30-03-2015 15:51

nuclearnerd

Re: pic: Top 10% OPRs compared via standard deviation distribution - 2008-2015

Thanks for this. The chart really shows how the top 2-3% (maybe 50 teams) earn a much larger share of the points than the average team, more so than any other year (and a huge jump from 2014).

It's good to see that there doesn't appear to be a broader trend towards less equal OPR distributions over time. RR seems to be an outlier.

30-03-2015 16:01

IKE

Re: pic: Top 10% OPRs compared via standard deviation distribution - 2008-2015

Thanks for posting. I have made of looked at this sort of trend for a handful of years, but use a different normalizing function.

To a certain degree, I expect that the 2015 data might decrease a bit thanks to weeks 5&6. There will be more teams playing their 2nd event during those weeks which will raise the median pervormance quite a bit.

30-03-2015 16:30

JamesBrown

Re: pic: Top 10% OPRs compared via standard deviation distribution - 2008-2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by IKE Thanks for posting. I have made of looked at this sort of trend for a handful of years, but use a different normalizing function. To a certain degree, I expect that the 2015 data might decrease a bit thanks to weeks 5&6. There will be more teams playing their 2nd event during those weeks which will raise the median pervormance quite a bit.

30-03-2015 16:41

nuclearnerd

Re: pic: Top 10% OPRs compared via standard deviation distribution - 2008-2015

Here's another way of looking at some of the same data. I'm just showing histograms of OPRs between 2015 (the most skewed game) and 2014 (one of the least skewed games), normalized by standard deviation as Richard has done:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B16...ew?usp=sharing

The difference between the games isn't as stark as I thought. Certainly there were more people with OPRs in the 0.5 to 1.5 SD range in 2014 than there are this year, but the curves are otherwise remarkably similar. That said, 1114's placement way out at 6.25 SD looks all the more impressive on this chart!

30-03-2015 18:45

Citrus Dad

Re: pic: Top 10% OPRs compared via standard deviation distribution - 2008-2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by nuclearnerd Here's another way of looking at some of the same data. I'm just showing histograms of OPRs between 2015 (the most skewed game) and 2014 (one of the least skewed games), normalized by standard deviation as Richard has done: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B16...ew?usp=sharing The difference between the games isn't as stark as I thought. Certainly there were more people with OPRs in the 0.5 to 1.5 SD range in 2014 than there are this year, but the curves are otherwise remarkably similar. That said, 1114's placement way out at 6.25 SD looks all the more impressive on this chart!

30-03-2015 18:49

Citrus Dad

Re: pic: Top 10% OPRs compared via standard deviation distribution - 2008-2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by JamesBrown It is possible, but I think the real driving force this year is the lack of defense. I think the top teams have always been this much better at scoring than everyone else, however facing regular defense from other teams dragged down their average scores significantly.

31-03-2015 09:01

Abhishek R

Re: pic: Top 10% OPRs compared via standard deviation distribution - 2008-2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by Citrus Dad I would go further to say its in part a function of the lack of interdependency, both offense & defense. Our highest score came with only 2 robots on the field (although we would have gotten a higher score if our robot had grabbed a 2nd center can in one of the Sacramento finals with 3 bots on the field.) But that's further enhanced by the technical challenge of capping stacks which is akin to climbing beyond the first level of the pyramid in 2013. Not many teams could do that back then either.

31-03-2015 11:04

nuclearnerd

Re: pic: Top 10% OPRs compared via standard deviation distribution - 2008-2015

Here are the two histograms again, but this time I've clipped the top of the scale so we can focus on the "tails" (the 50 or so teams at the top and bottom of the distribution). I also screwed up the last plot and didn't show 2056 with an OPR at ~6 SD above the mean. 2056 and 1114 look lonely out there

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B16...ew?usp=sharing

31-03-2015 17:16

Citrus Dad

Re: pic: Top 10% OPRs compared via standard deviation distribution - 2008-2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by nuclearnerd Here are the two histograms again, but this time I've clipped the top of the scale so we can focus on the "tails" (the 50 or so teams at the top and bottom of the distribution). I also screwed up the last plot and didn't show 2056 with an OPR at ~6 SD above the mean. 2056 and 1114 look lonely out there https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B16...ew?usp=sharing

31-03-2015 22:09

Caleb Sykes

Re: pic: Top 10% OPRs compared via standard deviation distribution - 2008-2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by Citrus Dad What's absurd is that there are 60 teams BELOW the bottom of last year's distribution.

31-03-2015 22:15

Woolly

Re: pic: Top 10% OPRs compared via standard deviation distribution - 2008-2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caleb Sykes Not really, it is easier to accidentally hurt your own alliance this year than it was last year.

31-03-2015 23:27

Caleb Sykes

Re: pic: Top 10% OPRs compared via standard deviation distribution - 2008-2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by Woolly G40 would like a word with you.

31-03-2015 23:54

Pretzel

Re: pic: Top 10% OPRs compared via standard deviation distribution - 2008-2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by Woolly G40 would like a word with you.

01-04-2015 16:09

Citrus Dad

Re: pic: Top 10% OPRs compared via standard deviation distribution - 2008-2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caleb Sykes You're absolutely right, I had forgotten about penalties. I wonder how these graphs would compare if the OPRs from last year incorporated penalties.

01-04-2015 16:30

Caleb Sykes

Re: pic: Top 10% OPRs compared via standard deviation distribution - 2008-2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by Citrus Dad Pretty sure last year's OPR included penalties, as with all previous years. The OPR calculation is simply a regression analysis on the total final score for each match with a dummy variable for each team. So I go back to my original comment that the low end spread is quite interesting. I think it might be reflective of how difficult it is for a newer or less experienced team to contribute to the game, but I didn't think they could detract so much. BTW, there are special statistical properties to include when running regressions with a continuous dependent variable (score) and 0-1 dummy variables (i.e., whether a team is present on the alliance). I haven't looked at that issue for quite a while so I don't remember much beyond that but it is a consideration in the OPR estimation.

01-04-2015 18:10

Ether

Re: pic: Top 10% OPRs compared via standard deviation distribution - 2008-2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caleb Sykes What I am curious about is an alternate OPR calculation for last year which would use the following formula in the match score matrix instead of the nominal score: adjusted score = (nominal score) - (penalty points incurred by opposing alliance) + (penalty points incurred by this alliance) Actually, I do remember uOPR (unpenalized OPR) being calculated last year. Was this the method of obtaining that? Or did it just subtract out all penalty points incurred without adding any back in?

L2s	Final Score OPR
L2f	Foul OPR
L2h	Hybrid OPR
L2t	TeleOp OPR
L2os	Opponent's Final Score OPR
L2of	Opponent's Foul OPR
L2oh	Opponent's Hybrid OPR
L2ot	Opponent's TeleOp OPR
As	Average Final Score
Af	Average Foul
Ah	Average Hybrid
At	Average TeleOp
Aos	Opponents Average Final Score
Aof	Opponents Average Foul
Aoh	Opponents Average Hybrid
Aot	Opponents Average TeleOp
uOPR	unpenalized OPR = L2s - L2f
uDPR	unpenalized DPR = L2os - L2of
uCCWM	unpenalized CCWM = uOPR - uDPR
EPA	uOPR - (As - Af)
M	Matches Played

01-04-2015 18:49

Conor Ryan

Re: pic: Top 10% OPRs compared via standard deviation distribution - 2008-2015

There are more teams this year than ever before. The 1% is getting bigger and more elite ever year.

More than anything I think this statistic is showing the complete absence of defense from this years game.

01-04-2015 18:53

smurfgirl

Re: pic: Top 10% OPRs compared via standard deviation distribution - 2008-2015

Thanks for sharing this - it's really interesting!

01-04-2015 22:29

Caleb Sykes

Re: pic: Top 10% OPRs compared via standard deviation distribution - 2008-2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ether Is this at all helpful?

02-04-2015 16:48

Citrus Dad

Re: pic: Top 10% OPRs compared via standard deviation distribution - 2008-2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by Conor Ryan There are more teams this year than ever before. The 1% is getting bigger and more elite ever year.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Conor Ryan More than anything I think this statistic is showing the complete absence of defense from this years game.