Asking for the rule R101

We want to ask for the design of the intake is legal or not. We really appreciate your help in resolving the problem.



To my understanding that would just be an extension of your frame perimeter, i would make sure you dont violate any of the bumper mounting rules in the process as that can cause a gap between frame and bumper

its legal, but i would make sure you have plates across the whole side for you’re bumpers to not have a gap between the frame(for durability and also i think you have to according to some rule(there’s some max gap you can have in your frame i think)(cant find it rn)) but i would be careful with that intake design there have been a lot of threads about robot durability this year, and the wood side plates may not hold up(a lot of teams have been completely bending their utb intakes(most made of 1/4 (or 1/8) in aluminum and 2x1 in high speed collisions on the field.

edit: i think you do need something rigid in the front of the intake, like a 1x1 or 1x2

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It looks to me like there is no rigid frame component on the front of your intake. The bumpers can not span the gap between the left and right intake plates, as they need to be sufficiently supported by a static frame component.

Also, it looks like the bumpers won’t be supported sufficiently on the sides. Since they’ll be resting on the intake plates, they won’t be touching the rest of that side of the robot. You can solve this by adding some extra plates every 8 inches to give the bumpers enough support.

See R410 for more details.

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We have a similar situation for our intake, so we asked an LRI from Worlds last year and he told us that “as long as there are no gaps greater than 1/4”, no robot inspector is going to have a problem with it." I would be sure to use countersunk bolts and make sure your bumpers are a fairly tight fit. Inspectors should try to fit a 1/4" rod in between your frame and your bumpers and if it does fit, your bumpers are illegal.

Not clear what that blue arrow is intended to represent.

It looks like you have a frame with swerve modules in the 4 corners. It looks like you have attached an intake to that frame. And, it looks like the intake is not articulated – i.e. it is always permanently outside the frame. Further, the front of your intake does not have a solid backing piece going the width of the intake.

You appear to be violating the rules in a couple of ways:

(1) Your intake is going to be considered to be part of your frame perimeter, and that perimeter appears to be longer than 120 inches.

(2) Your entire frame perimeter has to be surrounded in bumpers, and it doesn’t appear that you’re ready to attach bumpers to your intake.

(3) Even if you do attach bumper to your intake, there’s a rule that the bumpers have to be “backed” by a solid piece – the frame perimeter is going to stretch across the front of your intake, and there’s no way to attach bumpers there.

Your best bet is to figure out how to articulate the intake so you can (a) attach bumpers to the original frame of the robot and (b) have a mechanism that allows the intake to be inside the frame perimeter at the start of the match and outside of the frame perimeter when you need to intake.

It’s possible to just drop the intake down at the start of the match and leave it there – there’s no requirement that you have to be able to bring the intake back inside the frame perimeter.

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There will have the aluminum tube at where I draw, and our bumper will regular on the tube by screw and nut

Correct me if I’m wrong, but I do not believe the rules care how or where you mount your bumpers, as long as they will stay on during matches, can easily be removed, and follow all other bumper rules.

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You could do something like this, where a steel/ aluminum bar is in front of the intake in order to mount bumpers and take the force from forward collisions. (We went with steel 1x1)

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Okay, that should provide enough support to the bumpers on the front of the robot. It looks like you drew a circular tube though, I would suggest a box tube for a bit of extra support.

As for your side plates, I would just suggest adding some extra plates along the length of the robot’s frame to ensure there’s enough support on the sides.

“Follow all other bumper rules” is the key. Importantly, bumpers have to be backed by the frame perimeter with gaps of no more than 8". And, the entire frame perimeter cannot be more than 30 inches.

They would need to attach a solid piece to the front of the intake to be able to deal with the backing requirement. And, the square with the swerve drives at the corners appears to be ~28" square. That means the intake cannot extend more then 4 inches, but this one appears to. (Hard to tell from the photos.)

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Assuming your frame is undersized, if there is a gap over 1/4’ inch at the spot, SHIM IT!.

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“All other bumper rules” are rules on where and how you mount your bumpers. And construct them.

I’m seeing what @CEF is seeing and share his concerns, though the legality is largely addressed by the tube planned to be added to the front. Before that, I didn’t see a way to mount the bumpers that satisfied R410. It’s still not the sturdiest thing in the world, but I believe it’s legal.

I think that frame perimeter with intake is just inside 120" as well. It appears to be 27" square without the intake by my eye, and I’d believe that intake is just inside 6".

This is all a bit off-topic, though; OP’s question was about whether the side plates affect the geometry of the frame perimeter. I’d agree with extending the side plates along the length of the robot to make the whole thing flush.

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See how we solved this exact issue in our build blog.
The 2x1 frame member across the front is the frame perimeter.

Our swerve drive is about 26”*26” square, we sure that the frame perimeter with intake is just inside 120".

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Your design is pretty close to what we came up with. The one thing we didn’t realize in the design phase was because our intake side plates (red arrow) and bumper mounting brackets (blue arrows) are 1/4" proud of the robot frame, then any variation in bumper fit could/would/did put us in violation of the 1/4" max gap rule in places w/o those. So we had to add “fill in” plates shown installed (green arrow) and not yet installed (purple arrow). The one not shown (purple) wraps all the way around the swerve drive corner and ends at a back bumper mount.

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Sorry, I think I misunderstood your original message. I thought you meant they would have issues because of the way their bumpers are fastened to the robot, but I now see that you just meant the way the bumpers are backed by and situated on the frame. That’s my bad, thank you for clarifying :slight_smile: