Hats Off To The Wsdom Of FIRST

FIRST General Forum
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Posted by Bill Beatty at 1/7/2001 1:42 PM EST

Other on team #71, Team Hammond, from Team Hammond.

I am again amazed at the wisdom of FIRST. They have eliminated the blocking, pinning, hooking, entanglement, unintentional tipping, and other intended acts from the competition. They could have made more rules and have the refs interfere with the game, but no, they came up with the simple idea of having all the robots on the same team! What genius!

Don’t worry about the great defensive teams of the past. They will apply their talents to developing offensive machines.

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Posted by Lora Knepper at 1/7/2001 2:05 PM EST

Other on team #419, Rambots, from UMass Boston / Boston College High School and Seeking Sponsorship.

In Reply to: Hats Off To The Wsdom Of FIRST
Posted by Bill Beatty on 1/7/2001 1:42 PM EST:

I love the idea that we all have to work together! Talk about forcing interaction and communication between teams right from the start. I have to say, though I loved playing in '98 when it was us vs. the world, I have enjoyed the alliance system much much more. Hats off to FIRST for making us work together to beat the game rather than each other!

~ Lora

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Posted by Robby at 1/7/2001 3:49 PM EST

Other on team #108, The SigmaC@Ts, from AIFL and Motorola.

In Reply to: Loving the possibilities – thanks FIRST!
Posted by Lora Knepper on 1/7/2001 2:05 PM EST:

Than last year, THIS would be it. For anyone who was watching last years game, I think this was another one of those times when other hotel guests complained about the loudness of FIRST attendees. Wow. Let me say WOW again. I love it. I reallly do. Now I have a good excuse when I cheer for other teams!!! And a good excuse to share ideas.

Im looking forward to this being one of the most exciting times. When was the last time you saw a part of the field fall on a robot? Ah hah! Didnt think so ::CHUCKLES:: B^P. See you all again in six weeks!

-Robby O

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Posted by bill whitley at 1/7/2001 4:26 PM EST

Student on team #70, Auto City Bandits, from Powers Catholic High School and Kettering University.

In Reply to: Hats Off To The Wsdom Of FIRST
Posted by Bill Beatty on 1/7/2001 1:42 PM EST:

: I am again amazed at the wisdom of FIRST. They have eliminated the blocking, pinning, hooking, entanglement, unintentional tipping, and other intended acts from the competition. They could have made more rules and have the refs interfere with the game, but no, they came up with the simple idea of having all the robots on the same team! What genius!

FIRST did remove a lot of complicated, judgement calls on blocking, pinning, hooking, entanglement, tipping and other acts, but in doing so, they took away the best part of the competition, in my opinion. All the teams on the same team is no longer sport. FIRST used to be a sport, now, its a game.

It reminds me of ‘What Women Want’ with Helen Hunt & Mel Gibson. In the Nike commercial they design “No games, only sport” I feel the same way. I am not a fan of the games we will now be playing (lets see if we can balance). I like sport (lets see if my robot can keep your robot off the ramp).

Bill

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Posted by Tony K at 1/7/2001 5:00 PM EST

Student on team #292, PantherTech, from Western HS and DaimlerChrysler.

In Reply to: Hats Off To The Wsdom Of FIRST
Posted by Bill Beatty on 1/7/2001 1:42 PM EST:

Not necessarily. Remember, you want your colored ball on top of a goal, which in theory doesn’t rule out blocking, pinning, hooking, entanglement, unintentional tipping, etc, but sure will decrease a great amount of it. But then again, that’s not what the game’s about =).

-Tony

: I am again amazed at the wisdom of FIRST. They have eliminated the blocking, pinning, hooking, entanglement, unintentional tipping, and other intended acts from the competition. They could have made more rules and have the refs interfere with the game, but no, they came up with the simple idea of having all the robots on the same team! What genius!

: Don’t worry about the great defensive teams of the past. They will apply their talents to developing offensive machines.

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Posted by Ken Leung at 1/7/2001 6:01 PM EST

Student on team #192, Gunn Robotics Team, from Henry M. Gunn Senior High School.

In Reply to: Hats Off To The Wsdom Of FIRST
Posted by Bill Beatty on 1/7/2001 1:42 PM EST:

You know, the first impression I get from listening to this year’s game is the space station up there… how people are working together building toward a single goal. And you know what, this year have a totally different dynamic in the game, and it’s a win-win situation where everyone WILL be successful in what ever they are design to do.

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Posted by bill whitley at 1/7/2001 6:07 PM EST

Student on team #70, Auto City Bandits, from Powers Catholic High School and Kettering University.

In Reply to: you know… this game reminds me of something
Posted by Ken Leung on 1/7/2001 6:01 PM EST:

Yes, the game presents a noble cause, something more like real world engineering process, a group of people competition towards a common goal. However, that isnt what FIRST used to be about. It used to be sport, and that is why it was so fun. We now have something real, but will we like it? Time will tell.

Bill

: You know, the first impression I get from listening to this year’s game is the space station up there… how people are working together building toward a single goal. And you know what, this year have a totally different dynamic in the game, and it’s a win-win situation where everyone WILL be successful in what ever they are design to do.

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Posted by Jessica Boucher at 1/7/2001 6:20 PM EST

Student on team #237, Sie-H2O-Bots, from Watertown High School and Eastern Awning Systems & The Siemon Company.

In Reply to: noble cause
Posted by bill whitley on 1/7/2001 6:07 PM EST:

Yes, I agree wholeheartedly…very noble, but maybe too real. I do FIRST to get away from real life and tehn apply it to real life when I’m in the real world, if that made any sense.

-Jessica, who started reading this forum at 5:20 and is ALMOST done an hour later:)

>>>We now have something real, but will we like it? Time will tell.

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Posted by Jon at 1/7/2001 9:24 PM EST

Engineer on team #190, Gompei, from Mass Academy of Math and Science and Worcester Polytechnic Institute.

In Reply to: Re: noble cause
Posted by Jessica Boucher on 1/7/2001 6:20 PM EST:

I agree with you Jessica, I’m notorious for being involved in a wide range of things and while the activities aren’t connected logically the lessons learned in one do apply to the others. FIRST is easily number one in this respect for me. I am proud of my FIRST involvement and the stuff i learn in it…

While i miss the crash bang action, i think i’ll appreciate this game more than the others as i try to figure out what i’m gonna do out of college.

: Yes, I agree wholeheartedly…very noble, but maybe too real. I do FIRST to get away from real life and tehn apply it to real life when I’m in the real world, if that made any sense.

: -Jessica, who started reading this forum at 5:20 and is ALMOST done an hour later:)

: >>>We now have something real, but will we like it? Time will tell.

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Posted by Frank at 1/7/2001 8:16 PM EST

Coach on team #97, Psychedelics, from CRLS and MIT.

In Reply to: noble cause
Posted by bill whitley on 1/7/2001 6:07 PM EST:

FIRST used to be all about sport. It was the “NCAA of Smarts” as Dean always used to say. And that’s why we loved it. It gave us a competition…right in front of our faces. We came up with strategies for dealing with all sorts of opponents and worked hard under pressure. I remember going up against teams like Beatty and Delphi and wondering what they were going to do and reacting to their well-trained drivers.

This year is different however. There are no opponents out there with you, and whatever strategy you plan will not be impacted by people pinning you or taking your balls out of the goal or any other unexpected event.

Personally, I think that’s a shame. FIRST has its appeal to many people in that it’s a sport with robots as the competitors. This year’s competition is not a sport though. It’s more of a show of what a robot can do.

So we can solve a real world problem now, but will that inspire kids like sports used to? We’ll see.

Frank
Team 97 - MIT/Teradyne/CRLS/CHS

: Yes, the game presents a noble cause, something more like real world engineering process, a group of people competition towards a common goal. However, that isnt what FIRST used to be about. It used to be sport, and that is why it was so fun. We now have something real, but will we like it? Time will tell.

: Bill

: : You know, the first impression I get from listening to this year’s game is the space station up there… how people are working together building toward a single goal. And you know what, this year have a totally different dynamic in the game, and it’s a win-win situation where everyone WILL be successful in what ever they are design to do.

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Posted by Dan at 1/7/2001 11:44 PM EST

Other on team - from Carnegie Mellon sponsored by -.

In Reply to: Will solving a problem inspire like a sport did?
Posted by Frank on 1/7/2001 8:16 PM EST:

  FIRST is still a sport in my opinion.  Sports don't require that there be, literally, head-to-head competition.  Consider sports like swimming or gymnastics.  The competitors aren't interacting with their opponents directly; it's not even crucial they be in the same building.  The winner is determined by comparing performances.
  The same goes for FIRST, except now you have to temporarily view some of your opponents as teammates.  The team (or 4 teams) that can do this the best are(ideally) declared the champions.
 The only question is if there will be enough matches to significantly remove the luck factor.  
 I love typical head-to-head competitions, but I really like how this year's competition is making us think differently.

(paraphrase)“Society gets what it celebrates,” and this year FIRST is really celebrating true cooperation.
Dan

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Posted by Matt Leese at 1/7/2001 11:10 PM EST

Other on team #73 from Edison Technical HS and Alstom & Rochester Institute of Technology.

In Reply to: Hats Off To The Wsdom Of FIRST
Posted by Bill Beatty on 1/7/2001 1:42 PM EST:

My initial reaction to this game was along the lines of “oh no – what was dean smoking?” After awhile to get used to it, I think this game definatley has possiblities. The game this year reminds me more of racing events. At first you get time trials to see who qualifies (who’s faster but run independently). Then, later, you go head to head with others but you don’t interact. I’m still in a wait and see attitude about this years competition.

Matt