Not to Be a Total Stick in the Mud

FIRST General Forum
#21

Regarding the cart issue, in 2010, we didn’t have one. We had poles that we put trough dedicated holes in the robot to carry it everywhere. I was on the drive team, so I was carrying it very often. Even at ~90 lbs IIRC it was a pain and began to hurt my hands. Luckily, we had a short walk from the field to the pits, but at Hatboro this weekend, the walk was relatively substantial as we had to go to a separate gymnasium and the door was at the opposite corner of our pit.

Carts are extremely helpful and a requirement might not be a bad idea.

#22

Depends. I’ve tried some on, and visibility varies greatly from not being able to see at all to being able to see with very “gritty” but slightly tinted vision. I would entirely argue that they don’t belong in the pits, safety glasses or not. That being said, if the hood/face is down (most, if not all, have zippers in the back starting at the head, I don’t see a major issue as long as they have safety glasses.

#23

maybe FIRST can provide flat carts for teams with hardship to use at regionals.

#24

I agree with all that is being said here and just want to add one thing. I witnessed a UL Safety Adviser ask 2 visitors to put safety glasses on when they were entering the pits and they got very upset and walked out. I know most teams do this already but a quick reminder to all parents and visitors will help keep the pits just a bit safer and the volunteers a bit less stressed.

#25

The extra cart idea is a great one for those of us with space in a trailer or box truck going to an event. Even a movers dolly would be a benefit to someone.

#26

Honestly, I have never seen these issues happen at a Michigan event (except people not getting out of the way for “ROBOT!”). Might be due to experience, but we all have carts, people never go beyond the blue curtains when they aren’t supposed to (we don’t even really bother with the drivers’ passes anymore) and people were smart enough not to play around on the field or practice field bridges.

#27

Speaking from personal experience, this can, in fact, win you a GP award. Back in 2007, my team then, 114, built one of the rookies at the PNW regional a robot cart out of castors and a piece of plywood. Not sure how the judges heard about it, but we won the J&J Sportsmanship Award.

In summary: Do good.

-Mike

#28

They were volunteers from a team and a team that won they event. they always are on the field after the event. We just have to make sure they don’t play on the bridge. That’s all.

#29

What is a good number of students to bring into the pits? We are wanting to cap it to 13.

#30

I work the field not the pits so I’m no expert on the subject by no means but I do know having whole teams down in the pits is unnecessary. Talk to Jeff Huspen about what a good number is. He’s been at this since 1993. Everyone should seek his advice on such matters.

#31

Our drive team is normally able to fix most of the problems on the robot, so I only keep 2-3 other students around to be in charge of organizing the pit, charging batteries, fixing things, and talking to the judges. Others are allowed to stop by but they shouldn’t stay for very long; they have other jobs already that are best handled out of the pits like scouting, spirit and helping other teams. We bring enough stuff that having 13 people and the robot in the pit would be close to impossible with out pushing out into the aisle.

#32

13 people in the pits is too many. We Use 2 mechanical, 1 electrical and 1 programming in the pit crew. We will also allow 1 or 2 students to temporarily work in the pits to spread pout the experience. Add 2 mentors and the pit still gets too crowded.

Our drive team is not part of the pit crew and do not work on the robot. The scout team will spend time in the pits but not hanging around our pit.

We will also have other students from our team helping other teams in the pits

#33

Last year we had no cart but we did have a solution: four U bolts attached to the corners of the robot. We had four strong people carry the robot this way. It helped that our robot only weighed in the 90s before battery+bumpers.

We are making a cart for our 120-lb robot but keeping the U-bolts to get it on and off the field.

#34

13 is way too many. Sometimes we’ll have 8, and that’s a lot. Usually it’s it’s maybe 4 students and 1-3 mentors working at a time. Programmers and Drive Team stay close (in districts, really close because there’s no time to go anywhere) and work on the bot directly when they need to or code/strategize when they can. Mentors and scouts come down for consults and practice field time as well as when we go to the field (to ensure there are people there to talk to judges and other teams).

Remember pits are at best 10x10’ with a 30x40" robot in the middle and usually a 2.5’? table at the back, plus whatever else you bring. With our shelf and rolling toolbox, 13 people wouldn’t have room to move. We get there occasionally, but clearing the pit is a delicate art.

#35

In my now 9 years of being on a drive team and moving robots to the field, the most effective way to clear a path is the following:

Send one drive team member ahead of the robot, not pulling it, an independent person. This person walks ahead of the robot, and politely asks anyone who may be in the way to please move out of the way momentarily for the robot to pass by. If they are facing away from the robot, a gentle tap on the shoulder followed by the same explanation does wonders.

Our team hasn’t yelled robot in the 7 years I have been on it, and we don’t need to. We move through the pits just fine without creating extra noise pollution. Teams should try it, you will be surprised how much easier it is to move to and from your pit.

-Brando

#36

This is SO effective! We migrated to this from yelling over the past few years, and it works so much better.

#37

how many people can you fit inside your 10x10 pit, with a robot, table, and tools, and still be able to work safely? The pit can get badly crowded, and I’ve never seen a team able to fit 13 people around 1 robot at the same time! If you have people who are sitting there doing nothing, send them into the stands. If you have so many people you’re overflowing into the isle, send some into the stands.

Then again, if you have enough people to do all your scouting, compose the drive team, make repairs to the root and still have some left over… send them around to help out struggling teams! Have them go talk with the Rookies and see if they need help or fill them in on how the competition goes. Help those rookies with scouting so they know how to do it. Help them get to a point where they can pass inspection.

We have the drive team (4 people) whenever they aren’t driving, and 3-4 others who are responsible for fixing anything that breaks and talking with judges. Add 1-2 mentors and we’re under 10 people total… and the drive team doesn’t actually spend much time inside our pit - they’re off talking with their next alliance, or in the stands talking with our scouters.

There are special occasions when we bring more of the team down to the pit, though - being the only all girls teams at the regionals we attend leads to some face time with different VIP’s, and when we know ahead of time they’re coming over, we can bring down additional members for the experience.

#38

I suppose it depends on how effectively your team utilizes the space. Between our robot and our storage we use approximately 29% of our floor space. This is with bumpers on our robot and 160 cubic feet of storage space. We have had thirteen people in the pit working on several occasions and at times had over sixteen before. Perhaps teams should invest in how they utilize the space provided instead of heaping ‘material’ in their pit?

#39

This should be the recommended way to move robots around at an event. The “ROBOT” screaming actually causes problems. It tends to give kids the idea that robots have the right of way over people and they expect people to clear a path for them instead of clearing a path themselves, and it adds to the overall noise in the pits, making the environment more hazardous.

Thanks Brando!

  • Mr. Van
    Coach, Robodox
#40

A best practice that the safety inspectors can pass on while they do their rounds. I need the lingo. What would be a good name to call this position, leading the team robot safely through the crowded pits without yelling. Robot docent? Robot Page? Help!