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DataZ For FRC

DataZ_Info

By: DataZ_Info
New: 11-08-2017 09:07 PM
Updated: 11-08-2017 09:24 PM
Views: 725 times


DataZ For FRC

So we heard the FIRST community likes stats...

https://youtu.be/YVmLe9NWlgM

Discussion

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11-08-2017 09:47 PM

Brian Maher


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

So, it'd be pretty cool if you provided some info on what DataZ is. You don't provide anything to go off of and a lot of people just don't care enough to click a random YouTube link without any other info to entice them.



11-08-2017 09:56 PM

NShep98


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bkeeneykid View Post
Hate to be that guy, but....


This is an abuse of the word teaser.
Is it safe to bring this back?



11-08-2017 09:56 PM

DataZ_Info


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Maher View Post
So, it'd be pretty cool if you provided some info on what DataZ is. You don't provide anything to go off of and a lot of people just don't care enough to click a random YouTube link without any other info to entice them.
Fair Comment.

Does that help? (It should have tied back to the picture in the Image Gallery)



11-08-2017 09:57 PM

Bkeeneykid


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

Quote:
Originally Posted by NShep98 View Post
Is it safe to bring this back?
Always good to know I can be memed in separate threads.



11-08-2017 10:02 PM

frcguy


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

Should I report this or something?



11-08-2017 10:10 PM

marshall


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

Quote:
Originally Posted by frcguy View Post
Should I report this or something?
Report it to the awesome police.



11-08-2017 10:22 PM

briansmist


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

After a few minutes of internet sleuthing, I've found that of the 2 FRC teams mentioned, one is sponsored by Zebra Technologies and the other is hosting an off-season invitational on Long Island in a couple of weeks. If I had to guess, I'd say someone at Zebra has adapted the RFID chips they use to track professional athletes to track FRC robots, and we'll be seeing a demo of this at the event.



11-08-2017 11:30 PM

Andrew Schreiber


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bkeeneykid View Post
Always good to know I can be memed in separate threads.
You either die a poster or live long enough to see yourself become a meme.



11-08-2017 11:35 PM

marshall


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Schreiber View Post
You either die a poster or live long enough to see yourself become a meme.
I'm a poster too, Andrew, can you meme me?



11-09-2017 12:08 AM

NShep98


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

Quote:
Originally Posted by marshall View Post
I'm a poster too, Andrew, can you meme me?
Ah, but Marshall, the meme was you all along.



11-09-2017 10:25 AM

SenorZ


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

I watched the video backwards.

Didn't help.

Though the grid is 54x27...
But robots cannot drive through the airships. So I'm baffled.



11-09-2017 12:33 PM

DataZ_Info


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

Quote:
Originally Posted by SenorZ View Post
I watched the video backwards.

Didn't help.

Though the grid is 54x27...
But robots cannot drive through the airships. So I'm baffled.
You caught us, the area was cleared for this data set

Longest Distance Traveled: Square 88.64ft
Highest Peak Velocity: Circle 12.57 ft/s
Highest Delta Velocity: Circle 9.52 ft/s/s
Highest Angular Velocity: Triangle 122.29 deg/s

Would this be useful for scouting?
What about post match diagnostics?
Training?



11-09-2017 12:38 PM

Thayer McCollum


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

It could be useful for scouting, but everyone would need to use it.

I think it would be best for analyzing your own teams' actions in a match. I would love to be able to watch how efficient my cycles were this year. This would be an excellent tool to watch use for a driver to see what they actually did in a match.



11-09-2017 12:45 PM

DataZ_Info


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thayer McCollum View Post
It could be useful for scouting, but everyone would need to use it.
You're right, what good is it of only one team had access to it...
We would probably have to make this available to all teams at an event
Then of course keep the data public for the entire season



11-09-2017 01:28 PM

nuclearnerd


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

I am very excited by this technology. There are lots of possibilities: Better autos (depending on resolution), better scouting, better Driver feedback, better post-match strategy analysis etc etc.

If you don't mind, can you give us rough idea of budget costs for an RTLS tag and antenna unit?



11-10-2017 11:15 AM

DataZ_Info


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

Quote:
Originally Posted by nuclearnerd View Post
I am very excited by this technology. There are lots of possibilities: Better autos (depending on resolution), better scouting, better Driver feedback, better post-match strategy analysis etc etc.

If you don't mind, can you give us rough idea of budget costs for an RTLS tag and antenna unit?
We believe this is very exciting technology as well! We also believe that the possibilities for it are far reaching.

Our goal is to make this system and its collected data available to all teams.

Stay tuned for more



11-10-2017 11:23 AM

jlmcmchl


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

I'm also intrigued by the potential for applying this to FRC and training drivers in defense and overall strategy.

On your website, it notes that the resolution for this system in an NFL game is about 6". Would this improve with the reduction in field size for FRC?



11-10-2017 11:45 AM

tr6scott


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

Quote:
Originally Posted by jlmcmchl View Post
On your website, it notes that the resolution for this system in an NFL game is about 6". Would this improve with the reduction in field size for FRC?
Yes, the resolution is proportional with the area covered, and can be improved with additional access points. (We have done Wherenet proof of concept in my work shop, I am sure the hardware and software triangulation has improved over the last 5 years too.)



11-10-2017 12:19 PM

DataZ_Info


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

Quote:
Originally Posted by tr6scott View Post
Yes, the resolution is proportional with the area covered, and can be improved with additional access points. (We have done Wherenet proof of concept in my work shop, I am sure the hardware and software triangulation has improved over the last 5 years too.)
The NFL’s system's accuracy is determined by the ability to synchronize and not necessarily the area covered, under a certain amount.
By the way, Wherenet is also a Zebra product and advertises an accuracy of about 1 meter.

Yes, the NFL system that we are planning on using is worst case accurate to about 6 inches.
In our testing on FRC sized fields, we have seen some better accuracy than that. However, based on our experience with FRC auto modes, it is probably not accurate enough to fully control them.



11-10-2017 12:33 PM

Woolly


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

Would it be possible to also rfid tag game pieces for stats like launch speed or better ability to determine things like possession or even scoring automtically? There would be quite a few applications for the data from both the GDC and the teams' perspectives. Ex: determining if your game piece was actually scored in auto and depending on that info either pick it up and try again or get in a strategic position for teleop.



11-10-2017 01:10 PM

DataZ_Info


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

Quote:
Originally Posted by Woolly View Post
Would it be possible to also rfid tag game pieces for stats like launch speed or better ability to determine things like possession or even scoring automtically? There would be quite a few applications for the data from both the GDC and the teams' perspectives. Ex: determining if your game piece was actually scored in auto and depending on that info either pick it up and try again or get in a strategic position for teleop.
Currently every NFL football has 2 tags in it capable of tracking much of this data. While this could be possible for FRC game pieces it would most likely be more suited to 2014 or 2016 style games with larger heavier game pieces. Affixing tags to hundreds of pieces of fuel without affecting flight characteristics might be a stretch. Gears however...



11-10-2017 04:20 PM

Thayer McCollum


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

Quote:
Originally Posted by DataZ_Info View Post
We believe this is very exciting technology as well! We also believe that the possibilities for it are far reaching.

Our goal is to make this system and its collected data available to all teams.

Stay tuned for more
Any ideas on when we would know how this would be implemented?



11-10-2017 05:20 PM

DataZ_Info


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thayer McCollum View Post
Any ideas on when we would know how this would be implemented?
Implementation is a multi-step process. The next step is a Beta at an off season event. We will continue to release information until then. After the Beta we will release the results as well as more implementation details.



11-10-2017 10:22 PM

Skyehawk


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

This looks SICK. Even if it was illeagle on a competition field I would be stoked to see it on bots at an off season event. We were considering RFID for some scouting data transfer, but this is way cooler. I have considered doing some computer tacking algorithms with optical flow for path efficency. But that is plauged by a number of issues invluding processing time, camera FOV, other optical obstructions, and edge case handling.

Imagine if you had access to your alliance parteners locations and the DS could recommend a clockwise or counter clockwise cycle!! Huge potential, I will be interested to see where this goes.

Please excuse spelling errors, on mobile.



11-11-2017 02:18 PM

Dominick Ferone


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

Having seen some of the interesting programming work Pat-Med and Half Hollow Hills has done over the years I certainly am intrigued. if you need any Beta testers I may have a be able to get a few different teams across NY to help.



11-11-2017 11:34 PM

DataZ_Info


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skyehawk View Post
This looks SICK. Even if it was illeagle on a competition field I would be stoked to see it on bots at an off season event.

Imagine if you had access to your alliance parteners locations and the DS could recommend a clockwise or counter clockwise cycle!! Huge potential, I will be interested to see where this goes.
The RFID technology has been proven Wi-Fi friendly. We have experimented with numerous Wi-Fi controlled robots with no adverse effects. We have also demonstrated this system to an FTA and LRI and after that demo we were given the go-ahead to run the system at an off season event on 11/18/17

We also agree there is huge potential for the data this system is capable of collecting!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominick Ferone View Post
Having seen some of the interesting programming work Pat-Med and Half Hollow Hills has done over the years I certainly am intrigued. if you need any Beta testers I may have a be able to get a few different teams across NY to help.
We are very happy to be working with Team 329 students and mentors on a program for interpreting and viewing the data from an FRC perspective and we cannot thank Team 3624 enough for allowing their event to be used as a beta site!

Thanks for the beta test offer! After the invitational we will be looking for additional sites to further evaluate the system.



11-15-2017 02:30 PM

DataZ_Info


Unread Re: pic: DataZ For FRC

We have released a new Teaser in this thread:https://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/s...hreadid=160094



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