Climb Points

A week after FIRST Israel DCMP ended, I watched our final match again and again.

Team 3339 went to climb a little late but as you can see from many camera angles in this video, our robot was clearly not touching the ramp, it was completly on level 3 of the hab but we did not get the points for that.
Looking at how the referees (a few seconds after the match ended) decided about it is making me wonder,
Why didn’t they enter the field to get another point of view? why did they looked at the robot from an angle that another robot is hiding us.

While watching this, there are a lot of shadows on the field. It seems that 6738 never picked up their lift for their HAB 2 climb. From the angle at which the ref was looking, i can see how those could be confused as yours, instead of 6738’s.

The Blue Alliance shows the climbs as Lvl 1, Lvl 1 and Lvl 2. It seems 5554 was definitely level 1, 6738 looks like it still had a foot down so is also level 1, and the 3339 foot while still down, though obviously not touching the level 1 platform, looks like it might have either been touching the side of the platform or possibly the bumpers were below the top level (hard to see either in the video). Either way, it is not obvious and the refs have to score it the same way they would any other match.

The Referees were probably instructed to evaluate the status of the robots without entering the field thus the Blue Box associated with 5.3
The videos are not necessarily from the same viewpoint that the Referees have. It is the viewpoint of the Referees that will be used to determine the climb status of each robot.

perhaps 6738 got the level 2; if 3339 still had a foot down it would count as a level one. Thats why i suggested that they confused the robots’ feet. If you watch the video closely, you can obviously see 3339 retract their feet, but you cannot see 6738 lift theirs.

the bumper level is also a very valid option, though

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The information I got from the ref following this match was that 6738 was given a Level 1 climb as their feet have not retracted (rightfully so) and we were given a Level 2 climb because, according to the ref, our rear feet were touching the ramp. This seemed odd, seeing as similar climbs performed by other robots in the same competition and identical climbs performed by us in previous competitions were rewarded the Level 3 climb.

After entering the field and taking a closer look it was obvious to me that there was no contact between the feet and the ramp, but I can’t blame the refs for not seeing that. That being said, contact or no contact, I think anyone standing a mile away from this climb could see the robot is not supported by the rear feet in any way.


That’s weird because I often notice that even if refs have a slightly different interpretation of a certain rule they usually stick to it

They are not allowed, so this assumption is correct.

It’s obvious that 3339 retracted prior to match end, and contact does not necessarily mean supported by. I also believe there is a Q&A that addresses this. I personally believe it should have counted as a Hab 3 climb.

Citation needed. It doesn’t say that anywhere in the manual. Keep in mind neither saying that the climbs are evaluated by humans nor saying that they are based on robot position at T+5 precludes refs from going onto the field. I may be wrong, but this feels like one of those “secret rules” that may be part of referee training but is not stated explicitly anywhere.

I feel like preventing referees from making the best call possible by restricting their vantage point can’t be the right policy.


I understand the view point but every referee I have asked says that they’re not allowed to walk inside, despite the lack of any mention in the manual.

It does feel like another one of those “secret rules” that they aren’t allowed to discuss with us.

If you watch the head ref, he makes a rotating gesture with his hand, implying (maybe?) he thinks the bot is supported by the front face of hab 3.

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