Decline of GTR Attendance

[Duncan Macdonald]

Only 1 US team attended GTR this year and I was trying to come up with reasons to explain this.

• Michigan is busy
• Border issues
• (this year) Easter

Anyone have any other reasons for why GTR isn't the two fielded monster it once was?


Notes:
Waterloo regional started in 2005
frclinks is awesome

[Koko Ed]

Originally Posted by Duncan Macdonald

Only 1 US team attended GTR this year and I was trying to come up with reasons to explain this.

• Michigan is busy
• Border issues
• (this year) Easter

Anyone have any other reasons for why GTR isn't the two fielded monster it once was?


Notes:
Waterloo regional started in 2005
frclinks is awesome

I'd chalk it up to teams being wary of crossing the border.

[Racer26]

Both Canadian regionals this year had only 1 US Attendee. This is typical for Waterloo (68 in the early years), but rather atypical for GTR (a notable omission is 48, who've frequented GTR since its inception)

1000 attended WAT this year
2949 attended GTR. That is all.

[Karthik]

Duncan,

The biggest cause of the decline this year was Easter weekend. Many teams who typically attend pulled out for that reason, and will be back next year. The reason for the relatively small field last year (59) was because GTR was capped early, to divert more teams to Waterloo. The loss of American teams due to the passport issues has been problematic as well. I expect next year's GTR to be much bigger than it was this year.

[Foster]

The biggest cause of the decline this year was Easter weekend.

The early Easter had lots of people moving things around. Next year it is 24 April well after Robot Season. We were worried that Drexel would have been Easter Weekend, we were glad it was up a week.

[Jonathan Norris]

I don't know if many of you on CD have heard, but it was announced at GTR that FIRST Robotics Canada has received 3 million dollars in funding over the next 5 years from the Ontario Provincial Government to grow FIRST in Ontario. Seeing that next year is our 10th anniversary, I would say its a safe bet next year is going to be a big year for FIRST in Canada. I hope we will see the return of more American teams as well!

[Vince lau]

I can't wait for next season, I've been to every regional since 2002 and I'm not going to miss next years, hoping teams like 233, 217, 48, 45, 522 etc will come back and help celebrate GTR's 10th anniversary

[Mr. Lim]

It might be a cool idea to see if there are US teams who might be interested in doing an exchange, like 188 and 4/22 did for several years.

Each team takes turns billeting the other at their home regionals. It saves a significant cost in hotels and food, and it's a great way for teams to get to know each other.

I know my team has never competed in a regional in the US before, or at Championships. I wouldn't mind sending out some feelers to see if there are any US teams who may be interested.

[Travis Hoffman]

Originally Posted by Karthik

The loss of American teams due to the passport issues has been problematic as well.

GTR is always in the initial regional discussion mix for us, but new passport pains are currently the most important factor that harpoon our selection of that event. I believe bussed students on a trip can still get away with birth certificates alone (corroboration?), but most team advisors are reluctant to go through the passport application process.

Transfer of the crate through customs each way was also an added expense and challenge. This is no longer an issue, but we are still not certain how much easier it will be to haul a bagged robot across the border now that all of Canada is bag/tag. Will the bot gain more scrutiny? Do we have a greater risk of a lengthy stop at the border? I'm not sure what the answers to those questions are. I know the Canadian teams tend to be more "bold" with their robot transfers to IRI, the Pittsburgh Regional, etc. but I don't think as much data exists for American teams ferrying their bots in personal vehicles/trailers into and out of Canada.

We'd like to get back to GTR and see some more American teams come up and join us again, but I can say we've truly enjoyed attending new "far" events elsewhere, as trips to the Midwest, Connecticut, DC, and North Carolina regionals since 2008 have all been a blast.

Originally Posted by Vince lau

I can't wait for next season, I've been to every regional since 2002 and I'm not going to miss next years, hoping teams like 233, 217, 48, 45, 522 etc will come back and help celebrate GTR's 10th anniversary

Whoa, 233 in Canada in 2002. Talk about olllllllld school memories. You're making my brain hurt. :-) Let's add 33, 176, 229, 379, 639, and 703, to name a few more.

I'll see what I can do about getting us up there next year. Anyone going to produce a 10th anniversary video highlighting the best Canadian/GTR memories of yore? Your regional folks always were good with the promo videos.

[ControlBox]

There were 62 Canadian teams in 2006 and this year only 51 teams. Among those 51 teams this year there were 22 teams that started in 2007 or later. So only 29 out of 62 came back to GTR this year… that’s less than 50% ...

[Koko Ed]

Originally Posted by Travis Hoffman

GTR is always in the initial regional discussion mix for us, but new passport pains are currently the most important factor that harpoon our selection of that event. I believe bussed students on a trip can still get away with birth certificates alone (corroboration?), but most team advisors are reluctant to go through the passport application process.

Transfer of the crate through customs each way was also an added expense and challenge. This is no longer an issue, but we are still not certain how much easier it will be to haul a bagged robot across the border now that all of Canada is bag/tag. Will the bot gain more scrutiny? Do we have a greater risk of a lengthy stop at the border? I'm not sure what the answers to those questions are. I know the Canadian teams tend to be more "bold" with their robot transfers to IRI, the Pittsburgh Regional, etc. but I don't think as much data exists for American teams ferrying their bots in personal vehicles/trailers into and out of Canada.

We'd like to get back to GTR and see some more American teams come up and join us again, but I can say we've truly enjoyed attending new "far" events elsewhere, as trips to the Midwest, Connecticut, DC, and North Carolina regionals since 2008 have all been a blast.



Whoa, 233 in Canada in 2002. Talk about olllllllld school memories. You're making my brain hurt. :-) Let's add 33, 176, 229, 379, 639, and 703, to name a few more.

I'll see what I can do about getting us up there next year. Anyone going to produce a 10th anniversary video highlighting the best Canadian/GTR memories of yore? Your regional folks always were good with the promo videos.

Don't forget 1511.
They won the regional in 2005.

[Travis Hoffman]

Originally Posted by Koko Ed

Don't forget 1511.
They won the regional in 2005.

Well heck let's add in Chuck 84 since we were finalists with them and 1503 that same year. Best use of our 2005 robot ever. Only use of our 2005 robot, ever. There were no other highlights for 48's robot that year save for the Karthik and Amanda Morrison all-star mentor drive team match from IRI, which as far as I know, does not exist on tape, unfortunately. That would have been a great IRI talent show comedy skit all by itself.

I already said 229, but I remember working with a really young mentor named JVN at the Canadian Regional back in 2002 - that was a fun time.

[DonRotolo]

Originally Posted by Travis Hoffman

I believe bussed students on a trip can still get away with birth certificates alone (corroboration?), but most team advisors are reluctant to go through the passport application process.

Land/Sea Travel

Beginning June 1, 2009

* U.S. citizens entering the United States at sea or land ports of entry are required to have documents that comply with the Western Hemisphere Travel Initiative (WHTI), most commonly a U.S. passport, a passport card, a trusted traveler card such as NEXUS, SENTRI or FAST, or an enhanced driver's license.

(taken from HERE)

Note that "Birth Certificate" is not listed.

As to why anyone wouldn't want to get a passport: I'm astounded. You can't go anywhere outside the US without one (well, you can't get back IN to the us without one... ), it's under $100, you can go to almost ANY Post Office to apply, and it's good for 10 years. Personally, I always use my passport for travel, even domestically, since it's almost unimpeachable.

When 1676 visited GTR 2 years ago, we had every kid get a passport (all the adults had one already) even though a birth certificate was adequate. We waited maybe 15 minutes at the border coming back in, no problems at all.

As for the OP, I think that some teams found their budgets a little bit shorter this year as well.

[Molten]

Originally Posted by Don Rotolo

As to why anyone wouldn't want to get a passport: I'm astounded. You can't go anywhere outside the US without one

I think I can explain this. I don't want to go anywhere outside the US. In all fairness, I don't care to go to most of the places within the US. It's not that there's anything wrong with those places. I just don't care to go to them. Partly laziness, partly because I like home too much. I've traveled a reasonable amount on family vacations. Saw the Niagara Falls once from both sides...got really wet...never care to go there again.(sorry, just don't like getting that wet)

My point: I really am not trying to insult any place in particular...it's just that none of them are home.

A question to any that can answer it: How do you explain that you can't take the robot out of the bag? I understand with VEX you can show them the robot(might be wrong), but with FRC you can't really do that. How do you prove to them there aren't explosives or something?

[Rick TYler]

Originally Posted by Molten

A question to any that can answer it: How do you explain that you can't take the robot out of the bag?

If the border security people say, "Take it out of the bag and show it to me" you take it out and show it to them. FIRST rules don't make any difference at all to law enforcement.