14-04-2005 23:00

Karthik

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

That's right, the NiagaraFIRST.org Triplets will be at the Championship Event. When we first started this project in the fall, we wanted all three of our teams to compete at the highest level. By getting them all to Atlanta, we feel that this goal has been accomplished.

These three robots are all ready and geared up to make a big run in Atlanta!

Another major goal was to create a model that could be used to help FIRST grow. We feel that our use of collaboration has done that. I won't get into all the details of the business model here, (a whitepaper will made available after the season) but we feel that we've created something that if used effectively can provide a huge amount of growth for FIRST.

So, I urge any teams who think they're up for the task of helping FIRST grow next season, to come stop by one of our pits and talk to myself or any of our other team members. We'd love to tell you "the story of how one team became three", and give you some guidance so you can do the same.

See all of you in Atlanta...

14-04-2005 23:04

Kims Robot

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

Yeah!!! that is so cool... all the triplets together again! Im sad to see they arent in Newton, we are gonna miss our allies!

14-04-2005 23:06

Jeff Rodriguez

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

Which one is the oldest?

14-04-2005 23:10

Karthik

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

Well we always refer to 1114 as the oldest because it's the original team, and 1680 as the baby because they signed up late this past fall. But when it comes to the actual robots, 1114's bot was the first to get assembled and was used for a lot of the early practice. If my memory serves me correctly 1680 was the second to be assembled, followed very soon after by 1503.

14-04-2005 23:26

Collmandoman

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

I'm curious as to how all of them made it.. it seems to me by FIRST rules one of them is inelligible.. or I dont' know the rules well..
What I know right now is.. rookie teams are not allowed to go to nats unless..
They win
Get rookie allstar award? or maybe another.. regardless it's only one of hte rookie awards.. I think
the big Engineering award
or chairmans
How else can you make it? I need to actually read the rules sometime =/

14-04-2005 23:29

Kyle Love

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

1503 won Rookie Inspiration
1680 won Rookie All-star
Those two awards qualify them for the championships, I believe.

14-04-2005 23:32

Karthik

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

Actually Rookie Inspiration is not a qualifier. Team 1503 was on the waiting list for the Championship. On the Tuesday after the last weekend of regionals, the team received a phone call from FIRST saying that a spot had opened up. Needless to say that the entire team was very excited about the wonderful opportunity.

14-04-2005 23:43

Collmandoman

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

Karthik PLS realize I'm in no way trying to be rude ~ and there is no way to copy paste this without sounding rude.. but somehow I mean it with as much respect as I can


Important: 2005 Rookies are not eligible for to attend the Championship via Open Registration but must qualify to attend per the Merit Based criteria set forth above.

it's just a matter of confusion

14-04-2005 23:54

Cory

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

You're correct. That applied at the beginning of the season though, when only tiers 2 and higher could signup (or whatever it was)

Since FIRST had spaces left, after that registration period had ended, and whenever and veteran teams could have signed up, the teams on the waiting list got in, including rookies.

15-04-2005 00:01

Collmandoman

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

Awesome! good luck you three..
what stumps me is... if your robot is the same.. and you get first seed.. why don't you pick the robot that's exactly the same?!?!

15-04-2005 00:42

sanddrag

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

That's what Chatsworth 22 and the Cheesy Poofs 254 did at SVR and then they won.

15-04-2005 01:04

Cory

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

I think that was more a case of 22 slipping through the cracks, but still very cool.

I waited all last year to see a 254/60 matchup, but I guess 22/254 will have had to make up for that

15-04-2005 01:35

whakojacko

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

Driving skill becomes much more obvious with identical bots, might be a reason for the discrepancies between thes triplets, it was something that was evident with 254 and 22 However theres also the randomness of the qualifiers as well, so it might also be just bad luck. Anyways, gj to all 3 teams for qualifying (2 of them are on curie yay). And wish everybody good luck

15-04-2005 02:18

mtaman02

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

wow i neva seen three robots identical, i'm suprised they all didn't win the same thing =) very close though.


wasn't there a rule that says you can't have more then one robot that looks the same - oh wait neva mind that was if the team built 2 robots identical and used them both at the regional, if im not mistaken that was last year or the year before that.

anywho, good luck at the nationals. i'll come by the pits and say hi to the 3 of them, btw are they all boys or girls =)

15-04-2005 11:11

Rich Wong

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

This is awesome!

But what if, since all three robot siblings are on different fields, all three are in the winning alliances and they all make it on to Einstein. Who will you cheer for?

15-04-2005 14:00

JulieB

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

so you can build the same robot for different teams

15-04-2005 14:24

RogerR

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

actually, according to the pic, 1503 and 1680 are both gonna be in curie, while 1114 is in archimedes.

15-04-2005 14:57

Cory

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

No such rule exists. FIRST to this date, has been completely passive about collaboration.

15-04-2005 15:11

IMDWalrus

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

So far.

If this gets out of hand, though, FIRST will change the rules. I know that there was a lot of discussion on the site when the first two identical robots were revealed during the 2004 season, and I'm a bit surprised this hasn't drawn the outrage that that thread did.

15-04-2005 15:12

neilsonster

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

Our team was at both of NiagaraFIRST's regionals, and I was sort of thinking the same thing before I met the teams (I had the knowledge that they built identical robots). After seeing them play a few matches I was amazed at how differently each team plays, and I quickly lost any thoughts that these were three "clone" teams who planned to carry each other to Atlanta. In fact, I have a video where one of them tips over the other in one of the quarter-final matches we played in Waterloo!

I'm sure those of you in Curie will notice the same things as well. I believe the greatest thing that was accomplished by the NiagaraFIRST "project" was that two different self-sustaining teams were created who have flourished rather than being "subordinates" of their mentor team.

I can't wait to see them again in a few days!

15-04-2005 15:18

Cory

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

I'm not. I don't mean this in a derogatory manner to any other teams that have collaborated, but simply put, no teams that have collaborated were as successful and in the public eye as much as 254/60.

Two powerhouses collaborating? that's a no-no (In the eyes of most)

Two lesser known teams collaborating? Sure, go for it.

Similarly, in 2003, at Sacramento, there were two teams with identical bots. Now why did people not care? Because they were rookies (or second/third year teams), and they didn't do all that well.

15-04-2005 15:50

Karthik

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

The reaction has actually been very positive at both our two regionals. When Team 1114 founded NiagaraFIRST.org and decided upon the collaboration, the goal was not to give our teams a competitive advantage. We did this because we wanted to spread FIRST throughout the Niagara community. We saw the amazing impact FIRST was having on the students from 1114, and we wanted to share this with others.

We knew we that we did not have the mentor base or the funding to start a new team with out stretching 1114 too thin. Using a common design, and engineering and manufacturing approach allowed us to minimize costs and mentor load. Sharing the mentor expertise, equipment and tools, and the workload of manufacturing and assembly enabled us to reap economies of scale.

Most importantly, we were able to seamlessly pass on the lessons we had learned about FIRST. I'm not just talking about the engineering lessons, but we were able to teach the new teams about gracious professionalism. For most rookies, GP is something that they only fully understand after their first season. They learn it by experiencing at the competitions. In our case, by having 1114, 1503 and 1680 working so closely together, the lessons learned we passed along. This collaboration allowed 1503 and 1680 to skip the steep learning curve. They were two rookie teams who stepped into their regionals with poise of veterans, and were able to start spreading the values of FIRST to other rookies!

So, why hasn't there been more outrage? It's pretty hard to argue with a business model that allows for resources to be used effectively and results in three times as many students being inspired, and three times as many communities being excited about FIRST.

More inspired students, more community involvement, less drain on the mentors... Sounds pretty swell to me!

15-04-2005 16:19

Shu Song

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

I agree, I think that what 1114 did for these two rookie teams is great. If we were to ever help start a team, I would like to collaborate with them the the first year.

I see this becoming a norm, that for every team started, there is another team to mentor them. I would love to see that happen.

16-04-2005 13:32

Chris V 1503

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

Hey all, I'm one of the drivers in the niagarafirst.org teams. I'm with team 1503, really all I can say is that with 1114 mentoring us we did pass a large learning curve, it helped us to learn these things alot quicker and made us able to come up with a robot that is actually way better than I had expected at the beginning of the year.

Each team between us has their own driving styles, for example: our three teams have a arm system that all we have to do is push buttons on the controllers and on a button box that we had made and it would do picking up tetra's off the floor, from the auto loader and even a loading position for the human player. It also has the ability to cap goals with these buttons, including the centre goal. The system also had it so we can manually do things incase something was wrong with the program or the robot. Anyone who was at the Toronto Regional would of seen these buttons being used. Myself, I no that 1114 loves to use these buttons, as does 1680 although I don't. At first I found them confusing, at times I still do, especially when your in a match and your being pushed and you have to cap at the same time. But the way we think when we are in a match is totally different. Like as said above when 1114 tipped 1503, when we are in a match against each other, we treat them as they are just a regular team to us. Off the field and at home we work together, have fun together, and even argue together at times.

But I'm am glad we had 1114 to mentor us, I learned more than I ever thought I would in a single year being with them instead of being on our own.

24-04-2005 16:44

Stephen Kowski

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

I had heard good things about these bots, but I was EXTREMELY impressed with 1114's performance in Archimedes....so I assume the others were just as solid. What an impressive job done by the NiagraFIRST.org alliance. Wow!

25-04-2005 22:01

Mr. Lim

Re: pic: The Triplets are Coming To Atlanta!!

We were cheering on the 2/3 NiagaraFIRST alliance too! They didn't make it out of the quarters, but who couldn't cheer for 1503 and 1680 hooking up to make a run for the big prize. Two rookie teams with such great potential.

What a successful year to all three teams!

Friendly rivalry between 188 and 1114 aside, we're looking already looking forward to working with (or against ) you all next year!!!

-SlimBoJones...