Lack of passion in scouting

[Scott Carpman]

This thread is the reason I made sure everyone on 1155 watch matches, even if they had other things to do, in order to get basic fundementals about the game.

[artdutra04]

Over the past four years - and often being the one of the only students on our team that understands every single subsystem on our robot inside-and-out - I've talked to a lot of scouts. And the issue with many of them is not always that they do not know what they are doing, but many times it's that they are shy and introverted. To them, being a "people person" can be quite hard!

So don't bash someone just because they are shy and don't show spirit while scouting. Instead work with them, be friendly, and make them feel better about what they are doing. Be helpful and anticipate their questions. If they are asking about your drivetrain, elaborate on it - but without going too far into petty details, and you may answer some of their additional questions.

When you are helping scouts, you are the voice of your team, so be truthful, succinct, sociable. If the scouts feel more at ease, then everyone wins.

[thegathering]

"The beatings will continue until moral improves."

A motto I live by. It seems kids don't mind sharing the work as long as the scouter shares the load (there are lots of teams and not many opportunities). The faster you get through the initial scouting, the smoother things tend to run.

[pyrome]

Originally Posted by IMac

I don't really have much say in this yet since I haven't attended my regional yet, but I know we've been trying to better the scouting process. I started a collective spreadsheet online that all teams can modify and check out. This'll give people a good view of all the bots before even going. This'll help out rookie teams especially too, teams who are too small to spare a scouting team or too inexperienced. It's only set up for philly so far, but I think it's a good idea for the future.

What is the website?

[Rick-906]

i know exactly what you mean!
at BAE i had a pair of scouts questioning me about our robot. they relied soley on a sheet for questions, and when the robot did not fit the limited descriptions on the sheet they drew complete blanks... they walk up to the pit [with the robot in plain view] and ask "do you have bumpers?"

PLEASE teach your scouts whats going on, otherwise theyre next to useless...
and if your just trying to assign busywork, have them do something that wont disturb the serious participants more than nessicary

[i wish we had that many people]

[Koko Ed]

I have heard alot of stories about a lack of passion this season.
Must be an epidemic.

[115inventorsam]

Don't you worry, I'm super excited to be a scout in only my rookie year on such a big team like 115, and I've really done some things to prepare.

Though this thread does bring up a good point, scouting should be something that can be fun, not just about gathering info, but you can meet other people on other teams, make friends, etc.

I can't wait anymore, I can't even go through a single class without thinking about robotics.

[SamC]

Well, on our team their are two types of scouting. Pit scouting (The type you mentioned in your original post, and making note of team's attitude toward you asking questions.) and match scouting (Watching EVERY match, keeping track of certain criteria, and making note of outstanding teams).

Generally, pit scouting is not so horrible as far as people not wanting to do it. I think this is true mostly because you can get it done in about 1-3 hours per regional. You also get to interact with the other teams and their members which is also pretty cool.

Match scouting is where it is really difficult to fins a willing scout. I have one reason for this, match scouting is BORING! I am sure some may disagree and say its better that standing around in a pit wishing you had something to do. Here are a few reasons to defend my statement...

1. All you do is sit there for a long period of time and watch robots
2. You don't really get to watch each match as you are watching an individual robot
3. You do not get to interact with other teams, students, or hang out with friends.

I'm sure some will disagree with me, but I have little hope that match scouting will ever get "fun" its still watching a robot rather than a match...

[Rick-906]

boring as it is, match scouting is one of the most important aspects.

not to beat round the bush but: talk is cheap.
if your robot is amazing, it will demonstrate said amazingness during qualifications [barring technical problems cause i know that happens now and again]

basicaly what im saying is that [especailly if youre ranked high in the standings] people tend to tell you what the robot can do and not what it actualy does.

[falconmaster]

Originally Posted by JBotAlan

Hello,

I just got home from the first day of GLR, and after meeting quite a few scouts, I have noticed a general correlation.

Most of the scouts I talk to seem to have no passion whatsoever towards the game, their team, scouting, or FIRST in general. Why?

Today, I had a scout ask me if we had a ringer. I guessed that he meant to ask if our robot could hang ringers, but when I asked to make sure, he replied with a hesitant "I guess...". This person did not even know what every entry on the scouting sheet meant!

So here's the reason for my post: teams, please make sure your scouts are educated about the game, and that they care. Don't assign scouting just because the freshmen have nothing to do. Don't assign scouting just as a punishment.
Scouts, please, put a little passion into your work! I love to talk to people who are excited and truly interested in the robots and the teams, but it is IMHO a waste of both your time and my time if you are just filling out a list of 1-5s on a scouting sheet. Those 1-5s don't reflect truly on anyone's robot or performance. Don't mumble; don't give me "I...guess..."s. Be confident! You have a very important job--make friends and get to know people! Don't muck it up because you have to fill out "all those stupid scouting forms"--that's not what it's about.

Maybe I'm preaching to the choir here; scouts on CD are probably very dedicated and this post probably doesn't apply, but I just thought I'd post this here.

Just my 2 cents that I figured I should share
JBot

This might help. http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...hlight=logging
Its a data recording device we came up with. We are testing now, AZ reg, San Diego reg and Vegas Region, Nationals. Hopefully for sale next year.
If you are at one of these regionals, check it out. Its like reverse game play, something happens and then you hit the button. The data can then be downloaded and put into an excell spread sheet.

[BHOP]

Quick story at how important scouting is...

We (503) seeded 4th in curie division at the championship last year(2006). My friend was out talking with woodie flowers, so I got to go out for alliance selection. I get a clipboard with the scouting list top ranked teams. I thought a mentor who loves to scout put it together and everything was perfect. I take 451 as my first pick...great choice they are awesome we won a regional with them earlier that year, sweet. 2nd pick rolls around, I look at my list, and I have no idea who this team is that I'm gonna pick, no offence but I don't even remember who they are to this day. But 222 tigertrons were next on the list, and I thought they were pretty good. I picked the team thinking well my scouting team ussually knows what's going on... BAD IDEA. I find out that just a bunch of under classmen were screwing around scouting play gameboy half the time. If my scouting team had been paying attention they would have not made such a mistake and ranked 222 a little higher. I can't complain, we some how won the division off a little bit of luck, some ref mistakes, etc. and that no name team was sooooooooo happy. It was their first time in a tourny and first time winning anything. I guess it all worked out, but we could have went a little further on einstein if we had 222. SCOUTING TEAMS PAY ATTENTION!

[LWS]

Scouting is so important; it very often means the difference between winning and losing. I just don't understand why people don't pay attention to it. It is actually kind of fun. There is a real challenge to it. One needs to figure out what aspects are important and then rate the other teams on the field with respect to these. You need to consider the strengths and weaknesses of your robot and develop statagies that will be effective. The big payoff comes when (if) you get to select you teammates. Then doing your homework can pay off big time. When one does this well, there is a true sense of accomplishment.

Scouting in the pits is for the birds. Who cares about how a robot looks? What matters is how a robot performs.

If you want to be successful at scouting, you need to set your scouts up so they have a chance to succeed. You need to come up with an approach, and all the scouts must be versed in it. Since schools are supposed to be about intellectual development, it should encourage thinking, and changing aspects on the fly as new information comes to light. Many times it seems that scouts are set up to fail. And who really can get enthusiastic about doing that?

[Lisa Perez]

Originally Posted by LWS

Scouting in the pits is for the birds. Who cares about how a robot looks. What matters is how a robot performs.

I wouldn't be so quick to say that. One can often determine many strengths or weaknesses just by asking what kind of drivetrain a robot has, or what kind of motors are running the arm (which ultimately determine how fast it goes, how much load it can take, etc.). I know that my scouts and I often referred to some of the pit scouting to determine our strategies...

Which brings me to reiterate something that's been mentioned. Scouts should have a general idea of how robots run. The more they know about the motors, pneumatics, electronics, and general structure, the more they'll be able to form their own predictions on the team they are scouting, and the more they'll be able to form solid strategies.

[camtunkpa]

Originally Posted by BHOP

Quick story at how important scouting is...

We (503) seeded 4th in curie division at the championship last year(2006). My friend was out talking with woodie flowers, so I got to go out for alliance selection. I get a clipboard with the scouting list top ranked teams. I thought a mentor who loves to scout put it together and everything was perfect. I take 451 as my first pick...great choice they are awesome we won a regional with them earlier that year, sweet. 2nd pick rolls around, I look at my list, and I have no idea who this team is that I'm gonna pick, no offence but I don't even remember who they are to this day. But 222 tigertrons were next on the list, and I thought they were pretty good. I picked the team thinking well my scouting team ussually knows what's going on... BAD IDEA. I find out that just a bunch of under classmen were screwing around scouting play gameboy half the time. If my scouting team had been paying attention they would have not made such a mistake and ranked 222 a little higher. I can't complain, we some how won the division off a little bit of luck, some ref mistakes, etc. and that no name team was sooooooooo happy. It was their first time in a tourny and first time winning anything. I guess it all worked out, but we could have went a little further on einstein if we had 222. SCOUTING TEAMS PAY ATTENTION!

Thanks for the kudos, I believe your other alliance partner was team 1159. You guys played some great matches against us. I wonder what it would have been like to join forces. Good Luck this season! Hope you have some interested in scouts!

[Spider-Man]

Well this year Team 467 changed the way we scouted.

On Thursday, every team member gets 1-2 robots that are competing at the regional. Each team member is responsible for going to the pits and gathering the vitals on his/her robots. Also, that team member is responsible for watching at least 2 practice matches involving his/her robots.

On Friday and Saturday, the setup changes as there is a select group of students and mentors that sit in the stands and watch matches. The method for information collection and delivery to the strategists is still being tweaked for Boston, but the basics are the same. We will have 3-6 students and some mentors keeping track of the basics of scoring ringers, getting bonus points, and defending for each robot. Comments are also welcome for clarifying performance.

In our strategy meetings on Friday night, we use the knowledge of our match watchers heavily, especially the feeling the person has about a team.

On a side note, some teammates and I found the picking at FLR to be almost from a bizzaro FLR. Some of the teams didn't have a good handle on how their picks would build the best alliance to win this year's game. I'm not going to single any teams out because that's not very gracious or professional, so I'm just going to emphasize that if possible, a team needs to know the robots available and how they fit into the three important categories for this game: ringers, bonus points, and defense.