Getting into College and FRC

FIRST General Forum
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Hello everyone,

I will be starting my college process very soon, and I plan to apply to some top-caliber colleges (Ivies, MIT, Stanford, Caltech, etc.) I feel as though I have pretty decent grades and standardized test scores, but obviously, so do all the other applicants.

I know that one of the largest distinguishers that colleges use to differentiate you is your extracurriculars. Robotics is one of my biggest ones. I am one of the lead members of my club and have led many projects for the team, both during build season and during the preseason.

However, I wanted to understand how much more I would need in the category of extracurriculars to get into some of these schools, as there are hundreds of fellow club presidents across the country who would apply there. It would be nice to get advice from people who have done FRC and have gotten in to some of these schools.

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It’s important to keep in mind that a large part of the college admissions process is becoming more and more arbitrary as students become more competitive.

I’ve always appreciated having something to aspire to. If you want to read what I wrote for the UCs, send me a PM.

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I’ll PM you tomorrow.

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College applications are pretty weird when it comes to extracurriculars.
I go to Caltech and I have friends that have gotten into universities like Stanford. Of course, I’m not an admissions officer so take my suggestions with a grain of salt.

First of all different schools value completely different things and you’re going to want to tailor your application depending on which college you apply to. One thing that is consistent between any application though are these things:

Don’t just talk about FIRST. I love FIRST, I basically breathed FRC and exhaled CAD for the last two years of high school. But don’t write about robotics in all of your essays. You want to show you are an interesting person with skills and experiences that add to the diversity of the university you are applying to and there will be hundreds of other applicants who were in FIRST.

Don’t blabber on about technical skills. Most application readers won’t know what a CNC mill is and they won’t be impressed that much from the fact you know a bunch of acronyms like CAM, FEA, or CFD. One of my Stanford friends who got a patent in high school told me when she met her admissions officer after being admitted that they complimented her studying Chinese in high school before her having a patent on robot remote technology. Mention involvement in the school band, your interests in other languages, or how you organized a political march. If you want to talk about robotics talk about how you taught the younger students on the team or how you led off-season projects. Talk about you going out to pitch to possible sponsors for the FRC team and explaining your robot to your friends. Seriously, keep the technical skills to a minimum.

College admission officers care about your potential as much as your current accomplishments. They want to see you took lead in developing new projects and programs. They want to see passion and drive. They want to know you are interested in improving the status quo and not being afraid to start new things. The letter I got from the Caltech admissions office specifically told me they were impressed with the CAD workshops I created and taught in my high school for interested students. Show that you take initiative and is willing to get stuff done.

**Show you add diversity. **I think around half of my friends at Caltech are bilingual or almost bilingual. They have hobbies like break dancing, large scale knitting, knife making and forging, rock climbing and rappelling, calculator programming (this guy made a fruit ninja for Ti-83’s it’s crazy). You need to have something that helps make you stand out and while it doesn’t have to be at world class skill level, you need to add something different and new to the class you are joining.

**Apply to many schools. **This may be obvious but don’t just apply to top schools. I got into Caltech and Georgia Tech but didn’t get into U of Michigan or Cornell. College applications are holistic and different universities see different things. Don’t be too discouraged if you don’t get into your dream school because with those schools it’s almost the same as throwing a dart since they get so many good applications. I’m completely serious when I say that not going to a top university may be a better choice for you depending on what you want out of college and what you want to do after school. Larger state universities might have larger clubs and more people to interact with. It’s really about finding a college that you would enjoy going to.

I hope this helps ease the stress of applying to college and give you a bit of a direction to take your application. Feel free to message me with questions, concerns, confessions, etc.

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My advice: Don’t worry about having the “right” extracurriculars. Instead, make sure you can fully leverage experiences from your extracurriculars to show creativity, passion, and personality in writing. The activities and titles you have listed really won’t do much to show admissions offices who you are (at least in any way that differentiates you from other applicants). Being able to vividly describe what you learned and experienced during those activities, however, will let you differentiate yourself. While there is no “right” set of extracurriculars that will automatically get you into schools, a well-written essay can use even that burger-flipping job you had one summer to portray you as driven, insightful, and interesting.

Don’t worry about trying to hold yourself up to any standard of what the “right” types of activities to have are. Instead, make sure you know how to talk about what you do in a way that makes admissions offices know who you are beyond what they could ever glean from an arbitrary list of activities. Seriously, robotics and girl scouts were the only extracurriculars I had when I graduated high school, and I now go to Caltech. I credit that solely to how well I showed my best personality and character traits when talking about my experiences from robotics.

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As someone going through the same thing very soon under similar circumstances as OP, I just wanted to resurface this thread to see if anyone had anything to add.

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So much this. Be your best you. Do things that make you happy and grow you as a person, and then make sure that shines through on the applications. There is no right or wrong list of extracurriculars. But there is a right and wrong list for you. If you aren’t enjoying what you’re doing and not learning and growing from your extracurriculars, then how are you going to talk about them aside from a fleeting bullet point that no one will remember.

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If you’re interested in reading my essays shoot me a PM. Basically be you, spend time on essays (PLEASE don’t wait till the night before!) Showcase more than robotics, but leverage the uniqueness of FRC to show how it helped you as a person - more than just CAD or programming skills. Speak to how it taught you core values like team work and coopertition. Speaking to my admissions officer I learned the most impactful part of my application was not my leadership positions or awards I earned, but the legacy I left behind to females on my team.

At the end of the day though, it’s a decent crapshoot, so I also echo applying to many different schools. I got into Georgia Tech and Duke (picked the latter!), but got rejected from WPI. So wild.

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Ditto. Showing that you’ve gone through a rigorous course of study and that you have intellectual curiosity BEYOND the classroom is much more important that belonging to ten clubs that everyone else belongs to.

As far as school choice, those you listed are all great. But hearing people refer to such diverse schools, and saying “the Ivies” always bothers me. You can major in the same field at all of them, but they are all going to provide a different environment and opportunities. Your original post mentions nothing about intended major, only “getting in” to top schools. I’d recommend looking at your major department at a variety of schools (not just US News Top 10 schools) and focus on applying to the schools that have the program that will provide you the best opportunity to do meaningful work/research. In the end, employers want to know what you can DO, not where you went. (Well, employers who are worth working for anyway)

At a meeting with my school district the founder of Princeton Review said that the best school is the one that:

  1. accepts you
  2. is not too far from home
  3. you can afford
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Start your applications early. If you want to be the most competitive for schools, apply early acceptance. I started in august and was completely done with essays in October. TBH writing nearly 20 college essays sucks but eventually the prompts begin to repeat after a while.

If you are shooting for the schools mentioned by the OP, you will most likely need to have GREAT standardized test scores. I have generally seen a ACT of 34 and higher to be competitive. Shoot for that number if you can.

Make sure your essays are fantastic. You cant just have great essays or great grades, or extracurriculars. You need all of the above :eek:

You should try to actively look for opportunities to get into leadership positions and do a lot of service. The reality is that at the competitive schools these are the factors that are used to differentiate between candidates. You will be competing against kids who have done insane amounts of volunteering work.

If you want any info or want to see my essays, just shoot me a PM.

Sometimes, settling for a school that is cheap, offers a great education, and will get you great connections and a good experience is more worth it than an Ivy. Ill save myself $30,000 annually which I can invest in the market or in graduate school education.

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You’re always welcome to come study at the Technion in Israel :smiley:

World class school in all STEM fields (including robotics), $3800/year tuition, and they love accepting Americans

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A lot of my application had to do with FRC but it’s important to have other things. I was also a competitive gymnast and did a few other clubs/volunteer activities. I also had a job.

My grades did not match many of the schools I applied to. In fact only one school out of the 5 I applied to was I within the bracket for their average accepted students. I didn’t get denied from any school I applied to though and got money from 4/5. I largely believe that had to do with the holistic parts of my application.

I’ve sent my essay, common app and other supplements to many people involved in FRC. Happy to spread them around to anyone who wants. Just pm me.

Don’t choose a school because of its name. Choose the school you like the most and you believe you can be the most successful at. College is what you make of it.

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Most of my aerospace engineering colleagues are not graduates from MIT, Stanford, and other “Ivies”, as it seems a large portion of those students end up taking a route leading them to getting PhDs and becoming professors.

Most of my colleagues go to “good” schools targeting their intended major, get industry experience through internships/co-ops, hopefully improve themselves through grad school in their field of interest (many companies will pay for your masters education). After you’e been in “the industry” for a few years, the college you attended really does not matter. We actually prefer students who have gone through a more practical education and led projects or initiatives during that timeframe.

My biggest tips for you are:

  1. Focus on what you think you really want to do after college, and target a college experience that will help you get there rather than just setting a goal of going to the “top school in the country”.

  2. Do NOT put yourself into a huge amount of debt post-college. Ivies can be very expensive and you should look at the total value of your education, look at it as an investment. If you can get accepted into MIT, you can probably get a significant amount of financial aid from a “good” school, and you will end up with just as good of a job but with little to no debt.

  3. When applying to schools, state YOUR specific contribution to the clubs, not the fact that you were in them. Colleges wants to see your personal contributions and influence on the project. FRC is a great project to mention, but by itself is meaningless unless you demonstrate your leadership and influence on the project.

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I’ll second this point, but I wanted to also mention that if you’re applying super early, make sure you’re aware of whether the “Early Bird” November 1st Deadline is for Early ACTION or Early DECISION. With Early Action, you’re basically just applying early to hear back early. Early Decision, however, is binding. Here’s what I mean by that. Let’s say for example that Princeton is an Early Decision school. If you apply there before November 1st and get admitted, you have to withdraw all other applications and attend Princeton.
Just something to be wary of.

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This is the best advice I can give (sorry it’s long!) . I am a HS senior about to graduate so I understand what you’re going through. I was super stressed so I way over-researched college admission stuff. I did get into Stanford but I don’t know how. This is partially my best guess as to why but mainly stuff I wish I knew before the college admissions process. Hope it helps!

If you are at all low income or similarly have gone through financial challenges, I’d highly recommend looking at Questbridge- if you get the scholarship you essentially get to apply for early decision to up to like 8 top colleges at once and if you get in you get a full scholarship.

In general, ivies and other top colleges are really expensive but if you qualify, you get fantastic financial aid. For example, for Stanford if your parents make under 60k you don’t have to pay tuition or room and board, and under 120k tuition is free. For this reason, Ivies can end up being less than state colleges (use online financial aid calculators!). Apply to some reach schools but keep in mind that they get too many applications for luck not to be involved.

College is what you make of it. It really doesn’t matter what type of college you get into if you don’t put the work in and take advantage of opportunities. Likewise, if you put the work in and take advantage of opportunities, you will be “successful” regardless (only in quotes because life is about more than being successful).

Completing a few years in community college and finishing GREs and then transferring into a university is a fantastic program and a great way to save money. State universities tend to have really good resources and especially strong engineering programs (as well as others). The college admission process is stressful but find places you could see yourself living at for the next four years with an opportunity for growth.

For college essays, if you can only listen to one piece of advice- BE GENUINE. Let your personality- whether weird , sarcastic, funny, etc- shine through your essays. If you find yourself writing what you think the admissions officers want to hear, stop because they get thousands of those essays every year. What gets you up in the morning? What is so important in your life that if you left out it wouldn’t be you anymore? This was Robotics for me. If the essays seem write themselves after getting started, congrats you found it- that can be really hard to do. Start on college essays early and WAY more important than even your topic (no worries if you don’t think you can find an answer to one of those questions- that’s what the rest of your life is for), make it you. Don’t exaggerate, don’t worry about strict format, or a serious tone throughout. Have someone proofread your essays (regardless grammar is important!!). Ask for teacher recommendations early. Apply for FIRST Scholarships! (Don’t make my mistake and not realize there are some for any college until the majority of deadlines have passed)

Enjoy your senior year- yes you’re worried about college and tired of high school but it goes by so quick and the future will come whether you want it to or not. It will work out in the end.

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Personally being a Math and Computer Science and Ambassador for the College of Science at Purdue, I can give you a run down of what they value a lot.

My Tips:

  1. Show dedication and passion in what you do.

  2. **Don’t do anything you don’t want to do just because you think you will look better for it. **
    It’s phony, and honestly, no one enjoys people who do this. I know this may sound insane, but I personally dropped out of National Honors Society because the organization was poorly run at my former high school, and was actually hindering my community involvement. Do service and extracurricular because they are fun, enriching, and empowering things to do, not for a resume. By building yourself first, that that naturally builds a resume.

  3. **Visit your colleges. **
    Of Thousands of applications, to be able to say, “When I visited your college…” is extreme beneficial. It shows you took the time to actually come and learn about the school. Very few students actually take the time to do so. If travel isn’t a feasible option, set up a phone interview with one of the recruiters or professors. Not only does this look good, but it also allows you to learn more about that school for research purposes.

  4. Know of all the opportunities
    Yet another way to show that you know what your school has to offer, and the ways you will utilize it. For example, Purdue is home to PFP, Purdue FIRST Programs, and organization that one can mentor local teams, organize FIRST events, volunteer, hone your leadership skills, or all of the above! That has been one of the amazing communities I’ve been able to experience, and to be able to talk about how much it would benefit me was an amazing thing. By tell the recruiters exactly how you plan to take advantage of their college, you show you will get the most out of their experience.

If you or anyone would like to talk about what it is like, please reply to me. I will personally get in touch with my recruiter to he can share more of his tips with you. His response will come hopefully tomorrow. Good luck!

Contacts:
John Fisher
Director of Recruiting
Math Sciences Building, Room 222
(765) 494-1990
[email protected]

Anastasia Krutulis
Director of Out-of-State Recruiting
Math Sciences Building, Room 218
(765) 496-1770
[email protected]

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I’ve gotten into G Tech (well guaranteed transfer as a sophomore), RPI, UCSB, and still waiting on Berkely. I can send you my app if you’d like.