Many users have asked me to apologize in a new thread to CD and Buzz.
I do apologize to team Buzz, I never meant to attack your team (in my defense you have a really old looking senior). I did redact the name when someone told me it should not be done…anyways:
Team Buzz, I apologize if my posts have been insulting to you, I have seen you work and know that you do not do anything that would be considered “bad”.
Secondly, sorry CD, I will not be apologizing for stating my opinion. Especially when I did not name anyone but Buzz (If you get insulted by ignorance or whatever you want to call what I said, that is your problem). You have killed my reputation, and as I have found by doing research on the forums whenever someone says the things I said they get their rep destroyed.
I will not be replying to this thread, unless a member of Buzz requests me to do so.
Again I apologize to team Buzz, but still, I do not apologize to a website or its members as a whole for not liking my opinion or finding my opinion offensive to them.
For everyone here, it is important to remember that this is the Internet- everyone has an opinion. Just because you have an opinion, doesn’t mean you should share it and it definitely doesn’t mean it’s right!
I think that the only bad decision made here was originally posting a video of Team 175, without getting all of the facts and/or permission prior, using it to get your point across.
Your opinion is a valid concern that you share, for which personally I may not agree with in principal. However, if you ease the tone of your post, perhaps others can chime in and give constructive feedback.
I would only suggest that you share your beliefs without making reference to why the opposite is terrible.
On a personal note as to how our team works together to build a robot, it’s not 100% student built.
It’s not because our students dont have all the skills/knowledge/experience to make the concepts that THEY themselves came up with come to fruition.
It is our primary goal to have them do as much as they can, but at the same time, make sure that its realistic in meeting the time constraints as well.
Do what works for you folks, respect others for their own beliefs, and have fun competing in FIRST.
This thread isn’t an apology. Your post basically boils down to “sorry if you were offended, but that’s how I roll”. What do you actually, truly, and sincerely regret doing, if anything? All I can garner is you regret assuming Team Buzz was a mentor-built only team, and now think otherwise.
Everyone is entitled to an opinion (perhaps not entitled to say it, but at least to have it…). People have expressed your opinion on Chief Delphi before without consequence other than respectful disagreement and discussion. Your posts have not received the same reaction. If you’re reading this, which I’m sure you are… I would encourage you to think about that for awhile.
I apologize for calling this out in particular.
Honestly, I find what you are typing to be far more inflammatory than what I have seen in this apology. Even it is warranted, I think that you should at least try to be better than he was. I do not at all see that as gracious professional.
No offense intended but I think that even if I do disagree with the OP, and I may not fully accept the apology, I should not imply that he is not welcome here, which is what I picked up on in your reply. This is more against the whole forum response than to you.
Once again, I apologize if you are offended but I think that the people on this forum should remain gracious even in response to the opposite.
You have killed my reputation, and as I have found by doing research on the forums whenever someone says the things I said they get their rep destroyed.
OP doesn’t understand why what he said was wrong. Most of the people on here are pretty level headed folks, we encourage discussion round these here parts. What we don’t encourage is attacks on teams. If a person could come up with a reason for why mentors should not be involved with the design and fabrication process I’m sure it would lead to interesting discussions (as it has numerous in the past). However, these arguments must be done in a logical and thought out fashion that doesn’t attack anyone.
For example, a good friend of mine and I had an interesting discussion last night about this very topic. You’d be mildly surprised that the points raised towards having more student involvement were actually quite interesting and led to a very cool discussion.
That’s neither here nor there, the point is that we have the freedom to speak our minds but we also have the responsibility to do it respectfully. I may never agree with anything you say but I can respect you if you are able to articulate it in an respectful manner.
And one last thing, while it appears your “reputation” is destroyed… I’ve gotten negrep more times than you care to know, I like to think it is a decent indicator of how well I am articulating my point. The last time was from someone who asked me why I was such a jerk. At first I was a little mad at them but then I cooled down, read what I posted and I did feel like a jerk. I needed that smack in the face to realize that I was being a jerk. I’m just happy they did it privately.
I do not see your opinion as the issue (whether I agree with your opinion is a different story). The issue is the way you conveyed your opinion (accusatory).
In life, many times, we need to present an argument that may be unpopular. Doing so without being inflamatory is a worthwhile skillset.
OMG i am not the only one freaking out about this right?
this post is horrible.
that is the worst form i have ever seen.
this fool has locked his right leg which is bad form and very dangerous. his back leg is bent and he has sickle toe… disgusting. we must stop hatin’ and find the one in the image to correct his form.
ewww his shoulders aren’t level either… bah this just pisses me off.
I think everyone is allowed one tearing into/ranting post on here in their history.
I for one accept the fact of the apology. Just keep in mind every team is different and that one day you yourself will be a mentor if you choose to be.
Good luck and a happy last 8 days of the build. Let’s get back to building.
You shouldn’t apologize for your opinion, but you should apologize to the mentors whom you said were reliving their high school days by “owning a bunch of students.”
Geez, and I thought Michigan was bad. We’ve been lucky enough to not have a snow day yet this build season.
I agree completely. You’re entitled to have your own opinion, however publicly calling people out on that opinion is uncalled for. An apology directed towards the mentors of Buzz in long over due, so even though you said you weren’t going to post on this thread anymore, I hope your still reading them.
No hard feelings, apology accepted…
Maybe I should shave the beard, or wait till after shakedown.
But anyways none of us harbor any hard feelings man, good luck to you guys at scrimmage.
-the “Really old looking senior”
There are different ways to structure constructive criticism.
Incorrect: HA HA! Your robot broke because you suck at wiring. Come at me bro if you don’t like it. HA HA!
Correct: You may have more success if you add strain relief to this point and this point. Also, try soldering your joints as well as crimping them. It can give an added layer of strength to your joints.
One will get people thinking, get a positive response, and generally get you viewed as a helpful individual that has something worthwhile to say.
The other will quickly get you binned as an inflammatory so-and-so.
As a second example,
Incorrect: You’re a bunch of old losers trying to relive your childhood through building robots and ordering people around. You suck.
Correct: I believe that student centric teams give students a better end experience and will help them be more successful in the future. I don’t understand teams that allow mentors to do the majority of the work.
Tact and subtlety are important. It’s also important to remember that the people you are bashing on this board are not just internet posters. In many cases they are extremely successful engineers, managers, and leaders of corporations. You may just end up working for them not so far in the future.
I think this point is important enough to speak up on this matter. I have a couple of things to say.
It may be that those people aren’t even posting on CD. Maybe they’re just looking at it, reading posts. Let’s say it’s 5 years down the road, you’re in college, and you’re applying for your dream internship or job. Someone searches your name, and the search engine pops up a list of posts here, that you generated. They see that you said X, Y, and Z–and maybe those things were not in the best taste. Maybe you’re the best in your field, but if you’re posting on a public forum, and that’s what you’re saying… well, it probably won’t leave the best impression. Good reputations take a long time to build up; as you found out, it’s relatively easy to destroy one.
When that manager finds that post, they may not see it as “young and _____” (you fill in the blank here). They might see it as “anger issues” or “no self-control” or any one of a number of other things that are negative. At that point, Tom’s “You may just end up working for them” becomes “You won’t be working for them”. Why? Because you were “young and ______”.
To Niles: There is one thing you did right the whole time this has been going on. You kept your name (and team) public without hiding behind an anonymous account. Most people who start that type of discussion aren’t bold enough to do that. This apology is another step on the right path. If you learn from this experience, you’ll be well on the way to learning how to voice opinions without needing to apologize for the way in which they’re voiced–and we need to hear more different opinions.
The other thing I’d like to say, and this is to everyone else: I think it’s time to let this die down. Everyone step away, you have a robot to finish in about a week.
