Armabot MicroSwerve

You guys asked for a sub $250 swerve so we decided to give it the college try. We want to get a sense of real demand so we decided to put it up for pre-sale at our best estimate for prices. If the price goes up, well honor the pre-sale orders at the original prices. If the prices go down, we’ll refund the difference for this season.

Well answer some questions on this new product, but some details we don’t know yet, and some topics we won’t comment on until later on in the year.

https://www.armabot.com/collections/frontpage/products/microswerve

Pricing:
1 Base Module ($299 each)
4 Base Modules ($247 each)
1 Base Module with 1:1 PWM absolute encoders ($339 each)
4 Base Modules with 1:1 PWM absolute encoders ($279 each)
1 Base Module with 1:1 Mag encoder mount ($329 each)
4 Base Modules with 1:1 Mag encoder mount ($268 each)

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Coincidence? I think not
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Jokes aside, this looks like a super cool product. You don’t ship to Israel by any chance, right?

Also 299$ isn’t sub-250$, but is still pretty cheap compared to other swerve modules on the market

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Looks really compact, and you can’t beat that price. Any chance we can get a CAD model to take a look inside?

Could we get a cross section view? I’m curious what bearing setup you use for the steering axis, as well add why a cim or mini cim is incompatible. (Perhaps it’s their slightly larger diameter)

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Would you be willing to talk about how you cut costs on this module (what parts are cheaper/reduced compared to a more expensive swerve option)?

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Super interesting. What is the free speed? Is the drive a single bevel gear stage? Definitely curious to see more details.

I’m curious as to the weight, it seems to me like it would be slightly lighter than others but not by like 10 pounds or something ridiculous like that.

Jonathano:
Thank you! Life is better with a few jokes! I added the break down pricing. Yeah, only the quantity 4 base module where you would have to do your own steering encoder would be sub $250. We don’t exclude regions for shipping, though the prices may be expensive. That is a good topic for another thread, weather or not FRC vendors are allowed per the rules to exclude regions…

Ari:
Thanks! I’m planning on releasing the full CAD close to ship.

Bryce:
There is a decent size bearing in there, but we don’t want to release the details yet. I’m guessing that and the Neo details will come out with the CAD. Or if there isn’t enough interest we may change plans.

Plusparth:
We invested in a machine that will help make some of the parts in house, sourced some components overseas, and minimalized the design. There are less speed options than other swerves etc.

Patrick:
Thanks man! BTW your new MK2 is HOT! Free speed is a zippy 17fps. And yes on a single bevel drive.

Gellnick:
We didn’t do the final calc / weight measurement yet. But your right, as everyone keeps making modules lighter, there isn’t much room for weight loss advantage. There are already some super light 3d printed designs out there like 33s’

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Do you have a physical prototype or just CAD?

All of the current products were prototyped before being sold, including this swerve. I’ll get a picture up here on Monday.

So you’re saying the drive is a single stage reduction with jsut the bevel gear stage to get to a final free speed of 17fps? I would be very curious to know what that bevel gear set is, as you would need ~4.4:1 ratio with a 3" wheel, or ~3.6:1 with a 2.5" wheel, and the bevel gear on the wheel shaft would have to be a smaller diameter then the wheel itself obviously. A quick look through KHK’s inventory and I am having a difficult time finding anything that works for those scnearios.

What is the bevel gear set and what diameter wheel are you using on this?

EDIT: Potentially answering my own question here. The feasible solution to this that I can find is a 4:1 bevel ratio using 1.0 modulus bevel gears (picture below shows option). Smaller bevel gear broe would need to be opened up to 8mm. Hard to say if this is possible without CAD model but based on the OD of the hub it looks like 8mm might be okay on that. The OD of the teeth on the 60T gear is at 60mm (2.36") so a 2.75" wheel with this gearset would work and result in 17fps free.

Curious to know if this is basically the setup you have or if you found some other option.

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Nick, you gave me an idea for a fun mini-game / contest.

Here are the rules:

  1. First person to PM me on CD with the correct information below will win.
  2. List the number of gear teeth on each gear in the drive.
  3. Sketch freehand or in CAD an accurate cross section that captures the spirit of the design including main bearing mounting.
  4. Publicly disclosed submissions will be disqualified.
  5. Each person can only submit once.
  6. Team members and mentors of team 5818 are not allowed to participate or give information.
  7. The winner will be announced with a post that shows the information submitted and the date of submission along side the real Armabot CAD.
  8. The winner will receive one free MicroSwerve base module with 1:1 absolute encoder or Mag encoder mounting or $300 off any set of 4 MicroSwerve modules (their choice) if they give me their name and shipping address.
  9. If I’m not allowed to do this per government laws or CD rules I sincerely apologize and contest will be terminated.

Ready Go!

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@Andrew_Duerner My guess as to why a NEO motor is required and a CIM or Mini CIM wont work is because you are using the 4X 10-32 mounting holes in the NEO to not only hold the NEO to the relativity thin main mounting plate, but also to secure the main rotation bearing in some clever way. It would be sketchy to just hold the main rotation bearing and rotating assembly on with just 2X 10-32 screws, but 4 would probably be enough. That’s my guess as to why the NEO is needed :slight_smile: . If that is the case, an Andymark DeCIMate gearbox might also work.

At the end of the day, tough to pre-order a product that literally has no information about it listed on the product page, and only a couple snippets of information listed in this thread. Starting a contest to guess a bunch of key design specs while kind of fun doesn’t really help teams decide whether they should order this product.

I think at a minimum it would be smart to list wheel diameter, gear ratio, free speed (you said above it’s about 17fps), steering ratio and motor, and the general materials things are made out of. Expecting people to order something without some of these basic specs listed is kind of nuts to me, and would find it really hard to justify recommending others order this over the other available options such as the SDS MK2, the WCP Module, etc despite its somewhat lower price point.

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Technically, if you order them in a set of 4, they’re $247 each (bulk discount).

I’m always interested to see new Swerve designs, but we need more than just a picture to even consider buying one, let alone preordering.

All fair and good points. Since the contest thing has been started cant really go back now. There is always the next time to have a smooth release!

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I mean you could go back. And you could also let the community know about some of the details of the product you expect people to spend $250+ on just to preorder…

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Going back on a commitment is not really my style. I’ll give some reasonable time for people to submit, say two weeks, then give some of the details your asking for.

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I would suspend the pre-ordering until then, but that’s jsut me I guess.

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That doesn’t seem logical, its just an option, nobody is forcing anyone to buy anything. Are you just pushing for some other reason?

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