[FRC Blog] Kit of Parts – 2018 Drive Base Kit Option and International Game Pieces

FIRST General Forum
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Posted on the FRC Blog, 9/29/2017: Kit of Parts – 2018 Drive Base Kit Option and International Game Pieces | FIRST

Kit of Parts – 2018 Drive Base Kit Option and International Game Pieces*
Written by Jonathan Bryant, Kit of Parts Engineer*
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Drive Base Kit Option
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Your 2018 Kickoff Kit will again include a drive base kit! Maybe; it’s up to you.

Veteran teams are invited to choose a $450 Voucher from AndyMark (available 11/16, and yes there will be pre-kickoff vouchers again) instead of receiving a drive base kit with their Kickoff Kit (all other teams will automatically receive the drive base kit). In case you were wondering, pre-kickoff vouchers will be part of the Virtual Kit with details to come later.

To accommodate drive base kit production lead times, this option is only available until noon (Eastern) on Tuesday, 10/10.

We’ll be collecting teams’ decisions differently this year. Instead of making the selection in a webform, we’ll be using the dashboard! We will only accept selections made using the dashboard. Only the Lead Coach/ Mentor 1 or 2 can submit.

In order to opt-out, a Lead Mentor 1 or 2 must do the following:

  1. Log into you www.firstinspires.org account.
  2. Click the team for which you’re selecting.
  3. Under the “Parts and Products” drop down on the “Team Options” tab, select “Drive Base Opt Out.”

https://www.firstinspires.org/sites/default/files/uploads/frc/Blog/kopblog1.png

BOOM you are done.
If, after you select the opt out (but before the deadline), your team changes their mind about their selection, you can change your selection in the dashboard.

If a team does nothing by the deadline, they will be assigned the ‘default’ option of receiving the drive base kit as part of their Kickoff Kit.

To help you make your decision, we can give you some general information about the 2018 drive base kit.

  • It’s similar to the AM14U3 from 2017, and includes a bumper and battery mounting kit.
  • Features are such that they enable a team to execute basic elements of game play.
  • Design is such that the drive base can be assembled and driving by a small team with limited resource within two days.

We recognize that we are asking you to make a decision about a partially defined product, which can lead to frustration. Our goal is to give you as much information as possible without revealing details about the game. For example, a drive base with significant ground clearance may imply some type of obstacle on the field that robots would likely have to traverse. If we revealed details such as ground clearance, we would be giving away too much of the game.

International Game Piece Option

International teams (i.e. non-United States based teams) experience significant challenges in sourcing game elements from FIRST Choice: both in shipping time (~3-4 weeks for the items to arrive in their home countries) and extra fees associated with importing such items. Just in case you were wondering, FIRST Choice will be part of the Kit of Parts with details to come later.

In response to this issue, FIRST added an option for those teams to devote an inflated number of FIRST Choice credits in exchange for receiving an extra set of game elements with their Kickoff Kits. The number of credits for this option is greater than the number of credits teams spend if using FIRST Choice normally to obtain game pieces (i.e. inflated) because we recognize the advantage inherent in the timing of early receipt.

Teams who exercise this option will have their FIRST Choice credits reduced by 20%.

The option window is open for non-US teams only between 12:00pm (noon) EST on October 26 and 12:00pm (noon) EST on Thursday, November 9.

In order to opt-in, a Lead Mentor 1 or 2 must do the following:

Log into you www.firstinspires.org account.
Click the team for which you’re selecting.
Under the “Parts and Products” drop down on the “Team Options” tab, select “Game Piece Opt In.”
Check the box if you want to opt in.
You can change your team’s selection if you like, but changes may not be made after the window closes.

The default option, and the result if you do nothing, is to not receive an extra set of game pieces at Kickoff and receive the full allotment of FIRST Choice credits.

We hope that this option will continue to mitigate some obstacles faced by non-US teams. As always, we look forward to feedback about the implementation in the post-season Kit of Parts survey.

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A question for international teams. Based on the past few years, is spending credit on extra game pieces worth it or not?

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To accommodate drive base kit production lead times, this option is only available until noon (Eastern) on Tuesday, 10/10.

That’s all fine and good, but when does this option become available? As of 11:30 AM PDST on 9/29/2017 it is not.

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The blog has been updated to state:

To accommodate drive base kit production lead times, this option is only available from Monday, 10/2 at noon (Eastern) until noon (Eastern) on Tuesday, 10/10.

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Your 2018 Kickoff Kit will again include a drive base kit! Maybe; it’s up to you.

Veteran teams are invited to choose a $450 Voucher from AndyMark (available 11/16, and yes there will be pre-kickoff vouchers again) instead of receiving a drive base kit with their Kickoff Kit (all other teams will automatically receive the drive base kit). In case you were wondering, pre-kickoff vouchers will be part of the Virtual Kit with details to come later.

This is an amazing option for veteran teams and teams comfortable with making their own drivetrain.

We recognize that we are asking you to make a decision about a partially defined product, which can lead to frustration. Our goal is to give you as much information as possible without revealing details about the game. For example, a drive base with significant ground clearance may imply some type of obstacle on the field that robots would likely have to traverse. If we revealed details such as ground clearance, we would be giving away too much of the game.

Minor hint? After this pseudo hint I would be willing to bet there is an obstacle or climbing of some kind this year. Bring in the speculation masses!!!

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It’s the exact same language used in past two years, at least.

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Great to know. I was very entrenched in my last few semesters of school when these blogs were posted. Still have some catching up to do. Thanks for the heads up.

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I know there are a lot of veteran teams who are dismissing the kit drivetrain, assuming that they can make a custom drivetrain that’s good enough to warrant the extra design and build time. I would caution teams to carefully evaluate this assumption. For some teams, this assumption will hold true, but for many, it will not.

To provide my team’s perspectice, this past year, 2830 decided for the first time in awhile to use the kit drivetrain. Our thought process was that we had lost a lot of key students and wanted to build as simple of a robot as possible. With this drivetrain, we went from a box of parts to a driving robot in less than 8 hours and in my opinion, we ended up with a top 10% drivetrain. The extra driver practice and the extra time we got to work on the rest of our robot proved to be incredibly valuable.

As an extra note, if you run with a kit drivetrain, please use at least 2 CIMS per side, it makes a big difference.

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Last two years, especially last year, the parts available in first choice were not much of use, probably except for pnuematics parts. There were very few classmate PCs and electrical components.

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I agree absolutely! In our rookie year, we did things with the KoP drive train that were just wrong (break in the chassis without support, apparently inverting the drop center), then “opted out” and did custom chassis our second and third years. In 2015, we meant to opt out but missed the deadline. It turned out that after we decided on our drive train, the AM14U2 was fully up to the task (just switching to omni wheels). Since then, we have purchased two KoP chassis frames from a preceding year during the summer (waiting for it to become AndyMark’s “Deal of the Day”), and opted out of the current chassis. The only drive train problems we’ve encountered with a KoP chassis were those we made for ourselves by poorly considered mods. Yes, we “opt out”, but only because we pre-purchase two kit frames from the previous year at an advantageous cost point.

I disagree only that this is true whether or not you use a kit drive train. Except for weirdness like 2015, you’ll want to dedicate a minimum of four PDP slots to your drive train, with six or more in many cases.

I’ll definitely beg to differ there! Yes, there are lots of good pneumatics parts. We also picked up a spare robot signal light, hex hubs*, NeveRest60 gearmotors*, 10DOF sensor, xBox 360 controller, SB50s*, KoP Battery tray*, Encoder cables*, LED rings, Encoders, Cameras*, Shaft Collars*, and coupling hubs. All the items with an asterisk were actually used this year, and we’ll likely use many of the others in the next year or two.

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Is this online for anyone? I do not see the option available for selection.

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To accommodate drive base kit production lead times, this option is only available from Monday, 10/2 at noon (Eastern) until noon (Eastern) on Tuesday, 10/10.

Give a few more hours :slight_smile:

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Thanks! I had a feeling I was just missing something.

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Keep in mind. First is mostly staffed with high tech software types. The day doesn’t start for them until sometime afternoon. :]

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My people. :wink:

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This is what I am getting

"Kit and KickOff is closed!
Sub-info

The 2018 FIRST Robotics Competition kickoff will be held on Saturday, January 6, 2018. Teams need to select to either pick up their kickoff kit at a local kickoff (no fee) or select to have the kit shipped as indicated below (for a fee).
Will you be attending a kickoff?"

anyone else?

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You’re looking in the wrong place. From the dashboard, click on Parts & Products on the left, then Drive Base Opt-out in the drop down. It is NOT available under the Event Options Kickoff link - that’s for signing up for a kickoff location.

2017-10-02_13-01-34.jpg

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Tip from a team who didn’t think about this during the season; If you get the kit base, buy all the gearing options for whatever transmission is included (I would guess a toughbox mini) so you can try them all, especially if you intend to use non-kit wheel sizes. (this is assuming you have budget to do so, but really gears are relatively cheap)

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To help you make your decision, we can give you some general information about the 2018 drive base kit.

  • It’s similar to the AM14U3 from 2017, and includes a bumper and battery mounting kit.
  • Features are such that they enable a team to execute basic elements of game play.
  • Design is such that the drive base can be assembled and driving by a small team with limited resource within two days.

Curiously, the AM14U3 was out of stock last week, but is available again. It could just be that AM is confident that they’ll sell enough of last year’s kit pieces to pay for a production run, but it supports the possibility that the “U4” is just the U3 plus the battery and bumper mounts, or with changes to the gearing and wheels.

Obviously an edit:

Almost certainly! But if so, he’s under an NDA and not saying.::rtm::