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Swerve drive inside a Power Cube

By: Mads Eskildsen
New: 06-19-2018 10:49 PM
Updated: 06-20-2018 07:17 AM
Views: 2357 times


Swerve drive inside a Power Cube

So I finally did it. I was able to fit a swerve drive with full FRC components inside a power cube (13inx13inx11in), What can I say I was bored. This was a daunting task and took quite the time in cad. It currently runs a 64:1 bag motor for steering and a 6:1 CIM for a free speed of 15.5 ft/s an adjusted speed of 12.56 ft/s. I don't know if it will ever be built, most likely not, but if does it will probably be during the fall. Any feedback would be appreciated.

Additional pictures of the module and the power cube: https://imgur.com/a/mJzwpr2

Swerve module post: https://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=165539

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06-19-2018 11:56 PM

Ernst


Unread Re: pic: Swerve drive in a Power Cube

Electrical teams hate him!

Major props for this design. I thought about this all season after teams built robots in totes in 2015, so I'm really happy you did it.

How high is the center of gravity? With the battery and motors that high up, I'd be worried about it popping wheelies and tipping over.

Also, why CIMs instead of MiniCIMs? That change could drop the weight and lower the center of gravity.



06-20-2018 12:01 AM

troy_dietz


Unread Re: pic: Swerve drive in a Power Cube

The only way this could be better is if you were able to fit the entire robot inside the milk crate itself. With the handles, it would make for a great carrying case.



06-20-2018 12:03 AM

pkrishna3082


Unread Re: pic: Swerve drive in a Power Cube

Very cool design and packaging. One question: what's up with those vertical spur gears?



06-20-2018 12:10 AM

nickbrickmaster


Unread Re: pic: Swerve drive in a Power Cube

Quote:
Originally Posted by pkrishna3082 View Post
Very cool design and packaging. One question: what's up with those vertical spur gears?
Those are the steering encoder gears. Check out the original module post, which I will note that you posted in .



06-20-2018 12:14 AM

NerdRage


Unread Re: pic: Swerve drive in a Power Cube

So when this is playing Power Up on the field, other robots will be able to intake it, and climb... earning a double lift!



06-20-2018 02:06 AM

dtengineering


Unread Re: pic: Swerve drive in a Power Cube

Build one and put it on the field for an off-season event.

Let's see just HOW good that vision tracking autonomous routine is, eh?

Jason



06-20-2018 08:32 AM

pkrishna3082


Unread Re: pic: Swerve drive in a Power Cube

Quote:
Originally Posted by nickbrickmaster View Post
Those are the steering encoder gears. Check out the original module post, which I will note that you posted in .
Thought it looked vaguely familiar... all these swerve posts blend together



06-20-2018 08:52 AM

Loose Screw


Unread Re: pic: Swerve drive in a Power Cube

New idea for IRI:

Each alliance has a power cube bot that starts in their opponent's cube pyramid (middle of the base 3 cubes). Playing the Lv3 Force power up activates your alliance's cube bot, which one of your technicians can control from their seat. Robots cannot manipulate this cube bot.

The idea is to be annoying as possible. You can herd cubes, but because of the small size you won't be able to push multiple cubes.



06-20-2018 09:49 AM

Mads Eskildsen


Unread Re: pic: Swerve drive in a Power Cube

Quote:
How high is the center of gravity? With the battery and motors that high up, I'd be worried about it popping wheelies and tipping over.
Inventor says it is a bit above the cent of the cube after assigning everything the proper weight values.

Quote:
Also, why CIMs instead of MiniCIMs? That change could drop the weight and lower the center of gravity.
I chose CIM because I wanted to have the most POWER. Mini Cims would help to lower COG but not that much as the cube weighs 40-60lbs.

Quote:
The only way this could be better is if you were able to fit the entire robot inside the milk crate itself. With the handles, it would make for a great carrying case.
HaHaHaHaHa..... no

Quote:
Very cool design and packaging. One question: what's up with those vertical spur gears?
As nickbrickmaster sayed it is to get a 1:1 steering with the absolute encoder.

Quote:
So when this is playing Power Up on the field, other robots will be able to intake it, and climb... earning a double lift!
I'm not sure if lifts and intakes can safely hold 40-60lb cubes.

Quote:
Let's see just HOW good that vision tracking autonomous routine is, eh?
Oh no the lift is broken, it's not lifting the cube.

Quote:
Each alliance has a power cube bot that starts in their opponent's cube pyramid (middle of the base 3 cubes). Playing the Lv3 Force power up activates your alliance's cube bot, which one of your technicians can control from their seat. Robots cannot manipulate this cube bot.
That would be fun but running cost of this robot it would be expensive. Maybe if you use FTC electronics.


Thanks for all the responses.
Mads Eskildsen



06-20-2018 10:10 AM

JesseK


Unread Re: pic: Swerve drive in a Power Cube

What's the ground clearance? Think you could get it up to 3/4"? With a robot that light, 775's on the drive should be 100% fine.

https://what-if.xkcd.com/5/



06-20-2018 11:11 AM

Richard Wallace


Unread Re: pic: Swerve drive in a Power Cube

This thing has an absurd power-to-weight ratio!

I would be worried that it could launch itself. (G09)

Is an automated gamepiece a robot?



06-20-2018 06:54 PM

21brownz


Unread Re: pic: Swerve drive in a Power Cube

Can confirm that my team is building this next year.



06-21-2018 02:04 AM

GeeTwo


Unread Re: pic: Swerve drive in a Power Cube

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Wallace View Post
Is an automated gamepiece a robot?
TLDR:
Key Questions: Did you add Bumpers, or does it have a PowerCube cover?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buckaroo Banzai
Wall-of-text-answer:
The key rule this year is I01, though obviously it must follow all the R rules as well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2018 I01
The ROBOT must be built by the Team to play FIRSTŪ POWER UPSM. The ROBOT is an electromechanical assembly built by the FIRSTŪ Robotics Competition Team to perform specific tasks when competing in FIRSTŪ POWER UPSM. The ROBOT must include all of the basic systems required to be an active participant in the game – power, communications, control, BUMPERS, and movement. The ROBOT implementation must obviously follow a design approach intended to play FIRST POWER UP (e.g. a box of unassembled parts placed on the FIELD, or a ROBOT designed to play a different game, does not satisfy this definition).
With the addition of securely mounted bumpers, this robot is capable of the basic needs, and can do several POWER UP↗ functions, most notably pushing a cube into the exchange or to set up an alliance partner, and possibly being able to participate in a buddy climb with robots not really designed for a buddy climb. There's certainly no reason to think this was designed to play a previous game (though it might have worked well for several games, most notably 2008 FIRST Overdrive, in a Team 148 Tumbleweed like role).

If you put a yellow power cube cover on it (presumably with holes for the wheels), it would likely run afoul of H07 (emphasis mine).
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2017 H07
You can’t bring/use anything you want. The only equipment that may be brought to the ARCADE and used by DRIVE TEAMS during a MATCH is listed below. Regardless if equipment fits criteria below, it may not be employed in a way that breaks any other rules, introduces a safety hazard (e.g. a step stool or large signaling device in the confined space of the PORTAL are safety concerns), blocks visibility for FIELD STAFF or audience members, or jams or interferes with the remote sensing capabilities of another Team, or the FIELD, including vision systems, acoustic range finders, sonars, infrared proximity detectors, etc. (e.g. including imagery that, to a reasonably astute observer, mimics the Vision Targets used on the FIELD).



06-21-2018 09:48 AM

natth4545


Unread Re: pic: Swerve drive in a Power Cube

The nice thing is that, to climb, another team can jut put the robot on their cube lifter.



06-26-2018 10:55 AM

Spock81


Unread Re: pic: Swerve drive in a Power Cube

Why didn't you use 775 pros instead of Cims? I know they're not great if you're stalling them but it seems like they'd manage ok in this application.



06-26-2018 08:36 PM

philso


Unread Re: pic: Swerve drive in a Power Cube

Build it using FTC-sized motors for steering the swerve modules, 775's for powering the wheels and an FTC battery (or two) mounted low down. It might be necessary to limit the voltage to the 775's so they don't burn up but with a low power to weight ratio, the drive wheels might just spin.


Have one of the Technicians on each alliance drive one with covers the same color as their bumpers. If the opposing alliance's powered cube is scored in your vault, it is worth 3 regular cubes (or 6 or 9). If you climb with your opponent's powered cube, the points for that climb is doubled.



06-28-2018 02:59 PM

waxton


Unread Re: pic: Swerve drive in a Power Cube

Quote:
Originally Posted by philso View Post
Have one of the Technicians on each alliance drive one with covers the same color as their bumpers. If the opposing alliance's powered cube is scored in your vault, it is worth 3 regular cubes (or 6 or 9). If you climb with your opponent's powered cube, the points for that climb is doubled.
Chesy Champs?



06-28-2018 03:30 PM

RoboChair


Unread Re: pic: Swerve drive in a Power Cube

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Wallace View Post
This thing has an absurd power-to-weight ratio!

I would be worried that it could launch itself. (G09)

Is an automated gamepiece a robot?
It could be better...worse?

5458 had a 6 CIM on a bot that was 80 pounds with battery and bumpers. That and it was geared to 26 fps single speed >_>

Yes I facilitated them, no I am not sorry, that robot drifted on colson wheels, why are you looking at me like that?



07-01-2018 11:41 PM

Mads Eskildsen


Unread Re: pic: Swerve drive in a Power Cube

Once again thanks for all the responses.

Quote:
What's the ground clearance? Think you could get it up to 3/4"? With a robot that light, 775's on the drive should be 100% fine.
It is currently 1/4", I might have been to crazy

Quote:
I would be worried that it could launch itself. (G09)
Have to get ready for that flying game

Quote:
Why didn't you use 775 pros instead of Cims? I know they're not great if you're stalling them but it seems like they'd manage ok in this application.
Quote:
Build it using FTC-sized motors for steering the swerve modules, 775's for powering the wheels and an FTC battery (or two) mounted low down. It might be necessary to limit the voltage to the 775's so they don't burn up but with a low power to weight ratio, the drive wheels might just spin.
As for all why not use 775 pro or FTC batteries questions. I did this mostly for fun and if you wanted to slap a 775 pro on here it would be quick design changes or a CIMile. As for the FTC batteries I wanted to use full FRC electronics and the battery was one of the biggest challenges.

Quote:
Each alliance has a power cube bot that starts in their opponent's cube pyramid (middle of the base 3 cubes). Playing the Lv3 Force power up activates your alliance's cube bot, which one of your technicians can control from their seat. Robots cannot manipulate this cube bot.
Quote:
Have one of the Technicians on each alliance drive one with covers the same color as their bumpers. If the opposing alliance's powered cube is scored in your vault, it is worth 3 regular cubes (or 6 or 9). If you climb with your opponent's powered cube, the points for that climb is doubled.
A lot of people have also said why not use this for off season events as extras. Doing some quick guesstimation if you want to run swerve with FRC electronics that will run you $3,000 to $4,000 per power cube with electronics (Rio, PDP, VRM, NavX, Motor Controllers, Battery) being most of the price.


Now there might be a very slight chance I get to build this, or a singular module in Preseason. There is still a low chance because of my teams fear of swiveling drives due to my teams pneumatic turning crab drive from 2010.

If you have any other ideas or questions feel free to respond.
Mads Eskildsen



07-23-2018 09:53 PM

baconbot


Unread Re: pic: Swerve drive in a Power Cube

can an alliance partner pick you up and put you on the scale?



07-24-2018 08:07 PM

wsh32


Unread Re: pic: Swerve drive in a Power Cube

Quote:
Originally Posted by baconbot View Post
can an alliance partner pick you up and put you on the scale?
G25



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