Honestly don’t think that would be a major issue. Conventions of a certain size can only go to venues of a certain size, which means that their host venues have an incentive to keep the prices comparable (given the conditions of their area etc.), particularly on a repeat customer (multi-year deal, renewal options, etc). You know, so they don’t lose business of a longtime partner, that sort of deal. I’d be surprised if price increases happened solely because of a new Champs venue. New venue, extra CMP event(s), new control system, and KOP swerve drive, all in the same season? That might actually do something to the pricing teams see. New 1-Champs venue? Unlikely.
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pennsylvania is a banger
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Hello CEF,
I feel like I should point out that @rainyskies is a minor and that the comment you made that was deleted is frankly disgusting.
As someone who knows her very well outside of FRC and as a survivor of those very acts you implied she’s interested in, I am horrified that you would accuse her of such a thing just because she is trans. She is an incredibly amazing person, and I am so proud to call her my friend and the fact that we’ve managed to grow through FRC together has been an amazing gift I wouldn’t trade for the world.
As someone who is unabashedly a member of the LGBTQ+ community and in fact is an Dean’s List Semi-Finalist partly for my work in bringing members of the LGBTQ+ community into a team in a highly conservative area and my work on PNW’s DEI committee, your comment towards her is incredibly inappropriate, ungracious, and very unprofessional. Do better. You owe her an apology.
That aside, your attitude in this entire thread and on multiple other threads towards minorities or sensitive topics including: Here , Here, Here, and many other statements have been downright disrespectful and I think Woodie would be incredibly disappointed in you if he was witnessing this right now. If you’re going to argue, at least be professional about it and hear out the other side please instead of making strawman after strawman of an argument and not citing accurate sources.
LGBTQ+ members in FIRST deserves the same right as everyone else to feel safe at competitions, and I have worked very hard these last couple of years to help change that view in Eastern Washington and Oregon through the DEI committee. During that time I have witnessed some downright awful comments and actions toward LGBTQ people at competitions just in the PNW, and I can completely understand and agree why that community would not feel safe at all in Texas.
After centuries of oppression, I think considering this day and age that it would not only be appropriate of FIRST to make sure that Everyone in their community feel safe, it should be expected. That includes minorities.
And when a state is openly attacking a minority, FIRST shouldn’t intentionally endanger the minority by holding champs there! I already have to deal with the risk of being hate crimed by my peers on a daily basis for being who I am, I shouldn’t have to worry for my mentors and my teammates who if went to champs could risk legal trouble with the state of Texas for aiding a teammate’s transition or breaking the drag ban because they decided to present as their gender, not the one they were assigned at birth.
Thank you. I hope you take some time and listen to the others in this thread and do some research from reputable sources, and come back with a more educated point of view. Have a good night!
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I found myself a bit confused at exactly what you and @bigbossg13 were upset about. So, I read through the conversation in question and think I understand what happened.
There are a number of separate conversations happening in this thread – people respond to a comment, ask a question and a mini-conversion goes in a separate direction, all loosely within the original topic of “Other Locations for Championships.” Along the way, there were a couple of comments that suggested that state policies unrelated to LGBTQ issues ought to be considered when choosing a venue. That let to this:
and then I was asked this:
and I responded with this (since hidden because 2 people flagged it. Shortened for brevity):
But, then since I realized I hadn’t described anybody who should be excluded, I thought I’d add a group who most obviously should be:
That ‘you’ was intended to be generic (as in ‘you’d have to be an idiot to jump off that cliff’) and was not intended to refer to any specific person. But, evidently, some people thought I was referring to a specific person (I wasn’t) or saying “Well, LGBTQ people want to have sex with children, so they should be excluded.” I don’t believe that and it WASN’T what I was trying to communicate. (Also, the person I was responding to there wasn’t @rainyskies.)
Now, I don’t know what to say to people who disagree with that last quoted statement. It’s possible to tinker around the edges (“what about an 18-year-old dating a 17-year-old?”) but at the core, that’s pretty fundamental to anything involving youth safety. There really shouldn’t be any disagreement there (presuming you recognize I wasn’t trying to make a side statement about LGBTQ people.)
On a side note, a “Strawman” is when you mischaracterize somebody else’s argument to make it easier to tear down. If you’re going to accuse me about that, please point out the mischaracterization. In this case, there wasn’t an argument being made, so I don’t think that word applies.
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I currently work on the McCormick Place campus and think you should give it another look if you haven’t been in awhile. In the last several years we’ve opened many new hotels and have greatly cleaned up the green line, allowing efficient public transportation from hundreds of area hotels (I should know, I take it multiple days a week). There are also multiple options for private transportation that are already set up with many bus companies to larger hotels in the area.
While there are many other issues with Chicago (although none should eliminate it from contention) hotels are no longer one of them.
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It’s straw-manning because somehow, for some reason, you always keep pushing this conversation back to pedophiles in relation to the context of this chat being about LGBT+ topics. You kinda weird for that one.
Plus this is just general gaslighting, I shouldn’t have to point that part out.
I want to keep this conversation respectful so it’s hard to uh, go into details about the nuances of your posts and how they allude to really odd things. So just know I disapprove of you. “I’m not mad, just disappointed” type beat.
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How exactly do we prove there is a threat to children, without, y’know, child endangerment?
Why do you think proof is needed when you have several eyewitnesses already telling you what they’ve experienced in texas?
Why is texas this important to you?
Why is it this particular hill you’re dying on?
What proof do you need?
Why is it not enough that texan law is a threat to children living in texas?
Why must an out of towner be in the scope before you soften your stance?
You’re an attorney, please make your case before cross examining.
You’ve been defending Houston as a location for champs on this site since they started hosting it in 2017, what’s the story there?
At the end of the day you are personally either driving 17-21h to get there or flying ($200 this time of year, it adds up). If we go with Chicago, which you seem to despise, you personally save between 5-7 hours of driving, or a similar flight with less air time. Is it worth the oft dismissed crime stat, or could you feel less stressed with a day’s less driving?
Looking at the other locations proposed-- Detroit, Nashville, St. Louis, Toronto, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh, Kansas City, Orlando, even Montreal – all of them are a closer drive and a faster flight for you and your team. The people who remember 5607’s trip to worlds from a few years ago probably remember a hassle of travel followed by the only outdoor worlds I’ve seen yet. We can do better.
You are, at minimum, 12 years out of high school. You’re at least 28 years old. As a trusted technical mentor on 5607, you are asked to be appropriate with people you deal with in FIRST. Stop mentioning sex and LGBTQ+ in the same blurbs when speaking to teenagers. We’re all uncomfortable. Let’s get back to the actual topic at hand.
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I think Vegas and Toronto are both non-starters.
Vegas
- too many school districts will refuse to send teams there
- even worse than Houston in terms of median distance from teams
Toronto
- international travel is a PITA
- probably not as bad as Vegas, but many schools don’t do international travel
- Winter weather possible
back to St Louis is my hope / prediction.
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To further discuss this point, some schools don’t even allow out of state travel or only allow it once every two years… Schools are strange and hopefully make exceptions for world championships.
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I’m so incredibly disappointed in this response. There’s a lot to unpack here.
I believe you meant to reply to both @bigbossg13 and @mangohighchew, rather than just Kai. Both of whom are understandably upset at what you had the gall to accuse me of, and then deny ever happened.
It was me. I have proof. I am 17.
And this was in response to this fyi
You clearly didn’t read the link. You are an adult. Please act like one.
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Lets get this thread back on topic, eh?
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I agree with everything you said but this. You realize that First had a contract with this convention center before these legislation was put in place. I understand not resigning with them again but to blame First seems really unfair.
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Respectfully; the problem with that is that First extended their contract with Houston to 2025 after issues had been raised.
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A short term extension to allow more time to vet other options is better than signing another long multi-year contract in the same location out of convenience.
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LA champs (stupid idea)
San Diego champs (stupider idea)
(yeah I know ive posted this suggestion a bunch in this thread, it’s mostly a joke but I could see it working)
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Setting aside the cost, I’m not sure the San Diego airport can handle the passenger load that Champs brings in.
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Anaheim Champs (slightly less stupid idea).
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portland champs :) (very stupid idea)
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Pittsburgh Champs (It’s the robotics capital of the world).
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