Press Brakes and Tooling

Hello CD,

I have seen a lot of great discussions on CNC mills, routers, etc. but not a lot on press brakes and tooling. We have some grant funding coming in that we want to use to purchase a press brake and tooling with.

We have several sponsors in our community that bend a lot of sheet metal and we are visiting with them but I wanted to see if anyone on CD has knowledge and recommendations on getting set up.

We are doing a lot of research and planning at this point in time. We would like to make a purchase this summer. This brake would be used for our robotics program and our engineering courses.

We are currently looking at this Baileigh press brake:

Youtube Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Do5KLLHUQ7U

Website: https://www.baileigh.com/press-brake-bp-3350nc

We like this machine because of the price point, footprint, and features but we are open to suggestions.

We have an excellent engineering lab at school that I run that has Haas CNC mills and lathes, CNC routers, manual mills and lathes, etc. We want to expand on our fabrication capabilities and do a lot more sheet metal work.

I see us using a lot of .090 aluminum and lexan on the brake. Basic 90 degree bends, various acute angles, hems, etc.

This is obviously a new realm for us but we are eager to learn more about the process.

So…does anyone have any recommendations on a brake? What tooling would you recommend as a must have for starting out? Vendors? What else would we need besides the brake and tooling?

1 Like

That’s a really spendy piece of equipment to get without having any experience with press brakes.

971 has a small manual press brake they use. They may have some recommendations. I don’t think you will find many FRC teams who have press brakes in their shops, so any advice would likely have to come from people who use them at work.

I would recommend talking to a local sheet metal shop to ask their opinion of what you should get. If you’re able to buy used equipment you can likely get a better machine for cheaper. A local shop would likely have leads on good used equipment or may be willing to donate tooling or an older machine to you.

We do a fair amount with bent sheet stock. Combined with a WJ or CNC router, its a great way to get structure without excessive mass. Through sponsors we have access to an old press brake very like the one pictured as well as an ancient manual brake and shear.
Honestly, we use the manual brake more than the big one. Its more convenient and safer. Plastic we usually do by hand after heating it near the bend line. One word of advice: Pay attention to the alloys you’re bending and how to control the inside radii. Otherwise you’ll have parts crack/break on you. We knew it academically, but still had to learn it the hard way!

Having a press-brake is great, but like the above commentator, I agree they are ‘spendy’.

I looked at them for quite a while until I decided I could just build one.

No joke, I already had a 12-ton bottle-jack pipe bender (like this one)](https://www.harborfreight.com/12-ton-hydraulic-pipe-bender-62539.html) so I spent about sixty bucks in steel and got to welding.

This one will bend a 24-inch piece of 0.125 Aluminum 5052-H32 without difficulty. Only made frame-rails once. mostly bend smaller stuff.

We mostly ‘air-bend,’ that is, we bend into an open gap. the edge of the ‘ram’ is about a 0.06 radius. I did also build a right-angle that can be placed in the opening, but we’ve seldom used it. You need to bend past 90 to get a right angle with spring-back.

We air-bend across a 1-inch gap. With this type of bend, we can go past 90 degrees too.

here’s what it looks like. I didn’t do CAD, but if someone wants to build one like it, I could draw it pretty quickly, ask me.

5804 is looking at getting a manual brake this summer to help with sheet metal fabrication. Baileigh is one of the companies we’re looking at, specifically their box and pan brakes.

I’ve worked at a fab shop with multiple hydraulic press brakes (some cnc, some much older than myself with dial back gauges) for about seven years but I’m still definitely limited in my knowledge of sheet metal bending and press brakes. I do know enough though to know that there’s a lot that goes into the process. A good amount of my time at this shop has been spent doing drawings for bent parts from .060 aluminum all the way up to 3/4" mild steel so I’ve had to pick up on bend allowance rules, material properties, crowning, etc. You didn’t say in your post if you have any background with brakes or bending but if not, I would definitely encourage you look more into it all. I’m sure the machinery’s handbook is a good place to start on that (just like everything in the shop), in addition to I’m sure an endless stream of knowledge from around the web, and the sponsors in your community. You can also PM me if you have any other questions and I can either answer them or, more likely, ask one of the greybeards at the shop.

As for the brake you’re looking at getting, I’d be wary of a hydraulic press in a high school shop as far as safety goes, but I’m also wary about the manual brake we’re getting. As with any machine tool, there’s a lot that can go wrong with a hydraulic brake from the obvious pinching (read: removing) fingers and extremities, to splitting dies and showering all those around with metal shrapnel at crotch level. The latter may be less of a concern with newer tooling that is only hardened on the very surface where it contacts the work, and then softer throughout but is still always a worry in the back of my mind. I know I plan on being extremely strict about usage of our brake by students and will always have tight supervision by myself or another mechanical mentor while using them, and the chances of catastrophe on a manual are far less than on a hydraulic in my opinion. Or at least the catastrophe will happen in a more slow and controlled fashion ::ouch::.

What is it you’re trying to do with this brake that you don’t think you’d be able to do with a manual brake? You can certainly get a manual brake that will do up to 1/8" aluminum or mild steel, 90 degree bends, some sharper bends depending on what you need, and even some pretty tight reverse bends (~.625"). I don’t think you’d be able to find one able to hem but I also don’t think I’ve ever seen a use for hemming on any robots I’ve been a part of or seen at competitions so I bet for the 25 grand price difference, you could get away without it. For lexan, I’ve actually never seen a press brake used to make bends.It may be possible and from my reading, it looks like it is, but any time I’ve ever needed to bend plastic sheets, I’ve just sat it on a plastic bending heat strip for a few seconds and then bent it around a template (usually a 2x4 or something simple).

All that being said, if you can treat this machine as a learning device for students, I would say it is most certainly worth it. My shop and many shops around the country are hard pressed to find skilled labor whether its welders, machinists, brake operators, what have you. If, in your opinion, this brake and the knowledge that will inevitably come with it will positively impact more students in your area than a manual brake would, I would say definitely pull the trigger on it.

If you do go with this baileigh or any hydraulic brake for that matter, you’re going to probably need additional tooling. The thicker your material, the wider bottom dies you will need to make bends and you can find charts like this around which will show you what die to get for the thickness material and given tonnage of your press. You might also want some gooseneck punches for tight return bends, some hemming tooling and then maybe even some horn punches which will allow the back end of a bent part to swing back through the space created between opposing horns towards the front/back of the machine. Using the correct tooling is pretty dang important on hydraulic press brakes (see paragraph 3) so definitely don’t skimp on this stuff and always, ALWAYS make sure they’re seated correctly and tightly before bending anything.

If you end up getting a brake of any type, make sure you pay attention to your alloys for aluminum. While I don’t think you’ll run into it much, some alloys are not formable and will crack or split if you bend them past a certain point. Formable alloys include 3003, 5052, or 6061 while you probably want to stay away from like a 7005 alloy. Most of what you commonly come across is going to be 6061 anyway though so like I said, you probably won’t have problems with it most of the time.

Hereare some budget options that would likely work fine for most teams. I use the 12T HF kit at home for bending many different things. I changed out the manual cylinder for an air-driven cylinder, which has worked very nicely for me. The digital angle gage listed on Swag is a great tool to have in general. I have two that I use routinely.

On 95 we got a press brake like this one for our pit this year. It was tremendous for bending small brackets quickly and precisely in the pits.

There are many other options out there for press brakes. Pan and Box brakes are a much less expensive way to get into folding large pieces of sheet metal though. Something like this machine can bend most thicknesses an FRC team would be interested in.

Have you taken a look at what’s on the used market in you area? A 138 ton press brake with 2 robot armsgoes for 22-25K. Now that may be a little much but with your budget something small with a 3 axis CNClike thisshouldn’t be hard to find.

5804 is looking at getting a manual brake this summer to help with sheet metal fabrication. Baileigh is one of the companies we’re looking at, specifically their box and pan brakes.

I’ve worked at a fab shop with multiple hydraulic press brakes (some cnc, some much older than myself with dial back gauges) for about seven years but I’m still definitely limited in my knowledge of sheet metal bending and press brakes. I do know enough though to know that there’s a lot that goes into the process. A good amount of my time at this shop has been spent doing drawings for bent parts from .060 aluminum all the way up to 3/4" mild steel so I’ve had to pick up on bend allowance rules, material properties, crowning, etc. You didn’t say in your post if you have any background with brakes or bending but if not, I would definitely encourage you look more into it all. I’m sure the machinery’s handbook is a good place to start on that (just like everything in the shop), in addition to I’m sure an endless stream of knowledge from around the web, and the sponsors in your community. You can also PM me if you have any other questions and I can either answer them or, more likely, ask one of the greybeards at the shop.

As for the brake you’re looking at getting, I’d be wary of a hydraulic press in a high school shop as far as safety goes, but I’m also wary about the manual brake we’re getting. As with any machine tool, there’s a lot that can go wrong with a hydraulic brake from the obvious pinching (read: removing) fingers and extremities, to splitting dies and showering all those around with metal shrapnel at crotch level. The latter may be less of a concern with newer tooling that is only hardened on the very surface where it contacts the work, and then softer throughout but is still always a worry in the back of my mind. I know I plan on being extremely strict about usage of our brake by students and will always have tight supervision by myself or another mechanical mentor while using them, and the chances of catastrophe on a manual are far less than on a hydraulic in my opinion. Or at least the catastrophe will happen in a more slow and controlled fashion ::ouch::.

What is it you’re trying to do with this brake that you don’t think you’d be able to do with a manual brake? You can certainly get a manual brake that will do up to 1/8" aluminum or mild steel, 90 degree bends, some sharper bends depending on what you need, and even some pretty tight reverse bends (~.625"). Box and pan brakes can do hems with the right tooling if need be and they’ll still do lexan as long as it’s true lexan.

All that being said, if you can treat this machine as a learning device for students, I would say it is most certainly worth it. My shop and many shops around the country are hard pressed to find skilled labor whether its welders, machinists, brake operators, what have you. If, in your opinion, this brake and the knowledge that will inevitably come with it will positively impact more students in your area than a manual brake would, I would say definitely pull the trigger on it.

If you do go with this baileigh or any hydraulic brake for that matter, you’re going to probably need additional tooling. The thicker your material, the wider bottom dies you will need to make bends and you can find charts like this around which will show you what die to get for the thickness material and given tonnage of your press. You might also want some gooseneck punches for tight return bends, some hemming tooling and then maybe even some horn punches which will allow the back end of a bent part to swing back through the space created between opposing horns towards the front/back of the machine. Using the correct tooling is pretty dang important on hydraulic press brakes (see paragraph 3) so definitely don’t skimp on this stuff and always, ALWAYS make sure they’re seated correctly and tightly before bending anything.

If you end up getting a brake of any type, make sure you pay attention to your alloys for aluminum. While I don’t think you’ll run into it much, some alloys are not formable and will crack or split if you bend them past a certain point. Formable alloys include 3003, or 5052 while you probably want to stay away from like a 7005 alloy. Most of what you commonly come across is going to be 6061 which I’ve seen bend fine and also snap so just be careful with what you get.

We’re a pretty big sheet metal team so we bought a brake before the season started and used it for bends on our drivetrain and bellypan, the majority being .090 and 90 degree bends. It was relatively easy to use, just takes some practice getting used to adjustments of leaves and fingers.

Our brake:
http://www.grizzly.com/products/42-Swivel-Bending-Brake/G0481?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI5uWP47Pq2gIVz7jACh1S5A_tEAQYASABEgLgOvD_BwE

I think it works well for FRC.

971 has had a Di Acro 16-24 hand operated press brake since 2013. It’s a very useful tool. I’m not actually sure whether these are made anymore and they might be exclusively on the used tool market, but those are better deals anyway. There’s a number of advantages that a good press brake will have over a pan/finger brake, and this hand operated one is good for most FRC applications. I’d stay away from press brakes as part of a 3-1 (roller, brake, shear). In my albeit limited experience, those tools combine 3 relatively poor tools into 1, and you’re better off investing in a good tool for each, or not buying the 3 in 1 at all, though the rollers are usually adequate on the 3 in 1s.

That is the same manual press brake that we have. I believe they are used-only these days, which is a shame. It is the brake that we used to make the unreasonably complex belly pan for our 2016 robot. Love it.

https://i.imgur.com/iCedRZE.jpg

Thanks for the responses. We have a nice finger brake already. I understand that this is a big purchase and we are evaluating that on our end. One of the things that we are looking at is that there are a lot of manufacturers in our community that do a lot of this type of work. Our program likes to provide manufacturing skill sets that are available in our local community so this type of equipment makes sense to expand into.

We are actively discussing this with them for recommendations etc. We have mentors that have some experience as well. We’ll try to keep this post up to date as we make decisions.

Any other recommendations for a small-medium hydraulic/electric press brake? We are looking too.

What about a magnetic press brake? I have no experience with it, but I know a machine shop that has one.

https://www.baileigh.com/magnetic-brake-bb-4816m

We ended up going with the Baileigh that I referenced earlier. Absolutely love it. We were able to do so much with our CNC Router and press brake. Had a lot to learn with the setup on the tooling but once we figured it out it opened a whole new world of possibilities for us.

We bought tooling from Mate.com with the maglock and it has been great. We air bend and primarily used .090 5052 using 90 degree bends.

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@mrwright Do you have any photos of the things you have made with your press brake? Also, what specific tooling did you end up purchasing? I am also wondering how your brake differs from the much cheaper BP-3305CNC model.

Also, I’m wondering if you have found a standard 2-axis brake to be adequate, or if there is a need for additional axes? Anyone else who is an expert on press brakes, please feel free to chime in on the multi-axis question. I’m trying to build my understanding of what kind of parts you can and can’t do with different types of machines.

I will work on getting you some details after we get back from Champs.

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@mrwright I realize champs is upon us and you’re likely busier than I can imagine. I’m looking to make a move on a press brake pretty rapidly. Any info you’re able to provide would be appreciated.

I think that Baileigh brake is the same one we’ve got in our machine shop… have had it for a few years and it has worked fine. For FRC I’ve used it to bend up some battery boxes for teams from 1/8" aluminum (which we cut on the waterjet… one of the advantages of being a post-secondary institution… we do get some nice toys).

I don’t use it all that much… it’s a bit of a pain to get it set up and dialled in for a single bend. It would be great for production work, but not the quickest for prototyping. (Although if I used it regularly, I’d probably be quicker at setting it up.) It replaced a smaller, hand press brake… and I really miss the little one. It could do about 90% of the work with about 10% of the hassle… but for that last 10% of the work that we absolutely could NOT do on the little one, this has been nice to have.

Jason

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