pic: You guys remember what most of us said would never happen last year?

[JaneYoung]

Originally Posted by Koko Ed

For all we know part of their strategy is to post pictures and videos of their robots before the season began to demoralize the other teams.
Competition is as much about psychology as it is about ability. If you go in thinking you're going to lose then you just made a self fulfilling prophecy because you've lost before you've even made it to the field.

I understand what you are saying, Ed, it can be part of the promotion of your own reputation, legacy, hard work. It can also be an intimidation factor if viewed as one. Champions can become champions by pulling out the stops and using every venue they can to achieve that title. We’ve seen that in many athletic sports/teams/venues. It’s a marketing tool as old as the first games, I’d wager.

Many respected and successful teams also champion the right and the room for self-improvement, self-development, and self-respect in other teams – learning to grow as a team and as competitors to be feared and respected. These teams also provide white papers and information concerning how their programs work and how to develop robot designs that are sound and effective. Several also give excellent presentations at the Championship conferences, sharing aspects of their team strengths, their engineering talents, and even their strategies.

All of this works together. One can’t just separate out some photographs and videos without looking at the other aspects of the teams that have made them competitors on a world championship level.

I’m always among the first to encourage each team to develop their program and their strengths, including recruiting engineers and mentors to help strengthen/obtain their goals and commitments. At the same time, I have to give a nod of respect to those teams who have already found that balance and continue to put it into practice year after year, achieving consistency, setting the bar, and acting as role models for others to learn from.

[Jared Russell]

Originally Posted by JaneYoung

I understand what you are saying, Ed, it can be part of the promotion of your own reputation, legacy, hard work. It can also be an intimidation factor if viewed as one. Champions can become champions by pulling out the stops and using every venue they can to achieve that title. We’ve seen that in many athletic sports/teams/venues. It’s a marketing tool as old as the first games, I’d wager.

Many respected and successful teams also champion the right and the room for self-improvement, self-development, and self-respect in other teams – learning to grow as a team and as competitors to be feared and respected. These teams also provide white papers and information concerning how their programs work and how to develop robot designs that are sound and effective. Several also give excellent presentations at the Championship conferences, sharing aspects of their team strengths, their engineering talents, and even their strategies.

All of this works together. One can’t just separate out some photographs and videos without looking at the other aspects of the teams that have made them competitors on a world championship level.

I’m always among the first to encourage each team to develop their program and their strengths, including recruiting engineers and mentors to help strengthen/obtain their goals and commitments. At the same time, I have to give a nod of respect to those teams who have already found that balance and continue to put it into practice year after year, achieving consistency, setting the bar, and acting as role models for others to learn from.

To turn this around, a perceived slight by the CD community can also be a powerful tool. I have used Fantasy First picks, otherwise innocent "quotes" from forum users, and other online "popularity contests" as motivation for our build and drive teams more than once.

Pictures and videos that people drool over can intimidate, but they also motivate. I think that the veteran teams who truly do "get it" hope that that is the message that gets received when they post their machines.

[Akash Rastogi]

Thanks everyone for hijacking a comedic thread. Really. Thanks for random neg rep and presumptuous posts too.

Originally Posted by Jared341

Pictures and videos that people drool over can intimidate, but they also motivate.

Finally, someone who sees it from my side of the window. (emphasis mine)

[JaneYoung]

Akash,

I’m sorry that the intended comedic thread was hijacked but at the same time, there has been some good discussion going on. In my opinion, none of the posts made were presumptuous although several became serious. Many mentors that read and post in CD always keep in mind how easily young people can be influenced. Mentors who are struggling to find effective ways to help their teams and their students develop, can see the impact that posts can have on the individuals on the team. Rookie teams and rookie members may not understand the joke or the humor that is implied and they may be intimidated, thinking this is the standard they have to meet as a first year or second year. It is easy to feel overwhelmed and intimidated if strong organizational support systems aren’t in place on a team. Sometimes, ChiefDelphi is a double-edged sword in that it provides wonderful information, resources, and experience. It can also be perceived as setting very high standards, perhaps too high for those who do not have the strong foundation in place that helps teams meet their goals. Some of these posts in this thread are about that, building stronger foundations – building a stronger team. Yes, it is great to have role models and teams to look up do, but keep your eye on the prize, don’t forget to work to become a champion in your own right.
--
I see you edited your post to include Jared's quote. It's a good one.

[JVN]

Originally Posted by Akash Rastogi

Thanks for random neg rep and presumptuous posts too.

Wow, negative reputation for something in THIS thread?
Someone has some real issues they need to address...

[Koko Ed]

Originally Posted by Jared341

To turn this around, a perceived slight by the CD community can also be a powerful tool. I have used Fantasy First picks, otherwise innocent "quotes" from forum users, and other online "popularity contests" as motivation for our build and drive teams more than once.

Pictures and videos that people drool over can intimidate, but they also motivate. I think that the veteran teams who truly do "get it" hope that that is the message that gets received when they post their machines.

If people do Fantasy FIRST right Chairman's level teams are more valuable than dominant teams (more points) thus otherwise powerful team in the HOF like 67, 111, 16, ect are off limits to me if there's a Chairman's threat available no matter how good their robot is.

As for perceived slights, there's 1800 teams in FIRST and not everyone is gonna be in the spotlight unfortunately. There's always surprise teams that rise to prominence every year and for all their dominance 1114 just won a championship last year and 217 and 148 have two each in 18 years. It's not just as easy as showing up and watching everyone wither away. There's alot of good teams out there including ones that no one cares about and they're using threads like this to feed the need to kick much butt.

[thefro526]

I looked at this picture and started laughing. I laughed because I realized that with those three teams on an alliance they would probably run out of balls and be frantically driving around the field trying to gather up the balls they haven't already scored. Moral of the story, if you go up against 148,217 and 1114 make sure you hoard all of the balls.

Thought this thread needed more humor =P

[Paul Copioli]

First off, I laughed out loud when I saw the picture.

Second, there were some questions earlier in the thread regarding what sort of things did we do new? Also, there was some mention of collaboration and I want to address that too.

What we did new this year:

1. Take balls from the floor ... successfully - We have been a team since 1999 and only one other time did we attempt to get balls fromthe floor: 2001. Our robot at the Championship that year di not even have the floor loading mechanism on it as it did not work (we were called "Royal Fusion" back then). This is the first year we are picking balls up from the floor.

2. Traction control - We had this figured out within the first 2 weeks and shared exactly what we were thinking on these very forums. We have never done traction control before this year.

3. #25 chain for drive. This requires new mechanisms and we learned how to handle #25 chain.

4. Use absolute encoders with analog outputs. Historically we have used traditional digital output encoders using digital inputs..

Collaboration: I am a big fan and if you can contribute an equal share to the collaboration effort, then it will be a true collaboration. However, if one team is doing all the work and the other is benefitting, then that is more of a mentor / mentee relationship. This year, 217 collaborated with 148 and 1114. We also had a few design discussions with 1726 regarding the screw. 148, 217, and 1114 all discussed the turreted shooter and the helix. 1114 decided on a turreted shooter with a different intake. We decided on a turreted shooter with the helix. 18 decided on a massive dumper with a helical loader. you will see similarities between the robots, but not one uses the same parts.

Finally, 217 has been receiving sheet metal from IFI since 2006. To me, the sheet metal is what makes a TunderChicken robot a "ThunderChicken Robot" and for that 217 has John and the folks at IFI to thank.

Paul

[Daniel_LaFleur]

Originally Posted by Akash Rastogi

loading photo ...

“If you know the enemy and know yourself you need not fear the results of a hundred battles.” -- Sun Tzu

Every robot is defeatable, and every strategy is defeatable. All these teams have produced great looking robots with excellent capabilities. But they are far from undefeatable.

Good luck teams, the games start in just 1 week.






... and they do look scary together, don't they?

[Jared Russell]

Originally Posted by Daniel_LaFleur

“If you know the enemy and know yourself you need not fear the results of a hundred battles.” -- Sun Tzu

Or, in the words of the just-as-eloquent and prophetic Dennis Green,

"IF YOU WANT TO CROWN EM, CROWN EM!"

[Lil' Lavery]

Originally Posted by Jared341

Or, in the words of the just-as-eloquent and prophetic Dennis Green,

"IF YOU WANT TO CROWN EM, CROWN EM!"

But we don't know if they are who we thought they were.

[Rick TYler]

Originally Posted by Lil' Lavery

But we don't know if they are who were thought they were.

Looks like the younger Lavery is looking for a seat on the GDC -- he's already mastered Buddhist kōans.

[Jessica Boucher]

The better question is, how is YOUR team doing? What are YOU doing to make your team better, stronger, closer to YOUR goals?

Your job is you. Focus on yourself and your team. Research of others is important, but it should be focused on how you can learn from it. Once you learn and you share what you've learned, everyone will benefit. Speculation for the sake of speculation is just wasted time.

[JesseK]

Originally Posted by Jessica Boucher

The better question is, how is YOUR team doing? What are YOU doing to make your team better, stronger, closer to YOUR goals?

I know our team is doing just fine. We really pushed ourselves this year in every system we built, and were successful in most of them. My point is more to the fact that next year we'll probably look for some sort of build-season alliance in addition to everything else we've done so far. Everyone seems to benefit from it. Sure, this year our bot will be competitive, but we don't have a promo video that's nearly as intimidating as these 3. Guess we'll have to see what video I can get in DC. I mean, after all, it was one of our strategies to lower everyone's expectations at the DC scrimmage by not moving at all...silly regolith paneling .

Our strategy would be to out-drive 1114's shooter, use our UI on the laptop to lead the shots on 217 & 148 a la Descent I and II, (after all, none of the 3 can move sideways ), and stick to the original plan that with a shooter it doesn't really matter what your fire rate is so long as the opposition stays in range. Oh yea, then there's a play I like to call 'bait, switch, and tackle', but that will require someone else to have a ball handling design similar to ours .

[Ian Curtis]

Like Dave keeps sayin', 71.

Let's review their record of success when there are mobile goals on the field, shall we?

2008 - No mobile goal, No Championship
2007 - No mobile goal, No Championship
2006 - No mobile goal, No Championship
2005 - No mobile goal, No Championship
2004 - Mobile goal, Championship #4
2003 - No mobile goal, No Championship
2002 - Mobile goal, Championship #3
2001 - Mobile goal, Championship #2
2000 - No mobile goal, No Championship
1999 - Mobile goal, No Championship
1998 - No mobile goal, No Championship
1997 - No mobile goal, Championship #1
1996 - No Mobile goal, No Championship

In summary, there has been only 1 game with a mobile goal that did not net Team Hammond (71) a national/international Championship. And that, my friends, is what we like to call scary...