Lettering in FIRST

[bsbllpss]

Hi, I'm R.J. our team 2044 is the only in Nebraska and our highschool administration will not allow our so called "team" to letter. This is because they call the Robotics "Team" a CLUB. In fact we are far from being a "club." In a club do you put in as much time and effort as you do in robotics. Do you have to apply to be on a club. Is a club made up of 14 students. I think not. What do you guys think?

I personally think that the search feature is wonderful. You'd probably find something like this there.

But anyway, lettering in FIRST is rare, despite the long hours. Keep working at it, and eventually you'll sway them.

[youngWilliam14]

the athletic department at my school is in charge of that, and they're all stuck up about it. we've been thinking of getting jakets that look like our school's and putting robot stuff on them just to p.o. the athletic people.

personaly, i think most school sports are a waste of time. unfortunately, those sports are the popular ones. i'm in Tae Kwon Do all year. i can use what i learn there beyond the mats

[Cow Bell Solo]

We had letters our first year being involved in robotics. Some requierments are putting forth so many hours, going to regional, participating in other events(going to elementry, sponsors etc), doing beyond stuff(t-shirts, buttons, website, etc.)

[David]

Originally Posted by bsbllpss

Hi, I'm R.J. our team 2044 is the only in Nebraska and our highschool administration will not allow our so called "team" to letter. This is because they call the Robotics "Team" a CLUB. In fact we are far from being a "club." 1. In a club do you put in as much time and effort as you do in robotics. 2. Do you have to apply to be on a club. 3. Is a club made up of 14 students. I think not. What do you guys think?

Number mine
To answer your questions
1. possibly. I know people how spend weeks working on stuff for TSA or science olympiad, but FIRST does require a greater commitment commitment. but some athletics teams require a 12 month commitment that is more demanding than FIRST.
2. Sometimes. NHS is a good example of a club with an application and do you have to apply to be on a team?
3. This number makes no difference. There are teams of 10 (golf or gymnastics) people and teams of 100 (football). As there are clubs of 10 and clubs of 50+

My personal opinion is lettering denotes varsity sport. Since there is no JV and varsity level, members of the robotics team should not get letters. Also, the school can't consider you a team for insurance and other purposes. Insurance companies (actuaries) view a robotics team differently than a football team. Do i support giving awards to members of robotics team for their efforts? Yes. Should this reward be a varsity letter? No.

[bsbllpss]

your views make no sense
a robotics team is just a dangerous as a football team if that is what you mean by insurance purposes
we use plasma cutters, chop saws, welders, grinders, knives, table saws, miter saws and many other dangerous tools
and in my school our clubs usually contain a multitude of people that is what i was refering to and our teams generally not as many...

[Real Deal]

It's a lot easier to get insurance if you register your team as a Learning for Life post through the Boy Scouts. It's what they used to call the Explorers. I couldn't imagine working in a shop without insurance.

As far as lettering goes, shoot for an academic letter. We have an academic lettering system at our school so we arranged to set criteria for lettering in robotics. It can be done no matter what your circumstance, you just have to get a whole lot of people behind your cause. Our criteria require a combination of a number of outreach hours, fund-raising credits, meeting attendance, competition attendance and other factors. About 20% of our club members letter each year.

[bsbllpss]

sweet. that is really good advice
if we set up a criteria for getting our letters it should be much easier
i will arrange for an appointment with our schools headmaster as soon as possible

[Kelly]

I'm curious about why getting a letter is so important. I liked FIRST because it wasn't a sport and because my team operated so much differently than a sports team would. Athletes need their varsity letters so they can make themselves feel like beautiful unique snowflakes or what have you. Giving letters in FIRST would force you to enumerate everyone's indivdual contributions rather than focusing on the robot that the whole team built. When I'm less tired and more coherent I might share with Chief Delphi my strong opinions regarding Dean Kamen's obsession with having engineers fill the role currently filled by athletes. (Hint: I think that would destroy the field of engineering)

[GUI]

Our team started doing letters last year, but no one on the team seems to get overly excited about it. However, I know a few people on sports teams that find it rather infuriating (What? Robotics isn't a sport!...). Getting it done wasn't very difficult, I'm pretty sure most people on the team didn't know about it until they got theirs.

I personally don't see what's so important about getting a letter either, I think the robot and the relationships you build with your team mates, mentors, and the community are a much better reward for your efforts.

[GaryVoshol]

Can other "club/teams" in the school get letters? The Debate Team, the Chess Team, Model UN, the Marching Band? If so, then you have a point. If not, well then the athletic department has reserved official school letters for themselves.

There's nothing to prohibit you from going to the store that sells the "varsity jackets" and ordering yourself one, with whatever FIRST and FRC team logos you want on it.

[Taylor]

I've got a white paper with our rules for lettering. Within it, there are restrictions for "varsity" and "JV" membership.

[4throck]

I was a member of the State Championship winning Scholastic Bowl team. Despite Scholastic Bowl being part of the VHSL (Virginia High School League), our team being part of the athletics department, and being more successful than any team at our high school in years, we didn't get anything. Basically, most schools don't view this type of thing as a sport. Probably because these things aren't.

Besides, why would you want one anyway? They generally just make you look stupid.

[Steve_Alaniz]

It's probably not a good thing to mention but I lettered in Marching Band... Still with FIRST robotics being considered a "Club" and not part of "official" school practices, lettering would be difficult.
Hey don't get me wrong... I love watching a good football game and I think we need athletics... we just need to "re-wire" peoples perceptions so they can see value in robotics and that will take time...


Steve

[GoSparx]

To me this seems like the core problem that high schools have with FIRST teams. Some schools just don't give the recognition that FIRST teams should get. If you compare a FIRST team to any sports team, you will find that there is a same commitment level and same basic principles. You train for the season (build and practice your bot), you have time management for games(you have6 weeks to build a bot for events) and you have team work(theres no need to even explain this one!!!). FIRST though is all about taking the spot light off of sports and movie stars and putting more focus on the science and technology leaders of the world. If you feel strongly enough about lettering, then by all means I feel you should try and "fight" this, and by fight I mean research and present your information to the correct people as a gracious professional. Now when it comes to this post:

Originally Posted by David

Number mine
To answer your questions
1. possibly. I know people how spend weeks working on stuff for TSA or science olympiad, but FIRST does require a greater commitment commitment. but some athletics teams require a 12 month commitment that is more demanding than FIRST.
2. Sometimes. NHS is a good example of a club with an application and do you have to apply to be on a team?
3. This number makes no difference. There are teams of 10 (golf or gymnastics) people and teams of 100 (football). As there are clubs of 10 and clubs of 50+

My personal opinion is lettering denotes varsity sport. Since there is no JV and varsity level, members of the robotics team should not get letters. Also, the school can't consider you a team for insurance and other purposes. Insurance companies (actuaries) view a robotics team differently than a football team. Do i support giving awards to members of robotics team for their efforts? Yes. Should this reward be a varsity letter? No.

I couldn't disagree more. On his first (1) point he says that some sports require a 12 month commitment, more demanding than FIRST. Look at the Chairmans Award, FIRST's highest honor. The biggest thing they ask you in the interview is all you a full year team and how. Chairmans winning teams do things year to spread the good word of FIRST and try to expand not just their team, but the entire program itself to it's community and beyond. This seems way harder to me. For number two (2), I do believe an application is necessary, especially when traveling to different regionals and nationals. With costs being so high, you have to make sure your team is really geared up for this sort of thing, you're in it for the long haul!!! Also, lettering is a sign of a team, not of JV or Varsity. These kids put in just as much, if not more, than any football, lacrosse or basketball team. Sure they may not pump iron like sports guys, but they will put in and learn more brain power and learn more than any sports team out there. If the kids want a letter, they deserve it. After putting in so much time to this program to learn so much, that is a much greater reward and life lesson than scoring a touchdown in a football game. LET THEM EAT CAKE!!!