Making STEM a better place for women

FIRST General Forum
1

People of ChiefDelphi,

On one of the teams I have mentored, I watched one of my (female) students get sufficiently creeped out by a (male) student’s behavior towards her that she was physically hiding from him at the competition.

I’ve seen similar behavior at the college level with a handful of close friends.

I would assert that this is a major barrier to women looking to enter some (many?) STEM fields. I’m sure this is nothing new to some folks, and I’d been mulling around the issue for quite some time, but this is the first time I’ve considered it in the context of FIRST.

Students or mentors, would you agree/disagree with the assertion that this is widespread?

Mentors, have you seen any untoward behavior/unwanted advances on your teams/between students from multiple teams? Have you addressed it, and if so, how?

I’m pondering what I can do as a mentor to make the world a better place. I do believe that if indeed this is a larger issue, I should be doing my best to make the field less hostile towards women. But how to do that? That’s a harder question.

Thoughts? I’m not expecting any quick solution/magic bullets, but a discussion can’t hurt.
Jacob

2

I have female students on teams that I have worked with that had some just plain creepy or akward situations happen to them. I’ve dealt with it by letting the mentors of the student know what went on and they dealt with it internally. Most of the girls who were on the receiving end through conversation told me this sort of thing isn’t rare.

Another thing I’m beginning to learn is that sexism is a problem among male students in FRC.

I agree that this can be a problem. How to deal with it if it happens with a student on your team is something I don’t have the best answer for.

3

Being a mentor for a FIRST team goes far beyond simply being there as a technical resource.

To expand on what being a mentor means to me, I’m going to start with some background. Everything I know about leadership, mentoring, and instruction came from my time in the United States Marine Corps. Not really known from the outside, but the Corps has a rather intensive Mentorship program where senior Marines take juniors under their wing, and provide both professional and personal mentoring.

The programs seeks, specifically, to

Now, we’re not mentoring Marines here, we’re mentoring High School students. A good amount of “toning down” is required, as well as a less… intensive personal involvement. However, I personally believe being a mentor involves knowing when to counsel a student about more than just the good. Sometimes the best thing for a student is to not be instructed, but corrected.

If I’m going to mentor someone, I’m going to be involved in their life as a positive force. Note the terminology here: a positive FORCE. There’s acceptable professional behavior, and there’s unacceptable. Being confident and assertive enough to pull a student to the side and expand on the negative effects of their actions isn’t an easy thing, but the effects are amazing to watch.

To refer to your specific case, pulling the (male) student aside, and having a talk about how his actions are perceived can do him a lot of good, as well as remove the negative situation for the female student. The exact phrasing here is something you’ve got to CAREFULLY consider. Crushing the student’s expression of affection isn’t the goal. The goal is to explain that another person isn’t perceiving their affection the same way, as well as to put into context the professional manner in which the student SHOULD act.

In summary, sometimes telling someone they’re not acting right is what needs to be done. It’s not a natural feeling, but it gets easier over time.

4

Seen guys creep out their female teammates both as a student and observed it as a mentor. I think the hardest part of addressing the issue is this: should we be proactive and ask female students if another student is making them uncomfortable, or, should we be reactive and wait for students to come to us with these issues.

What I personally have seen is that some girls are sometimes hesitant to talk to someone about this, especially if all mentors are male. I have always tried to be as open as possible to my students about these types of situations, and so far it has worked well for the students i have helped, but I think the hesitation will still be there if all mentors aren’t working towards making their students feel comfortable in all situations.

In college, the women in engineering classes are notoriously hounded because there are fewer of them already, so it probably makes the entire cycle worse.

I don’t think a solution exists unless you proactively discuss this type of stuff with your entire team and their parents before each season.

I hope there aren’t many examples of such behavior. :frowning:

5

This could a perfect opportunity to teach Male students proper gracious professional etiquette and the overall idea of it, and how it extends out to greater life outside of FIRST.

6

One possible solution would be to have mentors sit in areas where a female student could potentially be bothered by male student[s].

Example:
There is a group of male students sitting around a female student. If there is a mentor sitting with them, they will be less encouraged to do anything wierd.

Besides that, maybe try calling out the offenders? From experience (not with this issue) getting called out is so embarrassing that you will not do whatever it was again out of fear of getting called out again.

7

While it is a short term deterrent, this doesn’t teach the student right from wrong.

8

Completely agree, it would be a better approach to:

Frankly, I think it’s a discussion to have with the offending student to make him (or her) more aware of his/her actions.

Some of the things I do on my team:

  • Encourage a student who wants to do something, no matter what it is (if it’s reasonable)
  • Ensure equitable opportunity (technical students have to do non-technical things, and non-technical students do technical things - sometimes I have to push this)
  • No activities that leave out any students (team wanted to do a lock-in in school but we can’t do co-ed lock-in)
  • Be aware of students activities beyond the team (I’m generally aware of schoolwork/grades, other extracurriculars)
  • Like Akash mentioned: a genuine open door policy
  • Listen to any student that wants to talk, and sometimes it’s just listening
  • And personally, I remind myself “You’re a role model everything you do students will remember”.

I think my views are really well summed up by Mechvet:

If I’m going to mentor someone, I’m going to be involved in their life as a positive force.

9

As a female mentor and engineering student, I can affirm these are definitely issues for women in STEM, along with many other issues.

The suggestions I see on here are great. But there is one recommendation I would add: teams need to seek out female mentors! There are interactions that female mentors are more likely to pick up on and they provide some insight into these issues. Female mentors also set role models for their female students and give male students another opportunity to interact with females in an engineering role before they are in college or the workplace.

And I would say also to keep conversations focused robotics as much as possible to prevent both parties from focusing on appearance (whatever they choose to talk about at lunch is different, but not while the team works). And make sure female members are just as willing to get in there and work on the robot, they can pick up a drill for themselves and don’t need someone to load the drill bit in for them, etc.

10

The few female mentors I’ve worked side-by-side with have been some of the best, but they are very hard to find. Not just technical mentors, but mentors in general. I also have a general problem recruiting mentors, but I’d be interested in hearing any advice for recruiting female mentors.

And I would say also to keep conversations focused robotics as much as possible to prevent both parties from focusing on appearance

I actually slightly disagree with this. I think moving the topic festers the behavior or issue, especially because if they don’t act that way in front of you

(whatever they choose to talk about at lunch is different

I equate this sometimes to tool safety. I’d rather the student do something unsafe in front of me, so I can help them understand the need for safety, then do it when I’m turned away. I think this applies to behavior as well.

11

A few additions to make here -

While some of these problems take place in regards to girls while they are within their own team, I find that there are many more issues to deal with at competitions. This is especially true of student to student interaction among teams.

First, I have had to instruct my students in a couple of important notes:

#1: Never give a student’s cell-phone number or contact information to another student. While I cannot keep students from exchanging information with each other, I have found some of my male students giving information about one of my female students when requested from an interested person on another team.

#2: Carefully monitor hotel interactions. While I would like to believe that the standards of every team is the same, there are some that have no problem with students from either gender congregating in hotel rooms and the like. While I do not mind hallway interactions, I am always concerned when a female OR male student finds their way into the room of another team.

#3: This is perhaps the most sensitive but most important: Just because someone is a mentor/parent/adult, it does not mean they are safe. Recently, I had a student approach me expressing concern over an adult who seemed to be tracking them in the stands. The adult would consistently stare and it made the student uncomfortable. I did not hear about it until after a situation where the adult exited the stands right behind the student and followed them down the stands closely. When the student turned, he attempted to start a conversation.

We have to remember that beyond simple student to student interactions in our teams we also need to teach our students to understand that the perception of safety is not always true. It’s unfortunate but because we host events that are open to the public there will always be situations that can arise. What I generally tell my students is the following:

A) Always stick together - This is not always possible but as much as they can I like students to have at least one person with them at all times. This is especially true if they are going to be outside of the arena and sometimes even if they are going to the restroom.

B) Trust your instincts - If someone is making you uncomfortable, distance yourself from them and tell one of your mentors. While a mentor may not be able to directly deal with someone who is making a student feel uncomfortable, they can be made more aware of the situation and help mitigate in whatever way possible.

C) Always Inform - If something happens, whether it be an altercation with a student or an adult, never be afraid to tell a mentor. We always have both male and female mentors or parent volunteers available at each competition. If someone does something that you feel is inappropriate, you should never feel embarrassed to let us know.

D) And lastly - Embarrassment can save your life. This is perhaps the most difficult yet the most effective form of safety. If someone will not leave you alone, get loud and do whatever you can to get out of the situation. It doesn’t matter if you are wrong or right because trusting your instincts is always better than not. What I told the person who was dealing with the adult in the stands was that next time they needed to step aside and allow the person to go ahead of them. If that did not work they needed to look at the person and in a firm and loud voice they needed to say “You are making me uncomfortable, please leave me alone.”

Generally this will deter anyone who is being overly creepy - especially as many people don’t even recognize they are doing it. If not, or if they try to hold a conversation, repeat the phrase but louder. At some point, someone else will notice and should help. As a last result - you yell. Yes, it may be embarrassing to you, but it will also call attention to what is going on.

The truth is that making STEM a better place for women goes far beyond what happens in the interactions between our own students. As mentors, we have to take a proactive stance to guard and protect both our young men and women at home and at competitions. Of course there are a myriad of other things that we need to tackle here to truly help women feel supported in their role as a STEM leader but safety is first and foremost and security is often taught not just assumed.

12

As a mentor and father to a teen daughter (and the mentor who inevitably ends up with 5 or 6 females riding with me to events) I have a slightly different perspective. The interaction between the girls and the guys on our team really doesn’t seem to have anything to do with STEM persay.

Part of it is certainly developing a thick skin, but that goes both ways. The girls I have seen who do well in Stem (albeit my experience is limited in this area because I am a solo programmer by trade) all do so because they don’t see themselves as needing different or preferential treatment. They seem themselves as programmers, engineers, etc. Their gender doesn’t really play a role. If a guy gives them a hard time then they give them a hard time back. If the guy is a creep then you tell them off or you report them.

When we have a male (or female for that matter) student behaving inappropriately we just tell them to calm down, relax, and if need be the mentors will pull them aside and have a talk with them.

My daughter I am sure would have a better handle on this, she started her freshman year knowing nothing about robotics and now 4 years later she was a Deans List Finalist, President of the Team, Drive Captain, President of the Student Council and Leader of the Programmers on our team. (I could go on but needless to say I am proud of her).

I am also pretty proud of all the girls on our team, they aren’t bullied by the guys on the team and in roles of leadership throughout. Not a single one was given their role without deserving it.

13

  1. Having a team-member handbook with clear guidelines on treating mentors, students and event staff members with respect and appreciation will help tremendously.

  2. If someone is spotted violating team rules, meet with with them privately and point out their behavior. Also, discuss the negative impact on the team, on the members and the on person themselves; and be ready with consequences if it happens again.

  3. Keep a journal so that offenses and consequences are recorded. If a person has a second offense, assign some sort of clean-up task and write a note to their parents (or in their file if a mentor). A third offense would warrant some kind of time away from the team or missing a tournament.

  4. Handle all this with love and professionalism. It’s a growth opportunity for young adults, and do NOT ignore the bad behavior.

  5. Be aware of the tendency to steer young ladies to the non-engineering roles like team spirit, communication, etc. Encourage females (or any team member) to try out roles that will help them develop skills they may not realize they have!

Random tips:
-Have fun, reward good behavior, privately address bad behavior.
-Develop a team Vision
-Have a meeting with Mentors BEFORE the season starts to discuss your team goals. What are the attributes of an amazing team, and how can we get that here? Have that same discussion with students.

14

One quick tip for recruiting female mentors: Don’t recruit female mentors, recruit mentors.

“We want you to mentor our team because we want a lady mentor/positive female role model” is way less inviting than “We want you to mentor our team because of your X, Y, and Z skills.” The former makes me valuable only because of my gender (something I have no control over) and the latter makes me valuable for the set of skills and knowledge I have worked to acquire and improve upon.

I’m not saying you can’t ask women to be mentors or recruit them more heavily. I am saying that you should find value in your female mentors beyond their gender.

15

The problem with recruiting female engineers really comes down to numbers. According to some statistics I’ve heard before, only 13% of engineers are female, and the percentage can be worse when you look at specific engineering fields.

My experience at companies I’ve worked for shows that very few people want to dedicate the time and energy to mentor a team. Maybe 1/1000 people. Now, that’s fine when you look at trying to recruit someone (non gender specific) to mentor your team, as there are a lot of comeanies out there, and hundreds of thousands of engineers you could draw from. When you start applying filters to your recruitment criteria (must be female, or must be a specific type of engineer, etc), your pool of potential recruits rapidly decreases, and your left looking for a specific needle in a haystack full of needles that aren’t quite right.

My team doesn’t actively recruit female mentors, despite being an all girls team from an all girls school. We recruit mentors, and those mentors ensure there’s a gender-neutral attitude in everything we do. the female mentors we have fall into three categories: parents, teachers, and returning former students. It just happened to work out that way.

For those female student here, I want to ask - which is more important to you, having a female mentor to look up to, or having your mentor (regardless of gender) show confidence, support, and respect for you? At the end of the day, that’s all us poor males can really do to help you grow!

16

As far as internal team dynamics, we do a few things to address these types of problems.

1st, we have a team handbook that outlines specific behaviors that are wholly not acceptable. This is emphasized throughout the year.

2nd, we have occasional girl and boy meetings, specifically to discuss issues and situations that have happened and may arise and how to handle them. My students know both what is expected of them and what to do if they are put into an uncomfortable situation both within and outside the team. For the boy meeting, I highlight that it’s not just their own behavior they should be concerned about, but others too. Watch out for your teammates and help them out in whatever situations they are in. I have never been part of the girl meeting (no guys allowed), so I only know what I’ve been told about what gets discussed, but it’s important to know that your team has your back.

3rd, I insert myself into situations at events where I notice guys creeping on my female students. I introduce myself in a friendly, yet forceful, manner as their mentor and ask if there’s anything I can do to help them out. The creeps tend to get very uncomfortable and leave quickly when they’ve been caught. Hyper-vigilance is unfortunately necessary at times.

17

To me this is a social interaction.
There are plenty of ways to creep people out in a social setting regardless of gender.

If it gets to the point that someone feels uncomfortable they should feel safe enough to come forward and to report the issue. The person that is causing the issue should feel safe enough to tell their side and have a learning moment.

People do awkward things and sometimes they do so mindlessly.
We can overreact or we can manage that.
If these situations fail to be managed - then you make sure they can’t escalate.

18

Lets keep in mind that this is natural.

There are quite a few socially awkward male and females in robotics so these situations can get worse. And, the lack of females with the interest can extenuate the situation but regardless this is life.

I am not advocating for creepy behavior but normal flirting and tries at a relationship with other members or members from other teams are to be expected.

We all are high school students after all.

19

I think I get what you meant with this statement, but if that ‘normal flirting’ makes a student on my team uncomfortable, the offending student needs to be checked up on, not approached with the attitude of ‘oh well, this is life’.

If it’s an issue of alienating a teammate, male or female, with creepy behavior, then the issue has to be dealt with.

You’re hovering right around a ‘boys will be boys’ (I guess in this case, ‘nerds will be nerds’) mentality with this post - I hope you can clarify what you’re actually trying to say.

20

The number one reason I still do what I do is because I want to provide as many students as possible with an equal or preferably better experience in FIRST than my own. I assume and hope that is the case for a lot of other alumni mentors.

When students do not feel like they feel safe or comfortable in a given environment, I take that very seriously and try to use the available channels to rectify that situation.

It is really really s****y that I have to go to female student members on my team and walk them through best practices for dealing with unsolicited actions and unacceptable behavior from other people at competitions… but what am I supposed to do? Telling them and their parents “kids will be kids” and “boys will be boys” is an unacceptable response.

I try to be proactive as possible when considering these scenarios but there is no more painful failure as a coach than having students who have been negatively affected by outside people so much that they cannot perform their duties and experience the benefits of FRC’s competitive environments.

Team members sign a code of conduct and are reminded repeatedly throughout the season pretty bluntly to not be a creep or a jerk lest they be disappeared from the team if remedial action proves fruitless. FIRST and STEM does need a culture change to fix this really serious problem.

When a student comes to me and expresses relief that some guy that creeped her out at events will be going to a different college than her, that forms a really weird bittersweet reactionary thought in my head–a thought quickly replaced by the unfortunate and well-supported fear in the back of my head that her desire to pursue a degree in engineering means this will not be the last time she has to deal with this.