Its getting to be RIDICULOUS!

Threads have been popping up, i can think of two imparticular, where people are complaining and whining about the job that FIRST is doing. FIRST is working their bum off to keep this thing moving. You try and make something as diverse as FIRST robotics, and expensive as FIRST robotics running. The stress is probably multiplied when about 1000 teams are depending on FIRST to keep things running smoothly and to keep it off the ground. FIRST is doing an awesome job. Just because they aren’t serving your every need, giving you the parts you want, having to change the Chairman’s award submission the way you dont like. Instead of complaining about it, eevryone needs to start working with wut they are given, and start apreciating FIRST, not complaining about wut they think FIRST is doing wrong.

Thank you, Thank you, Thank you I have been waiting to hear that since the new game was announced and ppl started to down FIRST

i totally agree w/ u…FIRST does so much for kids involved in it and all this year its totally being bashed…and u all say u love FIRST! come on now!

My sentiments exactly. I’d like to see some of the complainers pull the kind of stuff off that the FIRST staff pulls.

Just to nitpick, of course, proper spelling (corrected in the quote) is appreciated :wink:

I think most FIRST-ers, or at least most that I know of, do appreciate FIRST. Because some of them might complain or whine once in a while doesn’t mean that they don’t appreciate FIRST’s efforts. This is a forum, and one that I would like to think is meant for discussion. As long as the posters aren’t being completely unruly, obnoxious, or acting otherwise out of line, these threads should continue. Maybe you can sway their opinions and make them all that much more grateful. Maybe the FIRST staff will get some good ideas. Not all negativity is a bad thing. Think of some of it as constructive criticism. This is not to say that some of the posts aren’t out of line. FIRST-ers should be grateful. Heck, they should be more than grateful. But they should also be allowed to have thier own opinions.

Rather then complaining, shouldn’t people be asking what they can do to fix the problem? What’s the point of posting something that can’t be helped? If you don’t ask for or present a possible solution, then why are you posting?

There is a difference between flaming FIRST and giving them constructive criticism. Some people need to figure out the difference.

the complaining is a good example of human nature.

Being on a FIRST team entails a lot of stress - its very demanding.

When someone does something that causes us pain or discomfort, or makes us angry we dont like feeling that way

for some reason the normal human response it to inflict pain back in the direction from which it came - to lash out at the source - to punish that person for making you feel bad.

We do it all the time, without realizing it. It seems to be instinctive. We do this when we are infants and unless someone points it out you may do it for the rest of your life.

Whats the solution? If someone has caused you grief, or thrown you a curveball then its perfectly ok to vent, to say “FIRST did this and that and I am SO ANGRY RIGHT NOW I COULD SPIT QUARTER TWENTY BOLTS THROUGH THE WALL!!!”

Anger is normal, anger is ok - it gives FIRST the chance to come back and say, “Yes, we know this is causing problems and we’re sorry for the grief its causeing”

funny thing is, as soon as someone else acknowledges your anger, acknowledges that you have a good reason to be upset, that you have been put in a difficult situation - as soon as that happens your anger melts away in seconds, and its gone for good!

but whats not OK it to attack FIRST, to insinuate that they are incompetent, or that they dont care.

If you are angry, then be angry, but in your anger do not ‘sin’ :c)

maybe CD should open a new forum section - the scream room, where frustrated posters can vent their anger, find some symphatic shoulders to lean on for a few minutes, and then get back to work?

And disable bad reputation for that section. ::shudders at the nightmare that might ensue…::

I agree…if people aren´t satisfied with what FIRST is deciding to do, the solution is simple: LEAVE. Nobody´s making them participate!!!

I completely agree with everything that has been said in the thread so far.

I just want to add this:

First off, its been said before, but FIRST is doing the best they can, and personally i think they are doing a great job.

but whats not OK it to attack FIRST, to insinuate that they are incompetent, or that they dont care
i agree 150% with this. FIRST is awesome and they do care. FIRST is one of the greatest organizations out there and when you think about it, they care a great deal about what happens to each and every team there is.
I know that the Canadian Regional Director (Mark Breadner) was helping my team find sponsors in early-to mid November when we still had no money. It is people like him and the rest of the volunteers that make FIRST such a great thing to be a part of and make it so that each team is taken care of.

Second off, Chiefdelphi is a great forum and Brandon has done an awesome job in making it this awesome. However, I must say that peoples complaints about FIRST do NOT belong here. Maybe if a thread was created for members only to see … but thats besides the point.

When you go to a company to ask for sponsorship, you give them the link to www.usfirst.org (obviously). well usfirst.org links to Chiefdelphi and why in the world would a company want to get involved in something where the participants are not happy with the organization. Granted not everyone is complaining, but when you see a few threads with complaints, from a company’s perspective, FIRST is not making its participants happy.

Bottom Line: FIRST is awesome, sure they have minor problems, but they do their best to sort them out as soon as possible and I do not think that Chiefdelphi is the place for these complaints.

That forum would be a nightmare… :ahh:

I’ve always thought that the CD users were polite and well behaved. That would go right out the window if we had a Scream Room forum… :slight_smile:

in my oppinion, if people seriously have issues with FIRST, they should take it up with people who actually have some power to maybe fix the problem. I can garuntee y’all that FIRST is not trying to ignore its participants. But like it has been mentioned before, the organization only has like 100 staff members and the rest of the organization is built off a volunteer staff, one that I hope to be a member of in my freshman year of college, after I’m done as a participant so that FIRST can continue to improve upon the level of excellence I believe they have already achieved.

Please, if you can’t help fix the problem, then don’t become part of it by discouraging corprorations from funding FIRST and limiting even more their cash flow. God bless FIRST, CD, and what both organizations are trying to do.

Unfortunately, as long as there is FIRST, there will always be “monday morning quarterbacks”. It is human nature to complain, to vent, to let out frustration…and no matter what we do, its going to happen on these boards. There are a few givens that everyone should understand, and I’m sure most do…

  1. FIRST works very hard to try to make a game that keeps us captivated while opening up to a crowd of interested sponsors, promotion opportunities, etc…

  2. No matter who you are, no matter how much you think you know FIRST, the game will always be hit or miss, and there is no way to make everyone love the game.

  3. In order to keep the game interesting and creative, and to assure that there is no “answer”, FIRST has to take chances with rules. Many people will not like the rule changes, but they are in essence what will make or break a game.

I realized a few years back that when FIRST releases a game, it is easy to jump to conclusions…and then be wrong later. Perfect example was in 1999 when alliances were introduced. Many people didnt like the idea of joining with other teams. In the end, it was probably one of the best moves FIRST has ever made.

With this, I remind everyone that though you may want to vent…and this is America, we have the luxury of freedom of speech (within Brandons allowance of course on these boards), you might want to hold off about a couple more months before you start flaming FIRST for game changes.

To those who are a part of FIRST staff who view these boards and have to listen to the harsh criticisms…thank you. You are patient, you do more than just make the game, set up regionals, and all the other administrative details. You live these games with us, and for that, EVERYONE on this board is very lucky. It shows how much you care about FIRST and the futures of the many young minds who will go through the program.

Good Luck to all,
Andy Grady

why not set it up so you cant post your screaming fits of anger there, but they never appear on the forum - maybe only let mentors read them, offer back a few encouraging words

that way, the venting wont get spewed on the general public - or maybe nobody reads them at all?

At times things could get a little much for people to handle, they maybe just mad or discouraged. Some words of encouragements maybe needed. :wink: I personally propose a room where they can go to let off some steam, maybe not necessairly the ‘anger’ room but more like the ‘I need to complain’ room. Often people do things that are not exactly the smartest things to do or say, but mostly it’s the spur of the moment type of thing that they regret later. That way everyone doesn’t necessairly need to read other’s complains, rather people who chose to be uplifting could chose to read the complains and perhaps offer some calming words. :slight_smile:

It was one mans dream to make this thing big.

Thats all I have to say

I don’t want to pick on this one response, but it will help me illustrate a slightly different point than many of the comments so far.

I really want to hear from all those that are not satisfied with FIRST and the way things have gone so far (and may continue). I think that we should welcome the complainers, the “whiners” (yes, I have used that term), the agitators and the malcontents.

FIRST knows that there are problems with the implementation of the competition this year (as there have been in every prior year). The fact that there are areas in which to improve is a surprise to no one. But it is harder to understand the relative importance of these items from the perspective of the teams, and sorting the items important to the teams from those important to the internal operations of FIRST.

This is where the feedback from the “complainers” become critical. It is largely because of that we are able to figure out where the most aggregious errors may lie in how things are implemented, and provide meaningful information and constructive suggestions back to FIRST. I don’t want you to leave - I want you to keep writing!

My only request is that everyone provides their feedback (“complaints”? “whines”? “kvetches”?) in a CONSTRUCTIVE manner without personal attacks, diatribes, massive flames, late-night rants, or tantrums. Talk to FIRST the way you would like someone to talk to you. You can disagree, but be courteous. If we all act like adults, then FIRST will be able to respond to us as adults, and we will all help build a better program. But definitely keep the feedback coming!

-dave

Better yet, while telling FIRST and others how things might be done better, VOLUNTEER to help make it happen and then DO what you said you would. Help once or twice and show you’re good at whatever it is, and the next thing you know, you’ll be in charge and you can do it your way.

Now there’s a scary thought…

You know what? I try to tell it like it is.
I love FIRST as much as anyone. They do 99% of what they do better than what I would ever expect. However, if one of the members of my team or if I have a gripe about something FIRST-related, CD is the first place I come to vent and see if other people have the same or similar issue.
The problem is that overzealousness abounds in FIRST. I get flamed regularly when I make even the slightest criticism of FIRST, and God forbid if I should use any hint of facetiousness in my post because every zealot and his/her team knows that FIRST only lends itself to the most serious gracious professionals.
I believe that a forum should be open to all schools of thought and means of expressing them. If my tongue is in my cheek at times then that should be alright. Please don’t pop me in the chin to make me bite it off just because you disagree with me.
I’m as into this stuff as most of you, I can assure you, but then there are some of you who are just over the top that really need to step back, take a deep breath, and lighten up.
FIRST makes us all feel really good about ourselves the majority of the time, but that doesn’t make FIRST perfect!