Even for engineers the manual can be hard to interpret right the first time. I’ve found the FRC manual to be as hard to interpret as ISO specs sometimes.
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I’m so lost with this. Why not just score the algae into the net? Isn’t that points being left on the board? The later in the match the HP waits to recoup the points, the more pressure there is to recoup the points and therefore the more likely the HP is to miss, right?
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The net is 2 points less than processor. If your opponent HP decided to run a strategy of not clearing out the processor, then it is possible that your robot is not able to score in the processor.
I thought this strategy was ruled illegal based on:
Assuming your human player is 100% accurate, scoring in the processor is net +2 (+6 for processor, -4 for opponent scoring in net). So, if the other alliance can score 9 in the processor, that’s 18 points. If the human player doesn’t clear the processor until the very end of the match and caps them at 5, that’s 16 points (5*2 + 6 for major foul).
But, you are right there are other factors at play. Human players would be more likely to miss if trying to shoot all 5 in the final seconds of the match. But, they also would be more likely to miss if there are already 10 algae in the net. And, there’s probably value in springing this in a key late qualification match or playoff match after a team has spent all event just filling the processor. Every situation will be different, but I think there are times where this becomes a valuable strategy – similar to taking fouls for extra long pins last season.
To my eye, this human player shot looks comparatively (and intentionally) easy relative to past games. I imagine many HPs will have a high success rate.
Many robots will abandon scoring algae and get ready to climb by the time there’s 20 seconds left. That’s plenty of time to clear 5 algae from the processor, and in general some HPs will likely find it easier to score shooting back to back in a rhythm than just waiting around between shots.
I don’t see why it would, points aren’t worth more at the end of the game than the beginning. If anything, the end is the best time to miss, because that’s when your opponents are least likely to pick up the missed algae and re-score it for an additional 6. As a coach, if I’m ever in a match where my alliance doesn’t have a consistent human player, I’m probably going to suggest they wait until there’s 30 seconds on the board to shoot them for this very reason.
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I’ve come up with a great fix. Write the whole Game Manual in all caps or all lowercase, then there is no confusion…
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If anyone is still concerned that the ROBOT may not get tall enough to dunk in the NET, I have a proposed question that might force at least an implicit answer. I’ve learned over the years (not just from the GDC/Q&A; I’ve been working for the U.S. Government over 35 years; there, you sometimes learn about hidden rules) that sometimes you have to creatively ask a different question to get a useful answer to your real question. So here’s my “question likely to generate an effective answer”:
G417 prohibits certain interactions with FIELD elements: grabbing, grasping, attaching , entangling, and suspension.
The FIELD is only defined in horizontal extent, implying its height is unconstrained.
At least two Zones within the FIELD, the BARGE ZONE and REEF ZONE, are described as infinitely tall.
Neither the ceiling of the host building, nor the structures which support said ceiling nor are supported by it, are listed as FIELD elements. Is it permitted to interact with these structures, particularly in the ways which is forbidden for FIELD elements?
It is understood that if this interaction were used to climb onto a CAGE, our robot would have to disengage from the elements associated with the ceiling for the CLIMB to be scored.
The key point here is to ask about interactions significantly higher than dunking in the NET. If you get a rule limiting height, you’re had done. If you rules forbidding you from interacting with the ceiling elements, again you’re done. There are a few other answers which provide a pretty solid answer.
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“Yes, chute door”
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Do you plan to submit this to the Q&A? If not I’d happy to log in and post it on your behalf from our team account
The G211 blue box specifically states:
J. deliberately, running an AUTO to disrupt the opponent ALLIANCE’S CAGES.
K. deliberately, trying to disrupt multiple opponent ALLIANCE’S CAGES during teleop.
K leaves open the possibility of disrupting one cage intentionally.
So accidental bumps from rogue algae are ok but if it is viewed as intentional by the refs, then it may be a yellow or red card.
As you mention, ROBOT contact is specifically prohibited but the teleop rule (G418) does not prohibit contact “transitively through a scoring element” like G428 does during the last 20s.
Is the point of this question to find out if there is a robot height limit, or to know if it is ok to hang from the ceiling?
I find it confusing the way it is written, and if HQ feels the same they just won’t answer it.
There is no rule banning tall robots this year. So there’s no limit on height. If that isn’t clear to people, ask “is there a robot height limit?”
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Which someone did ask already.
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I am not affiliated with a team at this point, so yes, if you would post that would be awesome, if the height limit question doesn’t get a clear answer.
The first, mostly. Designing something to hang from an arbitrary ceiling is juice almost certainly not worth the squeeze.
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Q18 was answered a few hours ago:
- There is no rule that limits the height of a ROBOT after the match begins. However teams should keep safety in mind when designing ROBOTS. Teams should keep in mind G413, G420, and that some venues may have lower ceilings than others, and should be considered when designing their ROBOTS.
- Additionally, please refer to R104 which provides STARTING CONFIGURATION and as noted in the blue box of G104, ROBOTS need to be safely transported off the FIELD and back to the pits after the MATCH, and there may be bystanders, doorways, or height restrictions along the route.
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Too lazy to confirm current rules. But. Robot are prohibited from contacting things outside the field. Non field things in the overhead are outside the field…
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