I started doing FRC when I was in High School and continued to mentor through college. Now, I work as a high school teacher and I am taking over as the coach of an FTC program at my school in TX. I am very familiar with the tools and machines required for FRC including Bandsaws, Mills, 3D printing, CNC machining, and CAD designing. I know FTC is a lot more simplified compared to FRC but other than hand tools and drills what would you recommend purchasing for FTC to build a good robot? Any advice would be greatly appreciated! Thanks.
You’ll likely need a band saw and small drill press as far as the big tools go. A belt or circle sander will also be useful. Past that, there’s not that much in terms of power tools. 3D printers are very useful for maintaining mounts and brackets. Some teams use a CNC router to make neat parts, but it’s not necessary to make a good team. A finger brake can be handy in a few edge cases (we made a few parts of our shooter in 2016-17 with them).
If you have the tools for FRC you have the tools you need for FTC. Band saw, sander, hand drill and drill press are used most. For your first few years I would recommend buying the Andy Mark Tile Runner. This kit will help new students to learn how to assembly without having to manufacture a Chassis. You can reuse every year just need to replace worn parts every year if needed. Tetrix has great building parts that reduce the amount of drilling and measuring required. They also have a kit but I do not have any experience with this kit.
FTC has changed a lot in the last several years because of build rules opening up a lot (~5 years ago?) and the better selection of FTC relevant COTS parts now available from VexPro, Actobotics/ServoCity, Rev Robotics, and AndyMark.
FTC allows the team to build from any raw materials they want (provide it’s not hazardous or messy) and use just about any mechanical COTS component as long as it only has one degree of freedom of motion. That means teams can behave along a wide spectrum of build and design and fabrication complexity. It’s possible to integrate CNC machining capabilities if you want, or it’s possible to completely avoid machining altogether.
Because the available build systems are so diverse, a team can tailor their build style to the resources available to a great extent. Some teams now use ServoCity Actobotics stuff instead of Tetrix, and the local team that made that switch told me they like it way better. That’s the option for building something with hardly any tools except some wrenches, or for a team that wants to simplify the build in ways that avoid machining.
Rev Robotics has a system of plastic parts and aluminum extrusions that seems like another option for a team that wants to keep thing simple. A team can do this with only basic power tools available. Rev stuff doesn’t necessarily play well with other systems (odd gear pitch, 5 mm hex) but it seems like a nice self contained build system that allows a high degree of flexibility.
I personally like the inexpensive plastic VexPro stuff that’s been coming out for FTC: plastic VersaPlanetary Lite, plastic VersaBlocks and VersaBlock Mini, plastic hex hubs, 3/8" Thunderhex stock and bearings. I think that system offers the ability to create a really solid robot without needing fancy machining.
FTC lends itself very well to 3D printing. Well designed PLA / ABS / PETG parts are strong enough to be integral parts of the powered mechanical systems in many FTC applications, including drive trains and climbers, because the robots are lighter and the motors are less powerful.
So the top items on my list would be a 3D printer (and the requisite CAD computing power and training) and the baseline shop tools: bandsaw, drill press, belt sander, hand drill, vise, sheet bending brake, etc. Then choose one of the COTS build systems and acquire some inventory so your students have a place to start. They will be bewildered at all the options out there, so it’s going to be easier on them if you give them an idea of what sort of build system might work well for their team.
Plan a way to avoid setscrew issues. FTC NeverRest motors have D profile output shafts. You can get clamping sprockets and D Bore “nubs” from Andymark, and you can use 5mm hex stuff from Rev, and ServoCity has a bit of D Bore stuff IIRC. I prefer the AndyMark sprockets and nubs.
Get Rev Robotics electronics, not Modern Robotics.
A couple of tools for crimping connectors plus a stock of connector pieces might be advised. We use 40A Andersons, but that’s less of an obvious choice now that Rev electronics use different connectors.
I have learned from people on CD (thanks Billfred!) that Tetrix is to be avoided. I believe the alternative mentioned was Actobotics but I’m not 100% sure. Now that Vex is releasing a lot of plastic versaframe stuff, that may be something to look into as well.
+1 on tilerunner, though.
We actually only have small tools from FRC like drills, hand tools, and a belt sander. I was looking into a small CNC machine, a 3D Printer and maybe a tabletop mill for smaller parts. Are these important parts to make the robot work less labor intensive as far as hand cutting and drilling goes?
I appreciate the very detailed explaination. I did not know of many of the companies or products that you mentioned. Thanks for clearing that up! I will definatley look into the different products. Thanks!
I personally cannot recommend the TileRunner. We bought one for a team that wasn’t very mechanically experienced, and they had nothing but trouble with it. Our thinking was that we’d make the drive train easy and let them focus on manipulators, but there are a lot of ways to build that thing incorrectly in ways that make the drive fail, and the time required to repair it is a problem since it’s a sheet metal design. The side has to come off to do anything to the drive.
I think it would be just fine for a team that has some healthy mechanical experience, but our rookie builders were doing things like getting the set screws tightened against the round part of the D shaft, putting the axle spacers on in the wrong order, putting the bearing flanges on the wrong side of the plate so they can pop out, attaching nubs to gears crookedly (they are not tapped, so it’s not that hard to do).
To expand on CAD: our CAD experience level has been a severe bottleneck for our FTC teams. There are lots of things we could be doing better if the students were spending more of their spare time learning CAD, but since they mostly aren’t doing that, our build methods have to match that lack of experience. That means that having 3D printers and CNC machines isn’t going to do any good unless the students can figure out how to put those resources to good use, and if the mentors can teach them how.
Also as far as electronics go, are the electronics pretty similar to FRC? I know that REV is the way to go for electronics but are they pretty self-explanatory for students to understand?
It is much easier than FRC, especially when using the Rev hub. The Rev hub is awesome because it combines a lot of the FRC components into one (roboRIO, PDP, motor controllers). This greatly simplifies the wiring.
I’ll say this about the programming: Android / Android Studio is a very complicated platform. There are lots of issues that can be had in Android Studio that aren’t related to Java code (plugin versions, developer kit versions, , Gradle issues, etc). A “Hello World” Android project creates something like 1000 files.
I’d suggest avoiding that in favor of one of the vanilla Java options that exists for FTC. I honestly don’t know what the least buggy set of libraries is, but I’m going to steer my teams toward regular Java next year. The programs build faster than Android Studio projects, if nothing else.
Interesting, I did vision programming a few years ago using Android Studio but never an FTC robot. Can you use Eclipse as an IDE, or is it only Android Studio and Android?
Did you use Vuforia for the vision? That’s supported within FTC. Either way, that’s handy experience for your team to utilize.
As for Eclipse, I believe you can use it if your team uses Java Native Interface, which is listed as one of the options in the recent blog:
This season we will also be phasing out App Inventor, and this will no longer be an allowed programming language. We will continue to allow FTC Blocks, OnBot Java, Android Studio, Java Native Interface (JNI) and Android Native Development Kit (NDK).
If you’ve used Android before and didn’t mind it, maybe it would be fine for your team. We’ve been using it and mostly surviving. I just think regular Java would be simpler and less likely to lead to frustrations that have nothing to do with the actual robot code. Our teams have often spun their wheels while trying to get Android Studio projects to run.
Interesting, I did use Vuforia so that might be the best bet. Thanks for your assistance!
Full disclosure, I worked for AndyMark for 18 months. But I’m not on their payroll and promise to call it down the middle. 
To expand on my positions:
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Absolutely avoid TETRIX in its present form, as it is outclassed in too many ways now. I saw a sign in their booth in Houston that seems to say new product is coming, but it’s not here so I can’t judge it.
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REV’s starter kit is significantly discounted in the FTC storefront. Actobotics also offers a starter kit through their site with a discount, but it’s a little more expensive. Neither is a wrong answer for teams. AndyMark S3 is a little more a la carte than either of those, but it is more compact (16mm square) and that presents some interesting uses.
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VEX has released a lot of plastic Versaframe components, but at 1" in size it’s on the thick end for FTC (which has had an 18" sizing cube since day 1). I know some components, like the VersaBlock Mini, also can slot in with VEX EDR materials…but then you’re buying into an ecosystem that’s got a fair number of limitations in FTC. VEX comes to play, and it wouldn’t shock me to see more parts aimed at FTC in their product pipeline, but right now it wouldn’t be my first choice.
11444 had access to a water jet machine, and that did create a world of new things for them…but they also had people that knew how to run things on it. I’d start with the 3D printer, as that’s the thing that’s most likely to be re-learnable if someone leaves the team. Everything else is really cool, but you should weigh the benefit against the training and maintenance needs (especially in FTC, which suffers from relatively high team turnover since the barrier to entry is so much lower).
I think they are, personally. The FTC electronics rules are pretty tight, closer to 2008-era FRC than 2018. I’d suggest looking at Part 1 of last year’s game manual for a taste of what’s permitted; it might change, but I’d be surprised if it did by much.
If you have any experience with the AndyMark kit base you will be fine, but one piece of advice. Check the set screws in the gearboxes often, especially during competition as, in at least in my experience like to wiggle out over use. if you any issues with the wheels, you can get to them without taking the side off, but it can be a pain in the butt.
There is a lot of good stuff on this thread already, so I will try not to repeat too much of it.
The tools you will need will depend a lot on where your team is in the spectrum of experience and eagerness. We have 4 FTC teams in our club. 2 of them are at the high end of experience. They are building custom chassis out of CNC routed Delrin/Polycarb or 3D printing major structural elements of their robots. They are also using a lot of different COTS parts from different sources (REV, VEX, Andymark, Actobotics, Banebots, etc). Our other 2 teams are progressing up the experience spectrum and are beginning to explore options outside of the basic Textrix building systems and bending Lexan with a heat gun.
For the teams that are mostly using the standard building kits, you will not need much in terms of machine tools beyond a band saw and a drill press.
For the highly experienced and eager teams a CNC router and a 3D printer are highly valuable tools that they will be able to use to make custom parts.
Probably the best measure I could give you on where your team is at in this spectrum is their use of CAD. If your team is not using CAD to design their robot, then the more advanced tools are not going to be very helpful.
There are a lot of great FTC resources out there. CD, while very helpful, is not really the optimal place to look as it is mostly focused on FRC. There are a lot of folks here that participate in FTC as well as FRC and we are all happy to offer advice. But FTC has their own forum: https://ftcforum.usfirst.org/ . I have found that to be a lot more specific to FTC questions and advice than CD.
I probably can’t speak as well as many others on this thread but from experience, my favorite tool to use for FTC is a Dremel. I have found that at competitions all my team needs is a Dremel, hand tools, a drill and in the past we have used a 3D printer before and a CNC Router. I like the STEPCRAFT as it is under $5,000. If anyone has a better router, I would love to hear of a cheaper and better router to use. We love our STEPCRAFT.
I have found that at the minimum, all you really need are basic tools (Drivers, Drills, a rivet gun, a wrench set and other small hand tools), a drill press and a bandsaw. In FRC you are probably used to a full machine shop. You really don’t need that necessarily in FTC. Everything is essentially just simplified from FRC. I am sure other participants on CD can recommend the exact tools you will need better than I can. Good Luck!
I’m still a newbie in regards to both FTC and FRC, but I’ll share some of my thoughts on what’s been said so far.
Of the build systems mentioned my school has used Tetrix, Rev extrusion, a small amount of ServoCity/Actobotix, and most recently AndyMark S3. Out of all of those, the S3 has has been the best for everything we’ve built this past season. It’s extremely sturdy and due to having slots on two sides, support braces are easy to add. We also use ServoCity ServoBlocks almost exclusively when using servos. They really save you in the long run since they take almost all of the sideways load off a servo, but you will need hole pattern adapters if you don’t use Actobonix parts for the rest of your robot. On the topic we really like the Rev Smart Servo, it uses a metal gears and can be programmed as a regular or continuous rotation servo.
In regards to chassis’s , my school did purchase TileRunners for each of our teams. If they are assembled correctly they work extremely well. But for rookies like myself and the rest of my team it took quite a while to build it correctly.
For electronics, the Rev Expansion Hub really is the best way to go, we still have our old Modern Robotics stuff but we are probably going to donate it since will never be using it again.
For tools, hand drills with bit drivers and sockets are a must. With the amount of bolting things together most FTC build systems require they will save you time and pain. I also recommend getting ball-head drivers for bolts, they really help installing things in hard to reach places. For bigger tool, it’s really up to your budget. I would recommend a drill press or mill with some time of DRO to make drilling holes and patterns easier, some type of saw, a bandsaw would be best, and something computer controlled, whether it be a 3D printer, laser cutter, router, or mill. Also, CAD is very helpful to have knowledge of, Autodesk Inventor is free for students to get, and its pretty easy to learn how to use.
Most importantly, it will be learning experience for you and the students. I would recommend introducing them to CD so they can see how FRC teams work and what they build, even being on a FTC team it’s helped a lot. Good luck!