I’ve been looking at the limelight 2+ and noticed it seems to be out of stock on WCP, AM, and Limelight. Any information on when the stocks will be available?
I think you meant : https://limelightvision.io/
Yea we’ve been waiting as well.
Their email form for when they go back in stock is also down.
I wouldn’t count on a restock for this season unless someone comes across an unopened pallet of CM3s in their warehouse or something.
I think it also will be available at Andymark at the same time. Maybe their mail form will be helpful.
I recall in the past that there might be a rule that prohibits COTs items that are not readily available (in a timely fashion for all teams)? Would this unavailability of the LimeLight during the 2022 season ultimately make it against the rules for teams to reuse an old (on hand) LimeLight? Should we all start taking steps for this possibility? Or will this be similar to the Falcon Motor situation in 2020?
Does that also apply to the RoboRIO then?
I’m fully expecting the manual to explicitly state that both the RoboRIO and RoboRIO 2.0 will be legal for use this year. Similar to how both the 4 slot and 8 slot cRIO was called out as legal in past manuals.
This being said, the sentiment to your question is a very valid one I’d say. To this same logic, would a raspberry pi 1 model B be illegal to use because it is no longer in production? Can I not use any v1 1/2" hex bearings from VEX because they aren’t available any more? I doubt any robot inspector would deem these illegal, but then again, I am neither FIRST nor an RI.
Considering that something like the limelight has not been explicitly discontinued, but rather is drastically effected by the global chip shortage, it would be nice to see FIRST make an announcement about the legality of these items for this year. Not specifically on the limelight per se, but more on what the COTS definition/rule will look like in general. Haven’t a clue what I’d want that rule to look like though. I’ll leave that to the pro’s I guess.
Seems like the rules are running into the reality of global shortages.
Global shortages stink.
I looked over it a little, and I don’t think it will. The way I see it based on the definitions laid out in section 9.1 (INFINITE RECHARGE), the only thing that would be threatened would be if Limelight (the company) still counted as a VENDOR, but that wouldn’t matter, since you can buy them from AM and WCP, which are definitely still both VENDORs. Either way, I very much doubt there’s going to be an issue - especially since the manual doesn’t imply a COTS product can become a FABRICATED ITEM through the VENDOR no longer counting as a VENDOR.
If copious amounts of top teams start selling their Limelight 2+ and it’s out of stock, we all know what that means…
According to the 2020 rules (last normal season) I would view AM, etc as resellers since Limelight for FRC is the sole source for Limelight. Short of Limelight favoring or being controlled by a specific team(s) I think they meet the definition of vendor. The first generation limelights are “obsolete” so are definitely legal by rule. The company could “obsolete” the +2s and go to a +2.1 or whatever making the 2n gen legal by rule. I don’t really think that is necessary because the current situation is probably beyond Limelight’s control. Much like the falcons where when they were introduced and likely is going to be an issue for the RobRio2s (wild speculation on my part)
The usual disclaimer: I have no control over whet the GDC decides.
Our team bought a LL 2+ in Jan 2020 as a hedge just in case our students couldn’t get our home-grown vision working.
It’s New In Box, never been plugged in.
So I thought “well, let’s offer it for sale”. We checked the expense reports and that’s where the quandary is.
It would appear that retail price is $399.99 USD. We bought it from Studica Canada and our invoice says $687.60 CAD plus GST ($688.65 CAD). One of our mentors wanted to do a cost recovery on it. I said I thought the limit for any part on a robot was $499.99USD. So the other mentor suggested that that would be a fine price then. Except that it’s higher than retail.
- yes, it sucks being a non-US based team sometimes.
- What is the general sentiment regarding selling our LL 2+ for less than we paid but more than ‘Retail’?
Since you are not a vendor, what you sell it for has no relation to the “BOM” cost. So as long it is available from a Vendor for less the allowed amount, it is legal. Shipping, customs, taxes do not count into that calculation.
I wouldn’t know about stock, but Limelight does have STL and IMG downloads. You might be able to make your own and still have it interface with the Limelight Finder Tool, but you would still need to get your own lights and camera.
@hpeyerl, did your team do something like this for your home-grown vision, or did you do something else?
We use OpenMV cameras connected to an onboard Pi via USB serial. The Pi publishes results to Network Tables. The Pi does other stuff too.
We have a custom carrier board for the OpenMV that has a regulator, super-bright green LED’s, and drivers for the LEDs.
If you’re going to do that, you might as well look into building your own Gloworm board instead of trying to hack together something that works with Limelight’s software. The problem there is you still need a Pi CM3(+?) like the manufacturers of both devices do.
I have used both chameleon vision and photon vision before. However, we always had problems with raspberrypi connecting to the network. It was connecting randomly so that we had to restart the pi at least 3-4 times before the matches.