Was looking for a thread on this yesterday:
Fire at Michigan State Champs
Surprised it wasn’t here yet, so I am linking to the Reddit post.
Yes, this made quite the impression. I was afraid the team was going to be bombarded wroth safety captains all trying to be the first to put it out. Fire extinguisher on the cart isn’t a bad idea. We’re redesigning ours this year I think it’s would be a good addition.
The team was able to rebuild the robot yesterday after the fire. They ran multiple practice match’s and would appear that it functioning again. Everyone around was cheering them on! A great moment.
The report I have is that the team rebuilt in four hours and ran in a practice match. The pictures I have seen show some burned wiring near the PDP. Good luck guys!
An interesting comment in the original link by a poster saying, essentially, “all the safety captains and meticulously memorized safety code rules, useless when something actually happens”.
I can attest to that feeling. A number of years ago my car engine caught fire while it was parked at a camp. (The running theory is that a rodent chewed through enough wiring to cause a short). There was a good few moments of “uhhhh what’s happening?” followed by, in that moment, not having a clue what to do.
That moment led to writing down a specific procedure “in case of fire”, that is printed and posted in every building. It is unambiguous. Step 1, this person do this. Step 2, everyone else do that.
There was a robot fire at the Greater KC event too.
Not as much flame, but smoked-up the place pretty good. Had to wait a while to start the next match until the smoke cleared.
I understand that the robot was up and running again later.
Heard third-hand that two motor wires were routed through a drilled hole with battery wires nearby. Motor wires wore through and shorted, lighting a bunch of insulation on fire.
Yes, I think it sounds like a great idea to actually have a plan for who will do what actions during a fire.
Does anyone know what was the specific heat source that started the fire, and what the combustible material was that sustained the fire?
/u/sourec commented on the reddit post detailing the fire and showing some more pictures.
An expensive, unfortunate incident.
It’s like CPR training. Step 1, notice there’s a problem and decide to do something. Step 2, tell someone to call 911. Step 3, make sure they heard and understood that. Step 4, actually start CPR.
Preventative safety is great, since it’s a lot easier to not have to deal with injuries in the first place, but it seems like training and planning for what to do in an actual emergency is slightly lacking.
We had a similar incident at the Long Island regional in 2009 with Team 263. That was the result of the catastrophic failure of a Victor speed controller, sustained by bumper material. The facility manager wouldn’t let the robot back into the building unless they determined it was fixed and wouldn’t happen again.
I hate to be ‘that person’, but it has to be said.
Why did it take so long to grab a fire extinguisher that should have been ready at the field?
Why is there a group of volunteers all standing around a robot with a roaring fire and a live battery inside it?
Why are there volunteers sticking their hands inside and/or near the robot, let alone fanning the fire?
It seems to me like this reflects a lack of training for what to do in this situation. I would expect volunteers to be properly inducted about what to do in the event of an emergency such as this one. We’ve got 6 highly dangerous machines on the field and dozens more behind the curtain, all with massive batteries and electrical currents running through them, but it seems that no one knows what to do in the (quite likely) event that something goes wrong.
We’re always saying that “Safety comes first”, but it’s events like this that make me question “are we really living up to that?”
Training for an emergency and being in one feel completely different.
I don’t believe you can fault volunteers who aren’t exactly sure what to do when they go to maybe 3-4 events a year. If they were trained for an emergency like this the chances of this happening has to be close to 1 in 100 events. So it isn’t like this is something that happens so often that they would know how to react if it did.
I do agree there should be a fire estinguisher at the field to be easily found. And that perhaps maybe they shouldn’t have been standing so close to a fire.
What are your concerns with a battery and fire?
Volunteer training has not included “fire safety,” as long as I’ve been a volunteer. Perhaps a solution could be to ask local firefighters if they would be willing to volunteer for the event.
It seems to me that they were searching for a dry chemical fire extinguisher apposed to a more common co2 fire extinguisher in order to keep parts of the robot salvageable.
The likelihood hood of the fire spreading was very low but, it did slightly concern me when they started to poke around inside of the robot. I was also expecting with that size flame that the bumper fabric would eventually catch on fire. Overall it just seemed foolish to poke around.
The reaction time could have definitely been better and this is a situation that volunteers should be better prepared for but the likelihood is pretty low.
A more accessible fire extinguisher is really all they need.
The overall reaction there seemed a bit less prepared than this one for Lake Superior a few years ago https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=YOd3mF1tvwk
Fast forward to the last 25 seconds, you can see immediate action behind the robot, and a fire extinguisher was out and ready on the field rather quickly!
My assumption is that the early poking around near the fire was an attempt to find and hit the main breaker, which is usually the first line of defense before they go to the extinguishers. Even when clearly labelled, the smoke can make it really hard to see the breaker. Blowing on the flames, however, was probably not the best plan.
Later, they popped the cover to make it easier to get the fire extinguisher onto the fire.
It’s moreso that a battery rupture could cause massive damage to the internals of the robot and any close components assuming the bellypan of the robot isn’t fully enclosed.
It was stated that the fire was caused by a battery short with a live chassis. If a robot is on fire, 9 times out of 10 it will be because of a battery short or electrical fault. When a high amperage electrical circuit shorts, touching the metal chassis of the robot is a good way to become less alive.
Because someone screwed up. As part of field setup, the fire extinguisher is removed from case 8 and put by the side of the field. I usually put it in front of the FMS at the center of the table or on the end of the table where the FTAs are hanging out.
It’s quite apparent that extinguisher was still in case 8. I bet all the FTAs get an email this week.
At this point, hitting the breaker won’t solve the problem. The fire is started electrically, which means that something, somewhere has shorted. Not only does this trip the breaker/fuse, but will also discharge the battery if the breaker isn’t fast enough to catch it.
I’m aware that fire extinguishers are standard with the field, but the fact that it was neglected/forgotten by the field setup crew is what worries me.