Greater than 60 PSI

[LH Machinist]

Idea...Use a standard compressor installation, 60 psi at regulator and an additional large cylinder. Install a spike just past the regulator thus isolating the regulator from the cylinders. Have the additional large cylinder extended and use a mechanical device to compress the cylinder. The net effect would increase the system pressure above 60 PSI. I believe it would work...is this a legitimate approach?

[EricH]

The rule is 60 PSI working. You are required to have a gauge displaying the pressure. Part of the robot inspection is a powerup. If an inspector sees that mechanism, he may very well request to check it out under power. At that point, you're not going to pass inspection until the mechanism is removed or disabled.

Also, if you're bypassing the regulator AT ALL, you are in violation of <R76>.

[EricVanWyk]

<R76> “Working” air pressure on the ROBOT must be no greater than 60psi. All working air must be provided through one primary Norgen adjustable pressure regulator.
A. All “working” pneumatic components (e.g. valves, cylinders, rotary actuators, etc.) must be downstream from this regulator.
B. Only the compressor, relief valve, pressure switch, pressure vent plug valve, pressure gauge, storage tanks, tubing, and connecting fittings may be in the high-pressure pneumatic circuit upstream from the regulator.
C. Pressure gauges must be placed in easily visible locations upstream and downstream of the regulator to display the “stored” and “working” pressures.
D. If the compressor is not included on the ROBOT (under the provisions of Rule <R75>), the regulator may be located on-board or off-board, provided all other pneumatic rules are satisfied. Note that if the regulator is kept off-board the ROBOT with the compressor, then only low-pressure (60psi or less) “working” air can be stored on the ROBOT

Nope!

EDIT: Beaten Again!

[jspatz1]

The requirement is that any WORKING pressure be no more than 60psi. Regardless of how you generate the pressure for a task, it may not exceed 60 psi.

[James Tonthat]

Even if you tried this, the regulator wouldn't let the pressure go above 60, it'll vent if there's greater pressure down the line. Not to mention the breaking of the rules part.

Edit: You could probably do what you would do with greater than 60 psi with a spring or surgical tubing somehow.

[Matt C]

IF you had a mechanical device strong enough to produce increased pressure in a standard pneumatic cylinder, check out specifically rule <72>, part I.

I. For the purposes of the FIRST competition, closed-loop pneumatic (gas) shocks are not considered pneumatic devices, and are not subject to the pneumatic rules (although they must still satisfy all other appropriate rules).

Just trying to give a friendly push in a productive direction. I'm not exactly familiar with the types of closed-loop shocks out there, nor do I know what you are trying to accomplish with your increased pressure.

[jspatz1]

Originally Posted by Matt C

IF you had a mechanical device strong enough to produce increased pressure in a standard pneumatic cylinder, check out specifically rule <72>, part I.



Just trying to give a friendly push in a productive direction. I'm not exactly familiar with the types of closed-loop shocks out there, nor do I know what you are trying to accomplish with your increased pressure.

The system the poster described is not "closed loop" as R72 requires. However, if you did what he described in a truely closed system, ie the mechanical compactor pushed on a closed, sealed actuator so that it was basically an air spring, then that would be allowed.

[Matt C]

Originally Posted by jspatz1

However, if you did what he described in a truely closed system, ie the mechanical compactor pushed on a closed, sealed actuator so that it was basically an air spring, then that would be allowed.

That was the point I was trying to make.

[scottydoh]

Originally Posted by LH Machinist

Idea...Use a standard compressor installation, 60 psi at regulator and an additional large cylinder. Install a spike just past the regulator thus isolating the regulator from the cylinders. Have the additional large cylinder extended and use a mechanical device to compress the cylinder. The net effect would increase the system pressure above 60 PSI. I believe it would work...is this a legitimate approach?

Im a little confused by this statment too. Im assuming you meant to say a pneumatic solenoid. A spike (aka relay), is a remotely operated electric switch, and for the most part has nothing to do with air control in the pneumatic system. Now on the other hand, a pneumatic solenoid is a remotely operated valve, which would work in your application.

Overall though, as stated this is %100 illegal. Seems as though you should read Section 8 (The Robot), and the Pneumatic Manual again.

Good Luck!
-Scott

[Al Skierkiewicz]

LH,
The appropriate rule should be...
R01> Energy used by FRC ROBOTS, (i.e., stored at the start of a MATCH), shall come only from the following sources:
A. Electrical energy derived from the onboard 12V battery (see Rule <R40> for specifications and further details).
B. Compressed air stored in the pneumatic system, stored at a maximum pressure of 120 PSI in no more than four Clippard Instruments tanks. Extraneous lengths of pneumatic tubing shall not be used to increase the storage capacity of the air storage system.
C. A change in the altitude of the ROBOT center of gravity.
D. Storage achieved by deformation of ROBOT parts.

Note that the stored energy is specified for the start of the match, not through the movement of a cylinder after the match starts. So if I understand your question, the response would still be no. Additionally, the regulator is designed to keep the working pressure at 60PSI and I believe it vents excess pressure from the working side to maintain that pressure. Don't forget you can have up to 4 storage tanks at 120 PSI ahead of the regulator.