Bills Blog- Yes, I’m already counting down to kickoff 2012

Some interesting stuff. New GDC members including the yearly rotating position which went to Linda Wallace from the X-Cats, it’s really cool to have a local (Rochester) person invloved with the GDC, it will be interesting to see if the 2012 game has a different flavor to it then the Dave/Woodie era.

Also it seems the pit fields are here to stay…:mad:

What awesome news!
Linda will make a great addition to the GDC.

Question. I have been out of the loop for a bit, but are Dave and Woody no longer GDC members?

Yes, Dave and Woody left the GDC.

I am hoping that they put the 2 fields side by side, then the practice fields, then the pit area. Having the pit area between 2 fields is nuts. The noise volume makes it hard to talk and is not safe. It could also help with teams that don’t have safety glasses for spectators. They could rope an area off to allow people to access the stands without entering the pit area.

When FTC and FLL are paying the same registration fee for CMP as FRC teams, let me know. FRC teams pay five times as much to play in the shadows for half of the event.

I also think I have a suggestion for fixing the qualification structure: if you group up 3 nearby regionals, lump them into a singular championship with qualifications required for entry, you cut down bids by more than half (allowing for 16 regional/state championships and the Israel Regional) Hall of Fame isn’t getting any smaller either.

If the district->state/regional->world model would be “enforced” to a degree, there would be an open opportunity for travel (2 districts req. in your region/state, 1 optional out of region)

I guess the answer isn’t as obvious as I think it is.

If you want to do Championships right do it the way they do it in Michigan.

I hadn’t thought of the registration fee, but you bring up a good point. I simply think that the larger robots with larger crowds should get the larger fields. You can’t see much of a FLL match without the camera shots. Their spectators would have a similar experience at either the dome or pit field. That being said, I don’t know how many spectators they have for the typical match. When we were in the dome I don’t remember a large number of spectators watching FLL, but maybe they had tons of spectators as well.

they only need to put more bleachers in the pits, the view was worth the noise at least for my team… i think more bleachers will silence most complaints. smashing fields together is only going to create the lack of seating problem again. it would be the same thing except without bleachers. i think if there’s no concert, that will probably leave enough room for everyone in the dome… but i really can’t tell because i’m not looking at the #'s. i’m sure someone somewhere has done the math.

If they REALLY want to make the same mistake, they NEED more bleachers (whoever thought what they had would work made a major mistake) and easier access without safety glasses.

Adding more bleachers will be interesting unless they start cramming pit space! If they need space they should just keep moving FTC into the spotlight and put their pits on the dome floor! jk:rolleyes:

So, veteran teams get shafted out of the new cRIO, unless we buy a rookie kit or purchase the upgrade?


Bill said that morgan freeman did some announcing on Archimedes but I didn’t hear him. I certainly saw him there behind the table. Did anyone else hear him announce some matches?

I heard him talk after a match, but not actually announce a match.

Granted, I wasn’t on Archimedes, just passing by.

This brings up several issues with me to which I posted on his blog about but I’ll semi repost here.

If FTC expanding kicked on field out of the dome and they just decided to move two fields, why didn’t they take an easier route and move and FTC field/division into the dome?

I think what is really interesting and bugs me is, like you mentioned, FRC is the more spectator friendly competition as you can see it from the stands and draws more crowd/attention over FTC and FLL by a LOT! Why then since we have an arena they are having to set up bleachers for FRC in the pits.

If half of part of FTC was in the pits they would avoid the noise and space issues they are encountering with FRC one pit field bleacher would have been enough for them considering most FTC teams don’t have 20-40 people in attendance.

FIRST really does try to come up with new and “creative” ways to do things. :slight_smile:

while some may call me complaining and whining these are some things that really bug me since these were decided BEFORE the concert came to town

I agree, but I think 98% of people who go to the championship are already tied to a competition. The majority of people who watch FRC, FTC or FLL are on a team or invovled in some way and thus will watch those competitions where ever they are held. Maybe if we had more of the general public stopping by, you would want the most spectator friendly competition in the dome, but that is simply not the case.

To defend FLL, they play on Einstein which is already set up for FRC and FLL draws more from the international community.
However, I do envy FTC if they get to play ALL of their matches on the dome floor. I feel that FTC would thrive in a more “intimate” location because of the fact that it is easier to see their robots up close.

I agree, I was using FLL as a spectator reference and not a kicking them off the dome since they are only using Einstein whereas FTC is growing and could grow into more of the dome in the coming years.

To defend both FTC and FLL, You have to realize that they are playing their FIRST championships alongside FRC. If there is anything that is to be learned from this past year, it’s that FRC is no longer FIRST’s favorite and we are going to have to get along with our younger brothers and sisters.

FLL can play their entire matches with all of their fields on Einstein, and thats good. It still holds up. FTC needs space for their championship to be in the dome. Well, it’s kinda silly to just have one FTC field set up for their Elimination matches, so they set up multiple ones. Look at the scope of FTC v. FRC. FRC takes up SO much space not because of the size of the field, but the field of competitors. It makes more sense to put all of FTC in the light of the dome in the same way as FLL gets their light in the dome. FRC can take the hit.

FRC is really spoiled. We are pretty much the last leg of a student in FIRST. From then on you become a mentor or volunteer. So we are given the fanfare and the spotlight. But FIRST isn’t FRC anymore. We need to make way for FTC and FLL, and putting half of FTC or most of FTC in the pits is hiding them from view. It sucks that you have to play the championship in the pits, but in all honesty with a little extra seating the problem is solved. Remember, for some FTC teams, FTC is their FRC.

FTC would fail if we kept them in the dark of the pits, and they would be better served to have all of their matches played on the big stage. FTC needs support from more FRC teams, as FTC is a “Budget FRC”. We should be embracing FTC as on FRC’s level and giving them the Championship experience as we have. If anything, we will learn that the World Championship needs a larger venue to support all of FIRST. Let’s get cozy with all of FIRST, rather then ask FTC to get cozy with themselves off in the corner away from us FRC teams and our big Dome fields.

Here is a thought: What if all four FRC divisions were played in the pits, and lets say there is enough seating for enough people to enjoy the games?

I agree and not just because I’m from Michigan :slight_smile:
The Michigan system works great and for anyone who saw any part of the MSC saw that the level of competition was waaaaay higher than most of the regionals and even some matches at worlds
At Karthik’s conference he said that for FIRST to succeed as a sport the number of mediocre teams needs to decrease so the level of competition goes up and the FIRST in Michigan system does that

FRC is definitely the more spectator friendly sport since both FLL and FTC fields are too small to actually see any action from the stands. FTC and FLL really benefit from close seating positions since the crowd would be able to see the matches without having to rely on the video screens
also all of the general public who come to check out FIRST (not to hurt FTC or FLL or anything like that) wont be excited by minirobots on the FTC and FLL fields but by the big, powerful, exciting big bots on the FRC fields

I can understand wanting to promote FTC and FLL (especially since FTC sorta takes a backseat to FRC and VEX) but you have to know what the audience wants yknow?

thats my 2 cents on the deal :slight_smile:

Maybe it’s just me but I can’t really seem to wrap my head around this whole “the dome is more special” thing. I didn’t really notice any difference at all as a drive coach between the dome and pit fields other than a shorter commute to the pit field. I guess I’ll have to ask my drivers if they thought there was any difference.

Logistically it makes no sense to put FTC in the Dome and FRC in the pits. The volume of spectators for the FRC matches makes way more sense in the dome. The visibility of the robots makes way more sense to put FRC in the dome. The FTC robots are just too small to make sense in the dome. They would be much better suited to the pit field setup where the stands are much closer to the field.

FLL is fine on Einstein because you can’t see those robots without a camera blowing up the action no matter where you put them and Einstein isn’t being used during that time anyway.