[FRC Blog] - NASA Grants and Something New for 2015

[MechEng83]

http://www.usfirst.org/roboticsprogr...g-New-for-2015

NASA Grants Closing

NASA Grant applications are closing tomorrow, October 2nd! NASA grants are only available for teams in the United States. Find more information here.

Something New – The 2015 FRC Game

Wait. Isn’t the new game always, well, new? Yes, but that’s the point of this note. Every year we try to do a little something different. Sometimes a lot of something different. No one should look at any rules from prior years and think “They would never change that”, because we may. Number of teams on an alliance, number of alliances in a match, match length, bumper rules, field surfaces, robot size, every element from prior year games is carefully considered anew every year. You should make no assumptions. This is all we can say, and all we plan to say on this. All will be revealed on January 3, 2015!*

Frank

*Looking at this, if I were a team, and knew nothing about the 2015 game, I might be nervous. Knowing the game, though, I think there’s nothing to be nervous about. OK, almost nothing.

Oh boy. Another non-hint hint....

[dodar]

Originally Posted by MechEng83

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...hreadid=130699

Oh boy. Another non-hint hint....

OMG! Water Game + Yellow Alliance hint at the same time!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

#FrankTooStrong

[thatprogrammer]

I don't think field size will change because of the andymark field being approved for 2015... *MAYBE *

Wonder if we'll be seeing a big change in strategy similar to assists this year.

[nfhammes]

Number of teams on an alliance: 2v2? like FTC and old FRC? Could be interesting.
Number of alliances in a match: Unless they make it 2x2x2x2, would probably make modifying the field really expensive.
Match length: They can change it a bit, but there's event scheduling issues.
Bumper rules: These have changed frequently. Not that exciting.
Field surfaces: Low-friction surface, anyone?
Robot size: I don't see this changing too drastically either.

[notmattlythgoe]

Originally Posted by nfhammes

Number of teams on an alliance: 2v2? like FTC and old FRC? Could be interesting.
Number of alliances in a match: Unless they make it 2x2x2x2, would probably make modifying the field really expensive.
Match length: They can change it a bit, but there's event scheduling issues.
Bumper rules: These have changed frequently. Not that exciting.
Field surfaces: Low-friction surface, anyone?
Robot size: I don't see this changing too drastically either.

This would also cause scheduling issues because you've now drastically dropped the number of matches each team will play.

[MechEng83]

Originally Posted by nfhammes

Number of teams on an alliance: 2v2? like FTC and old FRC? Could be interesting.
Number of alliances in a match: Unless they make it 2x2x2x2, would probably make modifying the field really expensive.
Match length: They can change it a bit, but there's event scheduling issues.
Bumper rules: These have changed frequently. Not that exciting.
Field surfaces: Low-friction surface, anyone?
Robot size: I don't see this changing too drastically either.

4v4 would work too, w/ drivers stations having to fit in the "small" station zones like they did for 2012. This has the added benefit of allowing matches to extend a little in length while not increasing the tournament length -- or allow teams to get in 12 (or more?) actual matches at larger regionals.

[Jon Stratis]

Originally Posted by MechEng83

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...hreadid=130699

Oh boy. Another non-hint hint....

The correct link to the blog is http://www.usfirst.org/roboticsprogr...g-New-for-2015

A little annoying when trying to go there and I just get the same CD page over and over

[The_ShamWOW88]

I know they may have other reasons for this but 4 team alliances gives more credence to why there were 4 team alliances at World Champs last season.

Maybe early premonition?

[BrendanB]

Originally Posted by The_ShamWOW88

I know they may have other reasons for this but 4 team alliances gives more credence to why there were 4 team alliances at World Champs last season.

Maybe early premonition?

Maybe its how they plan to fit more teams at the championship without adding more fields?

[MechEng83]

Originally Posted by Jon Stratis

The correct link to the blog is http://www.usfirst.org/roboticsprogr...g-New-for-2015

A little annoying when trying to go there and I just get the same CD page over and over

Sorry about that. I clicked in the wrong tab when I copied the link... Fixed now.

[notmattlythgoe]

Originally Posted by BrendanB

Maybe its how they plan to fit more teams at the championship without adding more fields?

I'm trying to imagine the logistic of fitting 8 robots onto one field without changing the size limitations on the robots again. Especially if we see some field obstacles added to the field again. That would be one crowded field.

[Andrew Schreiber]

Originally Posted by MechEng83

4v4 would work too, w/ drivers stations having to fit in the "small" station zones like they did for 2012. This has the added benefit of allowing matches to extend a little in length while not increasing the tournament length -- or allow teams to get in 12 (or more?) actual matches at larger regionals.

Core issue with that is that it becomes a nightmare for small events.

Basically, your pit time is ((Event_Teams/Match_Teams ) - Queued_Matches) * Cycle_Time.

Queued_Matches is typically 2. Cycle_Time is usually somewhere around 8.

((40/6)-2) * 8 ~= 32
((32/6)-2) * 8 ~= 24

((40/8)-2) * 8 ~= 24
((32/8)-2) * 8 ~= 16


Idk, I would like a little more time to fix my bot than 16 minutes.

[nfhammes]

Originally Posted by notmattlythgoe

I'm trying to imagine the logistic of fitting 8 robots onto one field without changing the size limitations on the robots again. Especially if we see some field obstacles added to the field again. That would be one crowded field.

At least with defensive bots as a fourth spot for queuing on either side, queuing at most events wouldn't be impacted too significantly. But loading-on, even if each alliance queues in on one side, and isn't disrupted by robots getting off, would add some to match cycle time. Which is admittedly less of an issue when each match gives 8 plays, rather than 6.

[Justin Montois]

We talk each year when game hints come out about how the hint could mean big changes to field shape, alliances ETC. I think this is confirmation that something along those lines is coming so there's definitely cause for excitement!

Expanded championship, expanded alliance size? More teams, more matches, more teams in each match?

[notmattlythgoe]

Originally Posted by nfhammes

At least with defensive bots as a fourth spot for queuing on either side, queuing at most events wouldn't be impacted too significantly. But loading-on, even if each alliance queues in on one side, and isn't disrupted by robots getting off, would add some to match cycle time. Which is admittedly less of an issue when each match gives 8 plays, rather than 6.

I'm more talking about match play. These fields get crowded with 6 robots playing on them, add in another 2 robots and you end up with clusters or robots not able to move because there isn't enough room. Not much fun to watch or compete in.