Today’s blog post was written by Kate Pilotte, FIRST Robotics Competition’s Kit of Parts Manager.
You may have noticed that every now and then we release information about a season before its Kickoff; sometimes it’s because we think it’s just that helpful to know ahead of time, sometimes it’s because we’re being playful, and sometimes it’s an accident.
This instance is the first one.
We want you to know that the list of legal motor controllers for the 2016 season is expanding.
In addition to the controllers permitted in the 2015 season…
Jaguar Motor Controller (Part #s: MDL-BDC, MDL-BDC24, & 217-3367)
Talon Motor Controller (Part #s: CTRE_Talon, CTRE_Talon_SR, & am-2195)
Talon SRX Motor Controller (Part #: 217-8080 & am-2854)
Victor 884 Motor Controller (Part #: VICTOR-884-12/12)
Victor 888 Motor Controller (Part #: 217-2769)
Victor SP Motor Controller (Part #: 217-9090)
…we’ve also approved the following devices:
SD540 Motor Controller (Part #: SD540x1)
(mindsensors.com has been a long time mentor of FIRST Team 540 and designed this controller jointly with Team 540 students. This controller is manufactured locally with the help of FIRST students. SD540 features include brake/coast, direction selection, 60-amp continuous current and 100 amps peak. It will be available as a single unit, dual or quad banks. They expect availability in early November.)
Spark Motor Controller (Part #: REV-11-1200)
(REV Robotics is a Texas-based company founded by two long-time FIRST team mentors. The Spark features 60-amp continuous current with passive cooling, bi-directional limit switch inputs on-board for smart mechanism control, RGB LED status indicator, and digital brake/coast mode. Sparks will be available for purchase in November from Amazon and REVRobotics.com.)
Every team will get a voucher to order three Victor SPs or two Talon SRXes from Vex Robotics. Additionally, Rookie teams will receive 2 Victor SPs in their Kickoff Kit. There will also be limited quantities of Victor 888s, Victor SPs, Talon SRXes, and Sparks in FIRST Choice.
There’s another nugget of information that you should know… what motor controllers won’t be allowed to control. Considering their obsolescence and resulting scarcity on the market, BaneBots’ 550 and 775 motors will no longer be included on the list of legal motors.
For technical questions about any of the legal controllers, we recommend you contact the Supplier directly.
We’re excited to work with all of the motor controller suppliers for this upcoming season!
There’s another nugget of information that you should know… what motor controllers won’t be allowed to control. Considering their obsolescence and resulting scarcity on the market, BaneBots’ 550 and 775 motors will no longer be included on the list of legal motors.
Losing the 550’s and 775’s is going to be a major blow to FRC teams if they do not find another supplier. Right now there is a VERY large gap in the motor chart between 150W and 300W. And with the 300W motor being a CIM, you are basically limited to 150W for any single motor, unless you have room to fit a CIM. I hope they can find a new supplier for a ~220W-250W motor, in 775 size.
Yes they are, however they are nowhere close to the power provided by the banebot motors. The 9015 is 179W vs 253W, and the AM 775 is only 150W vs 273W. So there are similar size motors, but nowhere near similar power. That means if you want more then 250W in a motor you either need to double up motors, or go to a CIM, where there just sometimes isn’t space.
Does anyone else dislike that it feels like they tried to stick the information about the 775 and 550 into a blog post? It’s like they didn’t want us to notice or something. This is a fairly large deal that teams need to know about and it feels like an add-on to a blog post that not everyone would normally read.
Where would you suggest they put this kind of information? Blog posts are one of the more effective means of communicating to the teams. I’m sure it will come out later in an e-mail blast to the teams, just the blog post came out ahead.
In my mind they’re doing us a favor. They’re under no obligation to tell us what motor controllers or motors are legal until the manual is released.
I am surprised about the decision concerning 775s. Banebots discontinuted the motor but still has ~2300 in stock, and I imagine lots of veteran teams have big stockpiles of these motors.
He’s talking about hiding in a blog post that is talking about something else. It’s like a rider on a bill.
The news of the motors being disallowed was going to make teams upset, so I figure they wanted to temper that by informing us in an otherwise very positive blog post.
Too bad that the focus is on this instead of REV and MindSensors’ new products.
If I remember correctly when we lost Fisherprice motors in 2013 we didn’t know until kickoff.
The banebots issue has been on the horizon for a while if you read this thread.
As far as motors go we have been pretty spoiled the last few years having MiniCIMs, BAGs, AM motors, BB motors, and more. There a lot of people who don’t remember the days of designing arms that were powered by van door motors. Don’t get me wrong I love more motor power as much as the next guy, namely because I think it makes the robots more entertaining but if we have to go without for a few seasons teams will adapt.
I have designed a ton of applications with those 775 motors using the specs published by Banebots (Scorpion, Overclock’s robot from last year, had 14 of those bad dads on her), I have never had a case where I said to myself, “those specs are messed up!” When we design our lift to raise 6 totes at 2ft per second, the lift raised 6 totes at 2ft per second.
Of course there is variation from motor to motor but nothing out of the normal manufacturing tolerances (typical for this style of motor is +/-15%).
If you knew what your were doing, those motors were amazing. More power than a Mini-CIM at less that half the weight and volume.
I’m confused what the point of designing a motor controller for 60 amp continuous is if the largest breaker we are allowed to use is 40 amps. I understand the higher peak, but the I was under the impression that breakers would snap once you get above 40 amps for more than a few milliseconds. It would make sense if these were already being produced and are just now being approved for FRC, but the blog post makes it sound like they were developed specifically for FRC teams.
We’ve used lots of 775s and they were always fairly close to what we had calculated them to be. What made that motor so great was it was an 18v motor so it ran super cool even at stall because it was only 12v. That motor surely will be missed by many teams.