It looks like it would be legal if indeed at no point in time while engaged with the edge of the bridge the top and bottom plates of the channel touch top and bottom at the same instant (which would be considered a “grasp”). If enough weight is placed on the bot’s elevated and forward cantilevered ramp it is conceivable that the bottom might not touch the underside of the bridge. Love to see it close up…
That is a brilliant solution for how to get 3 robots on a bridge. I wouldn’t be worried about copycats considering how many robot designs would have to be completely scrapped to attempt anything similar to this.
Good luck this season, this will be a fun robot to watch.
Per FIRST Q & A, Emphasis mine…
Q. Per this rule, would a device that utilizes a passive “appendage” deployed over the center line barrier (bump) to prevent your machine from being moved or twisted when hit (by applying forces to opposing sides of the barrier be considered a violation of this rule? Please elaborate on rule intent.
A. The intent of Rule [G10] is stated in its opening sentence, “Robots may not grab, grasp, grapple, or attach to any Arena structure.” While, we cannot comment on the legality of a specific design, holding on to a field element is considered grappling and a violation of Rule [G10].
Q. Is it permissable for a robot on the bridge to extend a device that can also react off the bottom surface of the bridge provided that device does not grasp the bridge firmly?
A. Rule [G10] does not put a qualifier on how a Robot may legally grasp the Bridge. It simply says it cannot do it.
I feel like they might be in trouble…
Dan looking good as usual ,very good execution of the idea, I almost expected to see a robot from you guys like that this year. Also, we will have no problem climbing up if needed hehe. Good job to the 179 crew as usual.
IF it is illegal, maybe they’ll let them compete because it’s so awesome!
I don’t see how this is illegal. The system does not grasp the bridge. It rests on top of it. The bulk of the robot just happens to be beneath the part doing the “resting.”
Amazing job 179! I was hoping we’d see some creative ways to get the 40 point bonus.
Another potentially problematic rule:
Traction devices may not have surface features such as metal, sandpaper, hard plastic studs, cleats, or other attachments. Traction devices include all parts of the Robot that are designed to transmit any propulsive and/or braking forces between the Robot and the Court.
It appears to me as if a metal contact on the bridge propels the robot upward? However, if this strategy is legal, then it is absolutely brilliant! Nice work!
I initially missed the single contact, I assumed they were reacting on bottom as well.
Can’t see any problems here; great design. Truly epic.
Could be covered in traction material or something… that’s an easy rule to work with.
What concerns me is how do the bumpers work? Unless that ramp is 33 degrees there is no way to put a bumper under it when deployed. (Minimum height for top of bumper is 5")
Fixable with a small piece of rubber/tread.
I’d like to say it’s legal. Looks really cool, and if it is legal, opens the doors to many solutions for 3 robots on a ramp that many teams were too afraid to try.
But does a ‘grappling hook’ grapple?
To me, the photo of their robot says a thousand words, and the third photo from the top shows me exactly why they are legal: the CG of their robot is entirely underneath the flat portion of their hanging mechanism. This means that when the robot is elevated off of the ground, 100% of their weight is supported on the flat portion on the top of the bridge (with no other horizontal or vertical forces exerted in a means that pinches the bridge). The rest of their robot is simply overhanging off the side of the bridge.
This condition is no different than if a traditional 6WD robot drive halfway off the bridge, with a sizable chuck of their robot hanging in free air. For the robot to not fall off, the CG must be over the portion supported by the bridge. And while there may be extra robot volume there hanging beyond (or below) the top plane of the bridge, the robot is still entirely supported only by reacting to the top surface of the bridge.
how do bumpers fit onto this with the ramp down?
Legal or not, I’m worried about the angle of that ramp. I’m hoping teams will be able to climb it without getting stuck.
Looks absolutely awesome!
I can’t wait to see this robot in a action and hopefully use the ramp
By the way, I was also wondering about the bumpers, how is that going to work?
As for the angle, my guess is that most (if not all) robots that can climb the bump can climb this ramp.
Have you experimented with other robots. Obviously that robot is amazingly light, but I wonder if that amount of weight is enough to unbalance the bridge, because it is all on one side.
As I read the definition laid out by the FRC GDC, the Court is defined as an area of 27 feet by 54 feet bounded by the alliance walls and side guardrails, which is covered by carpet. Placed in the center of the Court are three Bridges, which are not defined as part of the court, but as objects placed on top of the Court. Thus I do not see [R06] being a problem with interaction between a robot and bridge, because it clearly states “… forces between the Robot and the Court”.
This is amazing! Kudos!
Judging by the design of this, the rules have been read and pondered over many times. I think it will be fine, though it will cause refs to take a close look.
Thanks Dave, yah the bumpers fit in there. They’re only on the ends 8" long on the rear, plus some other goodies in between. As I said, there are many unseen particulars. Like you said I figure if you can climb the bridge and the bump you should be able to get up this, it’s 22 deg, but if one gets stuck we can give them a lift. This can be used after other bots are already balanced to come in as a 3rd bot or a 2nd on the coopertition bridge where they don’t have to climb it.
As far as bridge weight distribution, there’s a good indication system in the works as to where the weight is on the bridge everyone should be able to see.