Lathe tooling/accesories

Technical Technical Discussion
1

Hi y’all,

We’ve recently had a sponsor willing to purchase a lathe (and a decent one at that) for us. We’ll probably go with either: http://www.precisionmatthews.com/shop/pm-1127vf-lb/ (and purchase + install a DRO) or this preferred package + DRO installed: http://www.precisionmatthews.com/shop/pm-1236/ (we already have 220 available in the shop, so that’s why this is an option)

Either way, I haven’t purchased a lathe and have limited experience using one. While we have a mentor with extensive lathe experience and I have relied on him for input, I’d like to hear from a wide variety of input. What are some of the tooling y’all frequently use with your lathe?

I’ll definitely get the quick change set, turning tool, and I got some suggestions to get some boring bars and hopefully a tailstock drill chuck. What other things do you use in FIRST? Other threads I’ve checked mostly are about what lathe to get, not necessarily the tooling.

2

We purchased the same lathe and we love it. It came with the quick change toolpost and holders.

I would suggest that you buy tool holders and inserts from http://latheinserts.com/

Call Curtis and let him know what you are wanting to do. I think I learned about them from Cory from 254.

Aside from the standard tool holders and inserts I would get some cut off blades that you can cut grooves with for retaining rings/clips.

Here’s a good thread for reference:
https://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=130568&highlight=retaining+lathe

If you don’t have a good set of calipers and micrometers I would get them as well.

3

Which lathe did y’all get (PM-1236 or PM-1127?)

Great thread to link to - thanks!

4

We got the PM-1127. We did not purchase the DRO though.

5

We have the PM1440E-LB. I’d definitely say get your lathe with DRO already installed if you can. Saves headaches later. Use machines to make projects. Don’t let the machine be the project.

6

The PM-1236 says that it has a clutch feed stop, which can be very handy if you want to turn things repeatably and quickly. There are several times that I’ve wished for one on lathes I use, if for no other reason than to satisfy my OCD about facing shafts most of the way, flipping off the power feed, and manually turning up to a shoulder.
Definitely get a DRO. Pre-installed is a good option if you have the money, because some kits are very difficult to adapt to lathes.
That being said, most of the work in FRC is facing and parting axles, turning hex axles into rounds, and making short hubs. For snap ring grooves, Thinbit or Nikole Mini Systems are commonly used because they go down to very thin sizes, but grinding your own out of HSS blanks is not too hard.
A live center for the tailstock is a handy thing to own. Twice in the last week I’ve wished for a live center to support long workpieces.
I got a cheap, tiny boring bar from Ebay last month and it works quite well. Look up S07K boring bar, and make sure it comes with inserts. Boring is typically a rare option in FRC, so the inserts don’t need to be of great quality (the Ebay ones cut aluminum and plastic well) but when you do need a boring bar, a long skinny one is very advantageous. The S07K does down to 3/8" bores or maybe slightly smaller. They’re as low as $7 with inserts from China.

7

In FRC, 90 % of your lathe usage will be making custom hex shafts for the drive train and various game specific mechanisms.

We use a larger lathe with a BXA tool holder. The AXA is limited to 3/8 inch tooling.

Minimum Tooling.

Get decent replaceable insert tooling AR, AL, BR BL, & E. With extra inserts. I like to have one extra E with a radius tipped insert as well (finish turning).

A drill and tap set is essential (preferably in a Huot box).

Center Drill Counter sinks for initial hole location.

You will want to be able to make groves for eternal 1/2" E-Clips and C-clips. Get a grooving tool set or specific sized grooving tools.

Extra Cutoff Blades. (Use cutoff blade tool holder)

Get extra tool holders! These let you have your most common tooling already adjusted on center for quick change.

The Other Stuff:

Spring bottom oil can with cutting fluid.

Paint Brush for moving chips off surfaces.

Small brass tipped “oiler” for lubricating the ways and other oil nipples. Check you lathe manual, but generally some type of hydraulic fluid is used.

Emory paper roll, and scotch brite pads.

Small brush and pan for cleanup.

Measurement devices:
DRO or not…

Decent 1" Micrometer & 6 inch Calipers

My favorite lathe accessory is actually a cold saw. I can cut the raw hex stock very close to the final length with nice clean square cuts. Really cuts down the needed facing and sizing to length.

1 Like
8

I have the PM1127 in my home shop and have enjoyed it. Got it when all I had was a smaller shed (150sq ft). That being said, I’ve used the Grizzly equivalent of the PM1236, and you do feel the extra weight and power… and if I would do it all over again I’d get that. Might still upgrade one day and sell/donate the smaller lathe.

Quick change tool post is a really nice thing to have (must have for me). Otherwise, a set of carbide (cheap set with left/right/angled) is a good way to start, but hand ground HSS blanks can be a great thing to learn, make really good cuts, and let you make custom tooling. We’ve made/used this for snap ring grooves, making pulleys for polycord, etc. Also, need to get a cutoff tool.

Tailstock drill is a must have of course. Just get the appropriate taper for your machine. I’d also recommend just getting a drill index for the machine as well and making sure they don’t walk away for general use. A center drill set is good to have as well.

Something like a ~6-8" boring isn’t a bad thing to have around, but I haven’t had to use mine for FRC purposes yet.

9

You can make almost anything with a good turning tool and a good cut off tool

Those are top priority. We use ISCAR at the shop I work at, but that’s high end stuff.

If you have a mill, you will probably have Drills/Center drills.

Readout is a bunch of help but not a need.

In order I’d say:

  1. Cutoff
  2. Turning tool (Get an insertable one, it’s so much nicer)
  3. Boring bar

You should be good. If you have the budget, get nice ones, if not, SHARS would be just fine.

This is all assuming you have some tool holders for this stuff

10

I have used the lathe you listed in your second link, it is a very nice machine. Defiantly invest in a DRO it will save you a lot of time and wasted material.

I will cast my vote for HSS tooling, it take some time to learn how to grind the bits and lap them properly, however it leaves a superior finish on aluminum IMHO. That being said inserts may be the safer route if there are a lot of different users on the machine with varying degrees of skill. $.05 one way a nickel the other I suppose.

I would also recommend more or less in order (similar to what InFlight said):

  • A proper cut-off blade and holder. I know cut-offs can be difficult to use, but they make working on parts out of the same piece of material a breeze, and it is almost essential for making custom thickness washers.
  • Center drill and a good set of twist drills (stub sized twist drills are also a nice addition for your common tap drill sizes).
  • A good midrange 1" Micrometer and pair of 6" calipers.
  • A lathe safe bastard file (EDIT: and handle, thanks Cory, stabbing yourself is known to be hazardous to your health). This is a great option for non-critical small chamfer operations and to break edges with minimal risk of damage to the work.
  • A cheap indicator with magnetic base. This does not have to be fancy, but try to get something with 0.001" resolution.
  • Emery cloth is also a good buy for finishing.
  • A cheap 2-4" paint brush and dustpan for cleaning up chips.
  • Way oil/ other lubricants for the machine.
  • A decent sized rag for covering the ways while working w/ abrasives.
  • Cutting fluid - WD40 works okay on aluminum, but a cheap light cutting oil will give you better results.
  • A tap/die size chart for the wall. You can print one off from the web. This is a great reference as it has decimal equivalents of imperial fractions, taps drill sizes for a variety of materials, etc. all without having someone take out their phone while at the machine. ::safety::
  • Some brass or aluminum .005" shim stock for preventing the jaws from marring your work.

I am by no means an expert, but the above is what I have found useful on my projects.
-Skye

11

For those who don’t understand what a lathe safe file is, this is not all you need. you need a handle with a rounded end so that you don’t end up puncturing your palm/wrist with the pointy end of that file.

12

I prefer a smaller 6 inch very fine file with a wood handle than the larger files. The small one is easier to keep handy in your apron. Aluminum fills the file groves pretty quickly; so a small metal brush to clean it out is the files “partner.”

We use 10-24 fasteners as our default, so I just keep a few 25 bits handy for the to be tapped ends. I’ve used some other odd small sizes for gearbox parts, and the occasional 1/4-20. But 95% of lathe drilling is for our default fastener.

Oatey Dark cutting fluid is available at all the big box hardware stores. It’s normally in the plumbing section. Much better than WD-40. You can pickup a quart bottle for under $7, enough for a couple years. I use it in a spring bottom oiler, perfect for adding a controlled amount to drill bits or in holes.

13

Why? Arguably, 10-24 is one of the worst thread sizes. It is one of the most frequently broken taps due to the ratio of pitch to minor diameter. Also, many fasteners in FRC, such as those used to mount CIM motors are 10-32. Why not standardize on 10-32?

14

We also use 10-24 by default. Since we use primarily aluminum, the deeper thread form reduces the chance of stripping the threads. Machinery’s Handbook recommends coarse thread for ductile materials. The CIM motor is threaded deeper than most material thicknesses we use so has more thread form to reduce stripping. I usually break the 8 and 6 taps. One of my toolmaker friends says he usually breaks the 1/4-20s.