College student mentors

[Beth Sweet]

I agree with what many are saying here.

I started a team my freshman year of college, and while I wouldn't suggest being in charge of a team that early on, I think it was ok to mentor. That being said, HOT, my HS team, had a "no students returning to mentor" policy. We have had a few kids on the DP go on to mentor and while I love them and they've been great mentors, I almost wish we would have had them wait a year, just to give the kids a bit of time to see them as mentors v. students. There is a definite line that needs to be drawn when you transition and remain on the same team, especially in the eyes of the students whom you will be working with.

As to your situation in particular, I would suggest going about it in a way that would encourage the teacher and lead of your organization to see you as a mature, professional potential mentor. Sit down with that teacher and, rather than saying the policy is dumb etc, list some fact-based reasons why you feel it should be modified. Explain why you would be an exception to the need to wait, perhaps you've demonstrated exceptional maturity while being a student participant, or demonstrate some skill set currently missing from your mentor group.

Best of luck!

[Chris is me]

There is no FIRST rule about this; there are no FIRST rules on how anything could be done with team organization.

I'll talk a little about my situation and you can see if it applies to yours.

Personally, though I'm pretty biased, I think college mentoring is possible, though not on the scale your regular mentors work. Most colleges are on break for the first 3 weeks of build season, and if you don't think I'll at least be trying to stop by 1714's shop to say hi and give a suggestion or two you're sorely mistaken.

You also have the first semester or so to get used to college classes so you'll be able to tell if you can handle it. Personally I've been lucky enough to have been taking two college classes a semester for the last two years, so I guess I've had an easier transition into tougher classes and workloads. Four college classes, I've heard, is roughly equal to 2 college classes and 4 high school classes (I have brothers who did the same thing), so I'm reasonably sure I'll be able to handle it.

Part of the reason I think I might be able to help out 1714 in the skills I'm good at (programming / strategy), though, is that the programming group is going to be almost all new people this year, and many of the rookie members kind of sort of look up to me. I was a leader for one of our rookie Vex teams this year, so having me in a mentor-like role isn't an entirely alien experience.

So if you think you'll be able to throw your break away for your team, handle all of the stress of college on top of helping out your FIRST team, and be able to actually _act_ as a mentor around people barely younger than you, then it is certainly possible.

[Molten]

Originally Posted by Cory

How are the students who you joked around with and were friends with going to respect you as an adult without any transition time between you being a student and a mentor? How will the adults?

This has more to do with who you are as a student. As a student, I was a leader and a teacher among the students. When I became a mentor, I just fell into the role naturally. Sure, it took some work to distance myself from the students. But it was well worth it. However, if I was a goof on the team as a student. It wouldn't have worked so well. It really depends on the person.

Earning respect is only half the job of getting it. If you really want respect, you need to command it.

[Stephen Kowski]

Originally Posted by jpmittins

Can I please have some of the older members of FIRST share their knowledge and wisdom with me so my friend can continue to help out the team next year?

Really it comes down to you talking the teacher into it, your friend needs to sell themselves to that person on what they will bring to the table from a mentors perspective....how will they be able to fit in with the culture productively after being a high schooler there? what tangible areas are they fit to lead in or contribute too? your friend should think of it from the teacher's perspective: Why am I keeping this person from participating? What are my concerns with bringing back this person?

Once you are able to answer some of these questions you'll have a better idea of where you fit in. These are adults and they have a rational self interest in keeping the team together, focused, and on track. Unless your friend is able to put some of the teacher's concerns to rest and demonstrate a focused, mature attitude toward mentoring I doubt he/she will be interested.

Or you can just do what I and many others have done....start your own team and watch the sparks fly. Yes it is possible to do this and graduate in four years with decent grades if you know how to balance and prioritize.

[Andrew Schreiber]

Originally Posted by jpmittins

My robotics team, the Cheltenham side, is run by a less-than-knowledgeable teacher who is not aware of all of the rules. My friend is graduating this year, and is looking forward to coming back in the 2010 season. However, the teacher believes that a student must stay away from their team for at least two years before they can begin to mentor or assist their old team. I am almost positive (as is my friend) that this rule was made by the teacher who used to run the second part of the team, the Springfield side, in order to keep a certain person from not joining the team again, since he did not represent the true spirit of FIRST. However, my teacher, the one who is still on the team, is under the impression that is a actual, official rule of FIRST. Can I please have some of the older members of FIRST share their knowledge and wisdom with me so my friend can continue to help out the team next year?

Sorry if this is convoluted, I haven't been on forums in ages, and only just joined Chief Delphi. Hello everyone!

The question that first comes to mind, is your friend coming back as a mentor or as your friend? Is he coming back to help out or hang out? These are important questions to ask your friend. If they genuinely want to help I see no reason to turn away help provided they can do so in a mature fashion that benefits the team and your friend.

One thing I have learned over the last 2 years of mentoring was that I was not ready for it. I may know enough but I was simply not ready to handle the responsibility. I don't know if your friend is but this is another question he needs to ask himself.

Your friend also should consider that there are many more important things in college than FIRST. Grades are what everyone will say first and foremost but there is also a social aspect. I know that as a result of my involvement with FIRST in college I miss out on a lot of social events.

Officially FIRST has no stand on it but if your teacher doesn't want young college students helping out that is their choice. Ultimately it comes down to your friend, if they feel they are mature enough and the teacher feels they are mature enough then give it a shot. Blanket rules like "No college mentors" are ok so long as it is possible to make exceptions. Never forget, sometimes a college student needs FIRST more than the students they are mentoring.

Just my $.02

[Brandon Holley]

I imagine every mentor from 125 could comment on here and offer some insightful piece of information....why? because our entire team is run solely by college mentors.

The difference in our team than most teams is the college base. We are based in a college, not in a single high school. Therefore, our mentors have for the most part come from students who were on FIRST teams in high school, and then came to Northeastern University and decided they want to mentor. It gives our team a very different dynamic.

This thread appears year in and year out. I've posted in them before, but I'll just give my brief opinion.

In the case of a college student coming to mentor a different team than they were on in HS, the transition, while not easy, is not as difficult as someone coming directly from HS and on to mentor the same team. The point has been brought up here already...it is VERY difficult to shed the student image and put on the mentor cap in just a summer (and for some people it could be even less than that). While this doesn't mean it can't be done (we have mentors on our team who were on the team in HS), it still doesn't mean that it should be done, just for the sake of being a mentor.

I can understand any high school students desire to return to their team (FIRST is very very addictive) however you must really make a mature decision. Are you going back to give back? or are you going back just to be back? I'm willing to bet almost everyones first answer is, "I want to give back"...and this honestly is expected as we have been taught that GP and giving back are the right things to do. However consider the fact that for some people, FIRST has been your way of life for 4 years...some of your friends are moving away to college, or moving on with their lives. It is very difficult to give up something like FIRST when it has played such a huge role in your life.

For me, I left team 11 in NJ for team 125 in Boston. When I arrived at the team, I honestly did not know what to expect...was it going to be a big team, small team, student run, mentor run...I didn't know. But the fact remained, I was a college student, on a new team. I had some FIRST experience under my belt, and I was ready to jump back in to FIRST. The first year of 125 for me was a chaotic one. Finding your place as a mentor, in a pool of other mentors is not something that is easily done, especially with the task of the first year of engineering classes and dorm life. However, 4 years later, I am still on 125, still trying to be the best mentor I can.

Don't let anyone tell you otherwise...you cannot be "the adult mentor" as a college student. By "the adult mentor" I am referring to the engineers or parents or old timers on your home teams. However, this doesn't mean you can't be one of the best mentors our there, or someone who leads the team, or someone who runs the show. Being a college student, puts you at close proximity in terms of age to the high school students. For me, I think it's an advantage to college students who have the right attitude. You are able to relate VERY well to what some of the high school kids are going through. The lessons you learned in high school are still relatively fresh in your memory, and the mistakes you learned from are still there as well.

It may not be just robot or team related stuff. It could be applying to colleges, or applying for scholarships...you offer a world of insight that some other adult mentors simply cannot. As time goes by, I think the college student will evolve from:
"5 year FIRSTer" - someone who is mentoring a team for the sake of staying involved in FIRST, whether they can admit that or not to
"The college mentor" - a college student beginning to understand how to mentor properly, and how to establish themselves as someone high school kids can relate to. As well as learning how to distance themselves from the high school students in terms of interaction and "rank"...until finally they become
"The adult mentor" - which is the mentor we all know and love, the one we right WFA entries about, the one who really knows how to carry a team.

For some college students, this transition from "5 year FIRSTer" to "The adult mentor" can never fully happen. This doesn't mean that sometime down the road they won't be an amazing adult mentor, it just means that while in that college timeframe, the mentor/student jsut doesn't have the ability to sort out some of these issues.

However for many college students that transition can occur in the time you are in college. I have seen it happen myself.

Myself, I feel I am still in "The College Mentor" role, however I like that role. I feel I can relate to what some of the high school kids are going through. We can agree on what music to put on in the lab, or we can agree what movie "totally rocked dude". Its a very special dynamic that I don't think everyone in FIRST realizes is there or happening.


The question comes down to, what do you feel you are capable of doing? Making that mature decision to take a year off from FIRST may not be such a bad idea...Looking back at things, I am certainly glad I jumped right into FIRST again after high school but I also can recognize how a year or 2 off can help someone make that "mentor transition" a little bit easier, especially if returning to the same team.

This wasn't as short as I wanted it to be, but I hope my experience going through this transition can help future mentors everywhere.

-Brando

[JVN]

There are a lot of good thoughts in this thread:
http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=69805

Including a long rambling post from yours truly...

I still believe that college FIRST can be an incredible experience, but I always recommend that students focus on their academics and use whatever free time they have to get into non-FIRST related college trouble.

-John

[JackN]

This season was my first as a college mentor. I am very glad that I chose to do it and I really enjoyed working with all the great folks on team 1504. Being involved with these kids was a great oppurtunity and I think that it really helped me grow. Being a college freshman, I related to the high school kids very well which I think helped me work better with them. Just ten months ago I was going through AP tests, applying for college/scholarships and trying to get a date to prom. I can give insight into this that adult mentors might not be able to (except the prom one).

Having no relationship with them before joining, was very important i feel.
I know that I would not have had the same experience if I was involved with my high school teams. There are too many kids I have known for several years that I wouldn't be able to differentiate between friend and student. I have known one of the students since he was 10. I still help some of these kids out if they ask me, either on AIM or FaceBook, but I would not be able to be a true teacher and mentor to them if I was involved with them on a daily basis like I can with the students on 1504.

[OScubed]

I would suggest before you decide to mentor as a College student that you THOROUGHLY read and understand this thread. which specifically addressed this issue. It is stickied at the top of the forum for a reason.