In b4 buttongate

As if UNH district finals couldn’t get more weird…

I’ll bite, what are you talking about? I’m 1800 miles away …

During the UNH District Event finals, a human player’s button fell off, went through the chute, and ended up beneath the tote. When the stack was placed on the platform, the button was wedged underneath the stack. The rules state that the stack must be “completely” supported by totes to count, so the stack did not count.

I am not sure if that had any effect on the outcome of the match, but the whole thing was very bizarre.

i would very much like to see this, is there any video uploaded (or going to be uploaded soon?)

Got a pic from a ref, will try to post.

I’m surprised at:

  1. The button made it from the Chute to the Scoring Platform; and
  2. The Ref’s saw the button under the stack.

In any case, the rule is the rule. Nothing can be between the Tote and the Platform except for another Tote.


just wow, how does that happen? also, did the HP get a foul for not having a button on?:rolleyes:

I would have thought they’d get a foul for putting something other than a tote through the human feeder chute.

No foul listed. And not having the button is a fix-it penalty, not a points penalty.

I was the operator for the robot who built the buttoned stack, so I (rather unfortunately) saw it all happen. In my HP’s rushing around, the button (which was at about mid-tote-chute height) popped off and happened to land right in the chute behind a tote. Nobody noticed until it flew out the chute and found a snuggly spot in the bottom of our six stack. We scored and capped it, hoping it wouldn’t matter, but in the back of our minds we knew it wouldn’t end well.

Luckily, there were no fouls! I think we were all way too confused and surprised to think about it, I know I was :stuck_out_tongue:

THE button

I am the human player from 4564. The button was one of the funniest things that has happened to me in FIRST. I thought you may want to see the button! I am #buttongate

Also to note, this was a replay of match 1. The first match was stopped due to all of the lights going out in the middle of that match. This was followed by a 142-141 finish in finals match two. Such a fun, entertaining way to end an event.

For what it is worth, Counting the stack would not have changed the outcome. Instead of 155 to 84 it would have been 155 to 126. Congratulations Team 133, BERT, 213, The Dirty Birds and 501, The Power Knights! The 142-141 finale was awesome! This event had a plethora of high scores and terrific robots. I am looking forward to seeing and working with all the teams again at WPI for the District Championship.

Surprised that Chief Delphi isn’t exploding over this right now.

Unlike Dallas there is proof. Picture worth a thousand wild opinions.

This to me is a good example of Bureaucratic ruling.

Not sure what you mean here - the rules (and Q&A - in particular Q439) make it very clear that “support” is only transitive through other TOTES - not any other object that may be on the FIELD, regardless of whether it was intended to be there or not. Is this a literal interpretation of that? Yes, but if you start reading things into the rules that aren’t there, then they become sort of “guidelines”, not rules.

If I were a ref (which I’m not) the deciding factor for me would be if I could easily dislodge that button from the stack - i.e. is it just there on the edge of a TOTE, or is it really wedged in there? If the former, it scores - there is unambiguously no support being provided by the button. If the latter, then it doesn’t score. From the picture, it could go either way. Of course, I defer to the ref at the match for the ruling, which was that it didn’t score.

It should be noted that Frank Merrick was field side while the refs were discussing so the refs weren’t coming to their own conclusion and they have to follow the rules put before them even if it might seem silly. The refs at UNH were extremely consistent with upholding the rule book including clarifying the rules when “can wars” started dictating who placed robots first.

While an honest mistake the rules are the rules and at the end of the day the decision had no bearing on the outcome of the match. Thanks to 58, 126, 133, 213, 501, and 4564 for making for an exciting finals match up.