you have the win. if your already winning the match, why score any more points during the free-for-all period? just stop your opponents from scoring. then just get as many robots on the ramp as possible to negate any opponent robots on the ramp.

what do you think? this seemed to occur a lot from what i have seen. please let me know your opinions.

[Validius]

Originally Posted by Starke340

from watching many webcasts and being at the Finger Lakes Regional, i can see what the main strategy seems to be for everyone (correct me if i am wrong).

it is necessary to win autonomous this year. if you win autonomous, you already have at least a 10 point head start. generally autonomous came down to one or two robots coming across the field and stopping their opponents from making 3 point shots. then just stop your opponents from scoring during their offensive time. during your offensive period score a few to make sure you have the win. if your already winning the match, why score any more points during the free-for-all period? just stop your opponents from scoring. then just get as many robots on the ramp as possible to negate any opponent robots on the ramp.

what do you think? this seemed to occur a lot from what i have seen. please let me know your opinions.

Autonomus is big but so it the ramp. We were anways on the ramp.