2020 Defense Rules

I’m a little unclear on the defense rules this year. When/Where is defense allowed? G10 and G11 were slightly confusing.

Defense is allowed almost anywhere on the field. However:
–If you are in their Target Zone, Loading Zone, or Trench Run, contact with them means they get 15 points.
–If they are in their Target Zone or Loading Zone, contact with them means they get 15 points. (For this and previous, see Figure 7-2. Also note that it doesn’t matter if you hit them or they hit you or both.)
–During the End Game, don’t contact them while they’re in their Rendezvous Point. They get 15 points if they aren’t contacting the Generator Switch, and they get a Hang if they are in contact with the Generator Switch.
And as a special bonus: Don’t contact their Control Panel (color wheel) if they’re in position to spin it.

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Thanks! Answers all my questions and more

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By the way, also take into account G21, G22, G23, G24, and G25. Those govern the type of defense you can play when you do play it.

Also G3: you can’t play defense in your own sector in auton.

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If we adjust their control panel after they have moved it into position and released it, will they lose points the points for moving the control panel? Will the count of power cells towards the next stage reset?

Once you’ve finished the CONTROL PANEL position task, you’ve completed stage 3. There are no more stages, you just get points for scoring balls.

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But what if the opponents change the control panel, so the task has be undone? Because they earned it, do they keep the points or because it has been undone they lose the points?

Pretty sure if they complete it once it cant be undone

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Okay, thanks. Someone on my team thought it might be a valid defense strategy, but they weren’t certain if it would generate any points.

i dont think thats what hes asking about, hes asking about if after they spin it to the correct color, if in the 5 second period it takes to register that it is on the right color someone else moves it to a different color (which is legal w/out penalty), will it cancel that stage until they spin it again. (idk if i explained that well

I forgot about the 5-second wait for the position control to register. I was originally asking about messing with the control panel in general after it had been set, but that’s a good point about during those 5 seconds while it is still being recognized. Would it just cause the alliance to fix the control panel, essentially only delaying the achievement of stage 3? Or would it be illegal?

You mean intentionally modifying the opponents’ control panel? Not allowed

G12. Leave the opponent’s CONTROL PANEL alone. A ROBOT may not contact the opponent’s CONTROL PANEL, either directly, or transitively through a POWER CELL, if
A. the opponent ROBOT is contacting that CONTROL PANEL, and
B. the opponent’s POWER PORT has reached CAPACITY

Violation: Opponents are awarded one (1) SHIELD GENERATOR ENERGIZED Ranking Point if not completed at the conclusion of the MATCH

The thing is you have to have the two conditions for G12 to come into play. If they aren’t touching the wheel, couldn’t you touch the wheel without penalty?

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Most likely no, but either way it wouldn’t do anything. FIRST wouldn’t have points that are able to be undone intentionally, its against the rule on not tearing others down to build yourself up.

Right. Just wanted to get a second opinion on that. Thanks everyone!

Uh… So many things wrong here.

First: We don’t know for sure whether it would remove the points. That’s a field software thing, and possibly worthy of a Q&A.
Second: FIRST has, in fact, allowed descoring in the past. It’s been a while, but they have.
Third: The rule on “tearing others down to build yourself up” is, in point of fact, a Robot Interaction rule, NOT a Game Piece Interaction rule, and specifically bans deliberately damaging/tipping/attaching to/entangling an opponents robot. This is a case where the summary doesn’t match the wording well enough. Summaries/headlines aren’t technically part of the rules, just good summaries.

That said: I would suspect that if someone asked the Q&A in a couple of days whether this was a legal strategy, then there would be a near-immediate amendment to the rule, or a confirmation that it was in fact valid.

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I was mainly saying it wouldn’t do anything because of this:
If a color change is detected during the two (2) second period when the stack light is flashing, the light returns to solid and the
color detection timer resets to zero (0).

The lights signal that a stage has been activated which as far as I can tell from the rules is an irreversible action. The color shown only must last for 5 seconds then it is totally counted and can be changed without removing the score

And the question asked was, very specifically:

If you are able to spin the Control Panel in that time period, LEGALLY, then will it remove/not count the score? 5 seconds is a long time in this game.

As of right now, I’d be inclined to say that the score won’t count, if you can sneak in within that time window and disrupt what your opponent did.

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I understood this when he said lost points as undoing the points gained. However I do see now that I missed a later remark in regards to that, I apologize.