Historic FIRST data wanted

Hey everyone,

I’m compiling (or attempting to compile) all the information on FRC teams and seasons from 1992 to 2002 (up until the current TIMS system took over in 2003). So far I have collected quite a bit of data, but could use more. Currently I’m in need of:

  • Awards and their recipients from 1992 and 1993
  • Match data from 1992 - 2000

Keep in mind that I’m trying to keep this as accurate as possible. Anything you can do to confirm your claim is greatly appreciated; be it a picture of the trophy itself proving its existence, a news clipping, or an official press release to document the outcome of the event.

Thanks,
Q. Sheets

The compilation thus far - (Excel, iWork, PDF)

http://www.team358.org/files/frc_records/AllAwards.xls There are the awards 1992-Present. Thank You Mark!

we have ours on our website, core2062.com.

I’ll add my own desired historical data if anyone has access to these:

  • Temporary team numbers list for 1996

  • I have most game rules, but need the Complete Game Manuals for: 1992, 1993, 1994, 1995, [strike]2000[/strike]
    Lacking full manuals then:[LIST]

  • The basic game rules for 1994, 1995
    *]Kit checklists for 1994, 1995, 1996
    [/LIST]

While this list is great (and it is), there’s no documentation to go along with it that confirms its findings.

I think I can help you with that list. I just uploaded the 2000 Game Manual (note - any link not crossed out works).

Thanks for the 2000 manual. I keep records on the Kit of Parts changes over the years, so the Kit stuff is really helpful.

The data sources for that list are documented at the bottom of the webpage that the list comes from. The same original sources you’re using are there plus some others. Not all details are there, for instance, individual corrections we’ve received over the years aren’t all listed.

Be aware that FIRST does have errors in some of those published lists, so try to get multiple confirming sources when you get to your validation phase. We began with an older FIRST database that we archived before FIRST discarded it, but it too had data entry errors that had to be reconciled against other documentation. The current FIRST database also has data entry errors and omissions that have to be backfilled.

The problem I find with your sources is that though the sources say 1992-1999 and 1992-2000, the only data from the 1992-1994 seasons ever put on the FIRST website were the lists of teams and sponsors.

The discrepancy listed in the AllAwards spreadsheet, actually looks like an error of miscommunication. It read, “2005 Indiana Boilermaker: Entrepreneurship claimed by both 868 & 234 (234 has the trophy though).” When looking at the official results, 868 won it at Boilermaker and 234 won it at the Florida Regional (which the award at that event isn’t even listed on their website).

Yea, we both have run into that roadblock since those are the same sources you’re referencing. That’s why the original sources are linked, so people can see what data was contributed by those sources if they are interested in doing the same digging.
Hopefully you’ll turn up some new sources. Teams/mentors from that era have given me a few of the awards, but no one ever seems to remember what anyone else got.

234 told me they have the trophy from winning it at Boilermaker.
I only listed that discrepancy because I haven’t heard from 868.

Other discrepancies that have been reconciled are not noted in that spreadsheet. Obvious ones such as when teams are listed as winning awards at Regionals the team didn’t attend (2003 animation was a notable exception since teams didn’t have to attend to submit).
When you start reconciling and cross checking you’ll start seeing those.

Team 45, Technokats, had a press release from just after the 1994 competition that lists all the award winners.

Note: I did email FIRST to see if they happened to have an archive with press releases from 1992 and 1993. Michelle Normand (the most helpful lady ever) emailed me back saying they were unable to find any going back that far.

If any teams have paper archives they can scan and post, it will be appreciated. Maybe we can help FIRST build an archive.

All,

The TechnoKats have just updated their website and there are a bunch of documents in their History Project page. This may help.

Sincerely,
Andy Baker

Great!
Glad to have that back, and with more historical records than ever!
P.S. I like the picture of the Kit of Parts from 1992 and a partial list of awards (without winners) tells me I’m missing at least 4 more awards (I have 9 winners from various sources).

A lot of the team lists and awards info was extracted from some of your stuff that filled in missing holes and contributed as secondary sources to help in validating the FIRST data.

108 might have something. I’m not sure though, since the system we had was from awhile ago. We had a pretty awesome system, SOAP (don’t know if anyone remembers it, it’s been a few years since it was done). I know you check out TBA (The Blue Alliance) and they have a lot, or FIRSTwiki might have some. But again, not sure.

I think I found the site from someone on Chief Delphi. This site has a copy of most old game manuals. Didn’t see it posted yet so hope it helps.

http://www.first-a-holics.com/competitions/

The latest TechnoKats History Project had some of the game manuals I was missing.
Still missing Awards from:

  • Non-Manchester regionals in 1996 & 1995 (Charlotte, NC & Dallas, TX). Missing those event team lists, too.
  • 1992 partial awards (have 9, but at least 4 others are unknown)
    *]1993 partial awards (have 4, missing at least 7 others)
    Missing Game Manual from 1994

Are we sure these events happened? I found evidence that NC was planned in 1995, but no evidence of it occurring. For example, in the planned documentation, two P&G teams (Aiken HS & Walnut Hills HS) are set to attend NC and not NE; however in the official document, they attended NE.

This wouldn’t have been the first time FIRST wanted to expand and wasn’t able to do so. Though expansion would have been nice, maybe it wasn’t completely feasible.

I think it’s pretty obvious based on the registered team list.
You’re suggesting that a lot of the teams that went to Championship didn’t play in a regional event beforehand, and some registered teams never played anywhere.
Two years in a row?
Doesn’t seem like a terribly reasonable suggestion, but it was a small competition then.

This is what I meant about validating our data.
We have to find as many different sources as possible and reconcile them.
That will tell us what’s missing and what’s just wrong.
The registered team list tells us we’re missing fully half of the awards given out in 1995 and 1996.
With the lists we have we know which teams might possibly still have the event results hidden away, so we can try contacting them directly to see if they have records stuffed in the bottom of a drawer someplace, or an original mentor/student who might remember some details.

Take 1995 for example:
Non-Manchester teams playing at Championship 1995:
6, MN
43, MI
45, IN
74, MI
81, IL
83, WA
98, TX
108, FL
120, OH
129, TX
141, MI
148, TX
161, MI
171, WI

(removed as irrelevant and way too bulky)

This was not uncommon in 1995/1996. I don’t think the concept of a “regional” or “championship” really existed as far as many of us were concerned.

Take 1995 for example:
Non-Manchester teams playing at Championship 1995:
74, MI
141, MI

I was the driver for 74 in 1995, and 141 was our “cross town rival”. I can confirm that both of these teams played only at the Championship at Epcot in 1995. 74 also only attended the Championship in 1996 (I’m nearly certain this is true for 141 as well). It wasn’t until the Midwest Regional was formed in 1997 that it became feasible for us to attend a regional event.

I definitely confirm this. Back in the late 90’s, a few teams would show up to to the Championships without playing in a previous event. In order to make the Championships a more quality event, FIRST began to require that teams attend some Regional event. I am not sure, but I think this requirement started happening in 2000 or 2001.

Andy B.

It sounds like Nationals was just another event back then.
Maybe we’re not missing awards from '95 and '96 after all.

So do you guys think that some teams dropped out rather than travel and play anywhere?
I would have expected the enrollment to fall rather than rise the following year if teams found it so hard to reach an opportunity to play, but we do have teams in the UK, Turkey, etc. facing the same issues today I suppose.

Was it more of a science fair atmosphere in the beginning where teams might just work at home and not compete at all?
Maybe registration was only a matter of paying for the Kit rather than competing?

P.S. I love historical perspective :slight_smile:

From my perspective as a student, it was the ***only ***event. At the time I don’t know if I was even aware that there was an event in New Hampshire. The whole premise of our school’s involvement was “hey, we’re going to go compete at this robotics event at Disney World, want to join?” It’s also important to remember that in 1995, there was only something like 38 teams at Epcot, so even the “Championship Event” was small compared to many regionals today.

I can definitely say it was not a science fair atmosphere. Really, the whole thing felt the same back then as it does today. The main difference was that there was no Chief Delphi, and most people were not “online”, so the build season (at least for our team) was done in almost complete isolation (but we definitely were aware that we were working towards the goal of competing in Florida). In 1995 the very first time we saw another robot was after the build season was over and we had a demo with the other team in our city at the mall (FIRST let us keep our robot past the ship date for that event as I recall - we had to do something similar to the “bag & tag” that they have now with someone else locking our crate).

The event at Epcot even back in those years was basically the same as they are today. If anything, the atmosphere was even more fun than it is now, as everything was outside, bright & sunny. Teams had brightly-colored t-shirts, there was loud music being played, and people did the Macarena (some things never change, I guess).