I never meant this as a rude or mean thing. If I was at a job that required me to be paying attention at all times or someone could be hurt or killed, Wouldn’t you want me being alert at all times?
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It’s against the rules to bang on the glass this year for very important safety reasons regarding the sandstorm blinds. Not only is banging on it irresponsible, but can cause someone to get hurt.
The FTAs usually check each alliance before a thumbs-up to start the match. If an issue comes up after that, get your human player on the scoring table side to signal the FTAs attention, since we’re usually checking around that area while starting the match since we can’t see past the sandstorm blinds. At worst, you’ll get the attention of a nearby field reset person / scorer / ref.
For something like a Joystick fault, you can unplug your Ethernet until the FTA comes and sees you, since that bars the start match button from being pressed (just don’t abuse this for minor problems, of course). But please, DO NOT E-Stop your robot, E-Stops are sticky and require a lot more effort to clear.
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This instance happened during a match not before
I’m not sure what instance you’re referring to.
They’re talking about the OP of the thread (which is theirs). It’s true, getting the attention of the FTA during a match can be a real crapshoot situation. Doing it without banging on the glass can cost really previous in-match time that not many posts are addressing. There’s no perfect fix to this, and it is a real problem I’d like to see handled if the blinds stay around. Teams, especially rookies, cdn benefit from much clearer guidance than (at least some events) are getting.
In terms of stopgap, rehearsing having someone quickly gesture—whistling is great—from the scoring-table side station is probably the best option. As a ref who’s responded to that, I hate seeing comm issues cost matches, and even if it’s resolved the time it takes to get attention can really kill students’ experience when they’re already at their most stressed. I wish people wouldn’t downplay or ignore the in-match aspects there.
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Why not have something like a set of buttons in each driverstation with one of them being “ready for the match” and the other would be a “FTA pls come help” button?
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Inconsolable wailing and gnashing of teeth?
Or a thumbs down and lots of waving.
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I would love to see them do a “Ready/Not Ready” thing that programmers could invoke in code when things aren’t right. (Either a sensor is sensing when it shouldn’t be/should be or a camera is in failure mode or an encoder is not detected.) We had an issue last year where PT didn’t get the refnums (Possibly because PT ran before begin was done) and it caused code to not work properly. This is detectable by seeing a mass of errors saying stuff about broken refnums. If we would have had this, I could have detected there was an issue and sent the signal we arent ready.
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We do something similar to this ourselves. We have our robot LEDs blink red on boot until all our cameras for Vision processing are connected and sending data. Once everything is good, the LEDs display a rainbow pattern until the match starts.
It’s a quick and easy way to see what’s going on without looking at our prints in the driver station console. Often, we have one of our team members stay on the field until the lights display a rainbow pattern when setting up the robot.
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I think it was 2521 SERT who threw a screen on the side of their robot with a list of things on it, if it was working it was green, if not red. Very visible and easy to see
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Signal flare?
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Surprised no one has suggested this yet: bang on the loading station glass. Only illegal to bang on the player station.
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Run to the scoring side edge of the player station, lean out, wave and holler something about “FTA, FTA, FTA!”
The volunteer relay should get the FTA’s attention in a hurry.
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I like it, but it’d need to be coupled with something else here because as a ref I totally would not have gotten this beforehand. I’m used to people banging on loading stations to reposition their own team, to dislodge a game piece (some years), to signal another alliance partner. But to signal a player station issue? Nah no way, that happens at the player station glass (my primeval FIRST brain tells me). I mean do it enough and you’d wake me up, but it wasn’t in my ref lexicon until just now. It’s good. Maybe this is all the remedy/training required if blinds stay around, just to prime that potential connection.
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It’s been said already but get a volunteers attention and give them a thumbs down. I was field reset on Darwin and there were several occasions where I was able to give the FTA a thumbs down for a team which helped get their attention. (Or if you wanna be real hold, unplug the fms cord and they’ll see that)
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I saw volunteers at the corner of the scoring side loading station that were part of the thumbs up/down check.
In one match on Carson, the corner volunteer didn’t signal either thumbs up or thumbs down when the check was made. Unfortunately the no thumbs up/down was taken as a thumbs up and the match started and all three robots on the one side didn’t move. The corner volunteer did indicate thumbs down after the start of “drivers between the lines” but it wasn’t noticed and the match started. The head ref acted quickly and shut down the match.
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I’ve never tried this before, but if it could become a common occurrence (or just in case - you could use this over multiple seasons), wouldn’t a hatch panel that your human player shakes out the side of the loading station closest to the FTA (within alliance station bounds, of course)? Or just clapping or something?
There was a match sometime in Detroit (blanking on specifics rn) where half the cargo on one side wasnt properly put into place on the field, and the match started like that. When the team asked to replay, they were told its “their job to make sure the field is ready.”
With luck, youll knock out the panel, and the match will start, and you wont get the replay or get the issue fixed.
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I think what he’s saying is for the HP to grab a panel, jump into the loading station, and wave it out the side, like a signalling device.
And yeah, I recall seeing the discussion on that match. Half the blue cargo was in front of the loading station instead of in the depot, the team won anyways.
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