Are the vision targets supposed to be included in the kit for 2013?
you can get it from andymark - see this thread http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1208023
No, but the tape from Andymark will suffice at first. You will want to get the actual tape in the end from 3M - the reflection characteristics may not match the AndyMark supplied tape.
The AndyMark tape is not the same?
AndyMark
The tape specc’ed in the Game Manual is 3M 8830 Silver Marking Film. AndyMark has Reflexite GP020. Not exactly the same, so you could use it at first (same genre of material), but I’d imagine you’d want to test that your system against the stuff that is used in competition.
AndyMark sells the Reflixite. AndyMark through First Choice also has the 3M tape.
You are right. I stand corrected.
The 27 feet on First Choice looks to be enough for a high goal and a middle goal. Has anyone found another distributor?
I’m going to echo this question. Our team quickly used up all of our FIRST choice credits before everything was gone and then realized we needed the tape. We are now trying to get the tape off of a local team, but it would be nicer if we could buy it from somewhere. The 3M site is impossible to navigate, but has anyone found a source?
http://www.ironhorsesafety.com/ has it. Be warned, it’s $590/roll and I don’t know if they sell it in less than that.
It’s not clear to me what 3M/FIRST were thinking when they spec’d this. They might as well be using unicorn tail or griffin flight feathers - they’d be easier to find.
It would have been good if 3M could have made this available through their web store, or seeded some distributors with the product.
I don’t really understand why it’s only available for credits and not cash at Andy Mark.
QFT
I’m trying to find this too and having as good of luck as anyone else.
IIRC, most of the AM FIRST Choice stuff is donated.
I sent an email to AndyMark saying we’d buy 50 feet, if they carried it. Maybe if enough people offer to buy some, AndyMark will buy a case.
Fair enough, but that it’s not available elsewhere is a problem and has the potential to tarnish the image of FIRST.
Lots of teams are calling companies that, in all likelhood they will never do business with again, demanding immediate and urgent attention as they try to buy product(s) that are non-stock, have a 14 day lead and are generally unavailable.
I’m not sure that FRC should be inflicting this on 3M distributors.
I emailed Andy the same thing today.
We also called 3M today and found our distributor. We called the distributor and asked about 4". They said 4" is an “uncommon” non-stock item but they could order it. Minimum order qty = 1 case of 3 rolls, 100m per roll, >$500 per roll, >$1500 for the case of 3 rolls. :eek: We asked if they had any 2" in stock that we could “double up”. Nope. We asked if there was any other way to get a small (~10 yard) piece of 4" wide. They said they had some 8" wide in stock and could cut it down the middle for us. We asked how much. $250 :eek: We asked what other size they had in stock remotely close to 4". They said they had some 3 1/4". We asked how much for a 10 yard long piece of the 3 1/4" would be. ~$75 + shipping. Supposedly it’s on its way. Hopefully 3 1/4" wide will be “close enough” for our vision tracking programming team to handle.
Here’s where we ordered the 3 1/4": http://www.safetyeffects.com/
The kind folks out at Safety Effects have 8" 8830 which they, because they realize there are many teams looking for it and it’s hard to find, are willing to split (to 4") and sell in 10 yard increments. The cut will not be absoutely perfect, but better than you can do with scissors (should be much better than you need for targeting).
Give them a call and mention that you’re with an FRC team and they’ll know what you’re talking about.
After reading through some of these threads, I’m thinking that perhaps FIRST should be my form of “inside trading”…
Anyhow, has anyone ever done testing to see just how different retroreflective tape is brand to brand?