What is the rpm and torque for all of this year’s motors. Thank you.
You need to download and read “The Robot.pdf” off of the FRC Documents page. It isn’t as good as last year, but the basic information is still there, under “Kit of Parts”.
I see it for the new Bosch and for the Fisher Price, but the others don’t have any technical data.
Does anyone have the URL’s for last year’s appendix with the specs on the www2.usfirst.org site? they took the links off the main site. This has the specs for the other motors. I have a copy of the file at work but not at home. Now that i have broadband I’ll download it here.
OK, I found a hard copy from 2000 - The motors don’t look quite the same but similar enough. Since I haven’t seen anybody else posting specs, here’s what I’ve got and it will at least get you started until we see the right ones:
Window Motor (ITT Automotive): 20 Amps Stall Current, 6 Nm @ 41 RPM, 1.8 N.M @ 64 RPM
Van Door Motor (Tiagene): 75 RPM No Load Speed, Stall Torque 37 Nm Clockwise, 34 Nm Counter-Clockwise, Stall Current 40 Amps.
Globe Motor (with Drive Assembly), at 10 Vdc: No Load Speed 87 RPM, Stall Torque 150 In-Lb, Stall current 18.5 Amps, No Load Current .82 Amps.
Globe Motor (Motor Only), at 10 Vdc: No Load Speed 97RPM, Stall Torque 30 Oz-In, Stall current 18.5 Amps, No Load Current .82 Amps.
*Originally posted by Gary Dillard *
**I see it for the new Bosch and for the Fisher Price, but the others don’t have any technical data.Does anyone have the URL’s for last year’s appendix with the specs on the www2.usfirst.org site? they took the links off the main site. This has the specs for the other motors. I have a copy of the file at work but not at home. Now that i have broadband I’ll download it here. **
Gary,
If you still need anything from last year, I just got done archiving it here: http://www.cvhsrobotics.org/resources.htm. You’ll find the 2002 documentation toward the bottom of the page.
-Kevin
For motor specs from last year’s motors and the van door motor, they may be found at www.team696.org/motorspecs.html There is also a link to download the Joe Johnson motor comparison spreadsheet.
*Originally posted by sanddrag *
**For motor specs from last year’s motors and the van door motor, they may be found at www.team696.org/motorspecs.html There is also a link to download the Joe Johnson motor comparison spreadsheet. **
PLEASE NOTE:
the drill motors ARE different this year - do not do calculations using the drill motors on these specs…
Tom
Thanks for the links. Still, the motors look different than last year’s, and the manufacturers are listed as different (Nippon-Denso vs Valco for the window and Bosch vs Taigene for the Van door), so as soon as someone gets the official specs please post. These should be adequate for now.
Did anyone else notice a discrepency in the information on the new Bosch with gearbox?
On page 5, the robot manual describes the output of the bosch with gear box as 0-450 or 0-1500, but if you take the 19670 no load RPM with the ratios of 12.07:1 or 42.62:1, you get (approximiately) 461.5 or 1630 RPM.
I believe their numbers, but that means that the efficiencies for these gearboxes are pretty darn good.
After doing some calculations, I get these efficiencies:
Gearbox in High: 92%
Gearbox in Low: 97.5%
The “old” gearboxes had these efficiencies:
Old Gearbox in High: 80%
Old Gearbox in Low: 70%
… so…
With a larger motor, more efficient gearboxes, and a bigger circuit breakers (40A compared to 30A), these drill motors may be close to double the power compared to last year’s Bosch motor/gearbox combination. Holy torque, Batman!
Andy B.
This is important… to choose the right motors for the right jobs, and to figure out gearings and such we need to know motor specs. Preferably stall torque, free RPM, torque vs RPM curve.
Specifically the new drill motors vs “chalupa” (if thats how you spell it). Which has more torque, what are they RPM’s? Which is better to use for drive train, what are the RPM-torque curves?
ACK 
Greg
The Chiaphua is the same motor as last year with a different shaft. It was made specifically for FIRST and is the same model number with an “FR” in front of it. See the link below for the Chiaphua spreadsheet, but disregard the pinion information.
The new drill motor has more power than the Chiaphua (see some specs below), but both are very good candidates for a drive motor.
Bosch drill motor specs (@12V):
Stall Torque = 0.87 N-m
Stall Amps = 127
Free Speed = 19670 RPM
THe above is preliminary info, but I should be getting confirmation from Bosch tomorrow.
-Paul
chiaphua motor specs.zip (31.4 KB)
chiaphua motor specs.zip (31.4 KB)
If this is correct, the drill motors are still less powerful then the atwood “chaiupas” (i will never spell that correctly)? By my conversions, the chaiupas stall at about twice the torque as the new drill motors (though both at 100+ amps, ACK!).
Someone check me, stupid english/metric.
Greg
The Drill motors have much more power: .87 N*M/2 * 19670RPM/2 2PI/60 = 450 Watts
Chiaphua power = 500RPM/2 2.2 Nm/22PI/60 = 317 Watts
Hope this clears it up. In other words, if you gear the drill to the same output free speed of the Chiaphua, the drill will have more torque.
-Paul
but the chiaphua is bigger! that means it MUST be better?!
heh, go small but powerful. If only we could replace out chiaphuas with more bosch drill motors.
Anyone want to trade (just kidding, i read the rules)
Are you sure about this? The motors aren’t turning when they are stalled, so you cant use RPM and stall torque together…?
Greg
*Originally posted by Gary Dillard *
**Thanks for the links. Still, the motors look different than last year’s, and the manufacturers are listed as different (Nippon-Denso vs Valco for the window and Bosch vs Taigene for the Van door), so as soon as someone gets the official specs please post. These should be adequate for now. **
If you check today’s team update, it has something about reusing motors, so I take it as the motors you are allowed to reuse are essentially the same, while the motors you can’t reuse are different.
You CAN reuse the Chalupa/Atwoods and Globes, so I’m guessing they’re the same.
You CANNOT reuse the Fisher-Price, drill-motors and window motors, so I’m guessing that means they’re different
Im going to have to agree with those that think the Chips are more powerful. My reasoning does have to do with the size of the motor, but of the windings. Since the Chip is bigger it MOST likely has a larger gauge wire for the windings and can draw more power without heating up as much and is less likely to blow the breakers. And even if the chip doesn’t have larger gauge I’m pretty sure the its has more windings and probably more sections (I know theres a more technical term im trying to say the amount of coils on the armature itself) If someone is willing to take one apart to see whats really in there that would be great. I don’t think my team would appreciate me taking it apart since i will most likly not be able to get it back together.
*Originally posted by Jim Giacchi *
**Im going to have to agree with those that think the Chips are more powerful. My reasoning does have to do with the size of the motor, but of the windings. Since the Chip is bigger it MOST likely has a larger gauge wire for the windings and can draw more power without heating up as much and is less likely to blow the breakers. And even if the chip doesn’t have larger gauge I’m pretty sure the its has more windings and probably more sections (I know theres a more technical term im trying to say the amount of coils on the armature itself) If someone is willing to take one apart to see whats really in there that would be great. I don’t think my team would appreciate me taking it apart since i will most likly not be able to get it back together. **
The number of turns is how many times the wire goes around the armature. Less turns means more power/rpm. The winding is the number of strands in the wrap. Usually between one and four. More strands will give you more torque at a higher RPM, less strands will give you more torque at a lower rpm for more “punch” As for why things work ou this way, I really don’t know. This is just what an expert in the industry told me.
Running the numbers on the two through the Motor Calc spreadsheet from last year and using the drill specs found in this post:
I get a peak power of ~450W for the drills and ~300W for the Chiapuas.
Stall torque at our proposed gear ratios is 106N-m vs 80N-m
It is RIDICULOUS that we don’t have spec sheets!!:ahh: