12-01-2008 22:33

Andy L

Re: pic: removable electronics

Sorry for no exact rule quote but there is a rule that says that power must be run from power distribution blocks directly no intermediate devices can be used. From what i can see your MAXI Fuse Block is an intermediate device for your circuit breaker.

EDIT: Cleared up what the fuse block was being an intermediate for

12-01-2008 22:44

Dan Petrovic

Re: pic: removable electronics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy L Sorry for no exact rule quote but there is a rule that says that power must be run from power distribution blocks directly no intermediate devices can be used. From what i can see your MAXI Fuse Block is and intermediate device.

All circuit breaker distribution panels must be connected directly to the power
distribution block. No intermediate connections are permitted.

12-01-2008 22:47

Chuck Glick

Re: pic: removable electronics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy L Sorry for no exact rule quote but there is a rule that says that power must be run from power distribution blocks directly no intermediate devices can be used. From what i can see your MAXI Fuse Block is and intermediate device.

12-01-2008 22:49

mluckham

Re: pic: removable electronics

I don't see the main circuit breaker - is that off-board also (near the battery)?

But according to the power distribution diagram http://www.usfirst.org/uploadedFiles...on_Diagram.pdf they have the Maxi breaker block wired correctly.

12-01-2008 22:51

mluckham

Re: pic: removable electronics

BUT - I don't think the way they wired the other breaker panel to the MAXI block is correct.

12-01-2008 22:52

lukevanoort

Re: pic: removable electronics

Yeah, the problem isn't with the MAXI block, it is the ATC block. The ATC block is getting + power from a wire connected to the maxi block. That is illegal and I think that is what Andy L was talking about.

12-01-2008 22:53

Chuck Glick

Re: pic: removable electronics

Quote:

Originally Posted by mluckham BUT - I don't think the way they wired the other breaker panel to the MAXI block is correct.

12-01-2008 22:56

Aren_Hill

Re: pic: removable electronics

you don't "have" to use the 40 amp maxi block. Last year due to how our teams drivtrain was setup we decided we didn't want the weight of the thing and just put 30 amps breakers to the cims and fischerprices. No rule disallowing it

12-01-2008 22:58

lukevanoort

Re: pic: removable electronics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuck Glick No rule is broken from what I see, they just wired the Maxi and breaker panel in parallel. Both are still receiving 12v with no shorts. I'm 99.9% thats legal, but thats all up to your inspector at comp.

12-01-2008 23:01

Andy L

Re: pic: removable electronics

sorry about my first post being misunderstood the MAXI fuse block is being intermediate for the circuit breaker which is illegal

12-01-2008 23:03

falconmaster

Re: pic: removable electronics

Could we get more feedback from more people. The four girls working on the electronics used a picture that was posted on cd that they though was great. I think it was Madison's team 488. It looks to me that the maxiblock is parallel to the normal fuse panel. Does anyone else see it. They were just trying to cut down weight by not having to use another red distribution block.

12-01-2008 23:04

Andy L

Re: pic: removable electronics

Quote:

Originally Posted by falconmaster Could we get more feedback from more people. The four girls working on the electronics used a picture that was posted on cd that they though was great. I think it was Madison's team 488. It looks to me that the maxiblock is parallel to the normal fuse panel. Does anyone else see it. They were just trying to cut down weight by not having to use another red distribution block.

12-01-2008 23:06

JBotAlan

Re: pic: removable electronics

Strangely enough, we just had a huge debate tonight on this very subject. We decided that there would be too many points of failure electrically; the more intermediate connections you have, the more points it can fail, and the more points it has higher resistance at it. Anyone found that Anderson pairs get warm after a particularly hard match? There's your proof that they raise resistance. Another issue we had was we do not have a purpose besides it being "cool" to have this type of board. No matter how we do it, making a removable board would not save time replacing a failed Victor/Spike. We decided it didn't fit our needs, and that we would have a traditional, fixed board. Since every team has a different set of requirements, this may be appropriate for other teams, and that's for them to decide.

What were your criteria with this design? What were you hoping to accomplish? Is it very easy to remove from the robot (not sure if you have a robot built to play with...we don't really...)? Just curious, because I would like to see one of these built, but need to come up with more reasons why.

JBot

12-01-2008 23:08

Andy L

Re: pic: removable electronics

Quote:

Originally Posted by JBotAlan but need to come up with more reasons why. JBot

12-01-2008 23:12

JBotAlan

Re: pic: removable electronics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy L those victor screws suck sometimes when you're pressed for time

12-01-2008 23:16

Andy L

Re: pic: removable electronics

Quote:

Originally Posted by JBotAlan Yes, if you use ring terminals. Use spade terminals, and all you have to do is spin the screw about a quarter turn and pull on the terminal...it comes right out.

12-01-2008 23:19

falconmaster

Re: pic: removable electronics

Ok I saw the other post, I will break the news to the girls....

12-01-2008 23:19

mluckham

Re: pic: removable electronics

The Power Distribution Diagram PDF that I posted (from the FIRST website) is quite specific.

As for the quick-disconnects on the Victor outputs, which is mainly what you are trying to achieve, I think that's a great idea (as long as they don't disconnect, when you don't want them to )

13-01-2008 04:08

Richard McClellan

Re: pic: removable electronics

I like the Powerpoles We're using the same sort of setup on our electronics this year, with powerpole connectors coming off of all the output wires for easy removable if necessary.

13-01-2008 11:45

Madison

Re: pic: removable electronics

Forgive me for knowing next to nothing about the robot's electrical systems, but we did slightly rewire things in light of the feedback we received here. We added another of the red blocks to the DIN rail, so we have two 6 AWG wires heading to components instead of one daisy-chaining them together.

I'll ask Fred if he has a more recent photo to share.

15-01-2008 01:13

Eugene Fang

Re: pic: removable electronics

17-01-2008 11:33

Fred Sayre

Re: pic: removable electronics

Yes, we changed the board by adding another red block to the distribution block and another 6awg wire. I am flattered that you guys are using our board as a template

I always wanted to clean up the electronics to aid in diagnosing and troubleshooting problems, but what I found is that when you have a clean electronics board, you have much fewer (if any) problems! It solves the problems instead of making them easier to deal with

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pikat The power distribution diagram shows that the 3 breaker panels (one maxi and 2 others) have separate positive wires to the power distribution block. however, the negative terminal from the second breaker panel goes to teh first breaker panel and then into the power distribution block. isn't that a violation of the rule that "All circuit breaker distribution panels must be connected directly to the power distribution block"?

17-01-2008 17:00

falconmaster

Re: pic: removable electronics

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fred Sayre Yes, we changed the board by adding another red block to the distribution block and another 6awg wire. I am flattered that you guys are using our board as a template I always wanted to clean up the electronics to aid in diagnosing and troubleshooting problems, but what I found is that when you have a clean electronics board, you have much fewer (if any) problems! It solves the problems instead of making them easier to deal with Good eye! This would seem like a violation to me, but maybe the intent of the rule is only for positive connections? But that seems like a very mixed-message. Ultimately positive and negative routes go through one wire at the battery, and if done right the intermediate connections can be as good as the yellow bridge connections on the power distribution block. Oh well, I still do understand the purpose of the rule though :/

17-01-2008 17:07

MiniNerd24

Re: pic: removable electronics

Quote:

Originally Posted by falconmaster loading photo ...