It’s close enough to Halloween so bringing back the dead is totally ok…
has anyone found a good alternate source for these bearings? It seems like they are constantly in high demand and in short supply. Is is possible to turn a 1/2" round bearing into a hex with a broach?
Not really, no. The inner race is hardened steel and you will ruin your broach before you cut a good pattern. Bearing manufacturers broach hex bearings before this race is hardened, usually.
If you are desperate for an alternate hex bearing solution and these parts are out of stock, you can buy a 5/8" ID bearing, insert a bronze bushing into the bearing, and broach the bushing to 1/2" hex, but this does result in a larger OD bearing.
We just keep a ton on hand, and restock before we get to a point where it’s critical. If we don’t use them this year, we’ll use them next year.
While I’d like to do this, the cost of ordering an adequate stockpile of bearings at ~$5 a piece can be hard to justify if you don’t know you’re going to use them in a given year.
Matt may snark, but to me stock-outs are a legitimate part of the engineering challenge because they totally happen in the real world. An organization that structures themselves through budget and inventory processes to not get hosed when AndyMark and VEX run out of a staple item deserve the benefits of their position.
This is maybe not strictly answer the question, but we’ve transitioned to using 1/2" ThunderHex in most situations, which has the advantage that, regardless of if we’ve designed to use ThunderHex or standard hex bearings, in 90% of applications, we could use the other bearing style, which means we have options if our first choice is out of stock.
The caveat is that then you’re at the mercy of ThunderHex shaft going out of stock, but designing for ThunderHex often means we can switch to straight hex shaft too (note: does not apply to the newer 3/8" Thunderhex and bearings, because 3/8" T-hex and 3/8" straight hex bearings aren’t the same size.) In a pinch, we’ll find a way to turn down straight hex to ThunderHex.
Is this feasible for every team? No. Is it cheaper than stocking hex bearings and using locally sourced straight hex stock? Not sure. But it is a way to hedge your bets and artificially increase the supply of bearings which may work for any given application, and shaft stock is much easier to modify than bearings.
True, but it’s also a one-time start-up cost. Invest in your initial stockpile, and then through the season you’re ordering what you used, after you used it. So, go run a fundraiser or find a sponsor to invest $500-$1000 worth of bearings, and then you’re just spending like normal each year after that!
Rookie team phones Andymark support:
Rookie team: “Hi, when will your half inch hex bearings be back in stock?”
Andymark: “IT’S PART OF THE CHALLENGE!” hangs up
Rookie team turns around and asks veteran team a few miles away, veteran team is able to provide them some from their stockpile, educate them on common supply issues seen during the build season, and provide feedback on their design. Everyone wins.
And once again, it falls on veteran teams to educate Rookies (and teams in eternal week 1) how to FRC rather than that information coming from some HQ related source initially… because it’s all about that 6 weeks and $5k lie.
must be able to ship any general (i.e., non-FIRST unique) product within five business days of receiving a valid purchase request. **It is recognized that certain unusual circumstances (such as 1,000 FIRST Teams all ordering the same part at once from the same VENDOR) may cause atypical delays in shipping due to backorders for even the largest VENDORS. **Such delays due to higher-than-normal order rates are excused.
From the second page of the Robot Rules. Seems to me that FIRST is already telling teams that products may see longer than normal delays during the build season.
They wrote an exception in the rule because on actual things that have happened in the past. Do you really expect rookie teams to read that on day one of build season and go “Oh boy, we better order $500 of hex bearings from VEX before they run out!”?
Be honest, how many teams do you think have read those in time to do something about it?
If this is a topic that you think would make an interesting discussion (what changes would help prepare rookies for FRC) I have no problem making a new thread on it.
I don’t want to derail this thread. I just had to remark that “oh just rely on nearby teams” is an unsustainable and unhealthy model long term so doesn’t REALLY solve this problem.
Consider the audience of this thread. Chief Delphi is a forum in which teams talk to other teams. I see no issue with providing the advice to stock up on certain components before build season, given that they have an established history of going out of stock. While frustration at the stock depletions can be warranted, shouting at the sky about them isn’t particularly helpful. AndyMark and VEX are almost certainly very aware of the stocking challenges already (considering they’re the ones who run out of stock), so pointing them out doesn’t seem particularly fruitful.
Teams are free to heed or disregard the advice given in this thread based upon their own budgets and other priorities. I don’t see any point at getting angry at those attempting to provide advice. Nobody thinks that this will solve all the issues, they’re just sharing how they managed to overcome the issues for their team.
More realistic:
Rookie Team: “What’s an AndyMark?”
Very true sadly.
To be clear, not trying to disparage Andymark or Vex. I understand the challenges they face and that they try the best to take our money when we want them too (as they should).
Suggesting that stock shortages are an sudo-intentional part of the game challenge is a bit silly.
Also please review the question that Jon was responding too:
Is Jon suggesting that 2177 is a good alternative source of hex bearings for 1086?
(I honestly can’t tell if this is a joke or not. See below.)
We at AndyMark take the subject of out-of-stock items very seriously. We hustle to get things back in stock, and we work hard to communicate out-of-stock updates to our customers as needed. Never have we said this to a team when calling for stock updates.
No, not realistic. We invest a TON of resources into making sure each rookie team gets a very high quality, high performing kit of parts chassis. That blue box is not trivial. We focus a bunch of energy to rookie teams.
I am mostly sure these both are intended to be jokes. But, is that clear to a new CD user? Is ChiefDelphi a resource for FIRST teams, or is it a place to make jokes about each other and pick on each other for good ideas? For people new to FIRST who read these forums and try to get productive content out of this discussion, it may not be very clear.
These are two examples of what makes CD poor these days. I don’t appreciate our efforts at AndyMark to be the butt of a joke when they are not deserved.
Andy B.
Nobody is suggesting that it’s “part of the challenge.” Jon did point out that there’s a warning in the manual regarding stock shortages, but that’s not the same thing as implying it’s a portion of the desired challenge.
All I see is someone responding to a thread with the general question of stock shortages of a particular part. He replied with how his team works around that challenge. That is a useful and beneficial post, even if it doesn’t immediately solve the overarching issue. A whole bunch of people jumping down that posters’ throat afterwards doesn’t seem particularly helpful to anyone involved
