Scoring incorrect

After reading though cd I wanted to take a poll of teams that really did have there scores miscounted. I want to see if this is wide spread or just a few mishaps that are getting blown up.

We’ve had some herded balls missed, and a couple of laps weren’t counted. None of the instances affected the outcome of the matches, though.

EDIT: All the discrepancies we saw were early Friday morning; as far as we’re concerned, scoring was correct Friday afternoon and Saturday.

There’s an underlying assumption in this poll that the teams’ scoring is correct and that of the referees is incorrect. I would challenge this hypothesis. There have obviously been referee mistakes in scoring, but that is far different than making a (hidden) assumption that the teams always understand what their true score should have been and that the refs don’t.

I wholeheartedly agree with you as pertains to hurdling or herding. There may be instances where a hurdle touched an alliance robot before the floor, or the robot was touching the trackball as it passed the finish line. However, laps are completely objective. When a team sees its robot complete 4 or 5 laps, and the lapscore shows 0, there’s no question that there is a discrepancy.

Indeed. I saw a match at the Boilermaker regional where one robot consistently put a trackball across the overpass on each lap, but about half the time the driver moved forward too soon and re-contacted the ball before it hit the floor. The spoiled hurdles were correctly not counted, but I wouldn’t be surprised if many people didn’t realize the team’s mistake and thought it was a scoring error.

1986’s match that was scored incorrectly happened to be in the 3rd match of the semi’s at Kansas City. We had consistantly be getting 8 laps and that match we got 4. We also lost by 8 points. The bad part was that we didn’t figure this out until Sunday evening after watching the match. We watched it and counted at least 8 laps but the final score only said 4. This was extremely depressing and that small error knocked us out of the competition.

I know in New Jersey, Team 102 had a few matches where they went around about 2-3 more times than counted. Sure, it got on our nerves, but there was nothing we could really do about it. I aint so sure about the whole flag bit being the thing that counts - because if it comes disconnected, you’re outa luck

We did indeed have a match put up on the scoreboard with an incorrect score at one regional and the members of my team were highly upset because it was a critical match. After the regional was over, however, I made them watch the replay and count the scoring for BOTH alliances. At this point, they saw that the other team’s score was not reported correctly either and they had still beaten our alliance. Most probably, the mistake was in not putting the FINAL score up on the screen correctly, not a fault of the referees.

I find that it helps to remind my team that the real reason they are doing this is to learn and develop skills. The game and any mistakes that can be made will never be able to negate what they have gained by working with the mentors. The game is supposed to be fun!:smiley:

This was brought up on the 2008 Florida Regional thread.

To summarize, view the drastic change in score at 1:50 for Finals Match 1 at the Florida Regional.

I am more interested in the reason for the large discrepancy of the score during matches. I know that I do not want to win nor lose because of a miss-score. I just want to know what really happened.

At Florida, I do know that a couple of matches were re-played during qualifying because of a miss-score, but I don’t want this to be a prevalent thing especially with the large number of teams at Championships.

There isn’t much control over the score and I hope this issue is addressed before championships. If not, it would be a shame to encourage a teammate to keep an eye on the scoreboard instead of the field enjoying the game.

May I suggest putting one ref to each robot since there is so much going on during a match?

It’s just about impossible for a Scorekeeper to display the wrong score. The scorekeeper doesn’t enter laps or hurdles, they are done automatically based on counters and the data entry pads held by the referees. The only time the scorekeeper actually changes the scoring is by entering the number of penalties and G14 bonus scores at the end of the match, or by entering corrections to the lap scores (which the refs give to the scorekeeper). In this year’s game, there is no scoring actually done by the scorekeepers. So, “putting the final score up” incorrectly can only be done if the scorekeepers don’t wait for adjustments from the referees before pushing the “commit score” button. This would only happen once! Not to be a “blame them” kind of person, but in “Overdrive” any scoring mistakes would most likely be with the refs or the electronics, since the scorekeepers would have to really, really try to display any score other than what the refs intended.

Rick “Trained scorekeeper” TYler

The scoring and reffing is worst this year than ever before

The only reason that is, is because this game is more difficult to score.

Last year, the points were totaled at the end of the game without any problems. They would look at the rack, and if robots were on ramps.

This year, the only thing to look at when the match ends is if there is a bonus. The laps must be counted constantly along with hurdles and herding, plus there are many more fouls this year than in years past.

Pretty strong statement from a new poster with two weeks’ background on Delphi…

That says nothing about their experiences in FIRST though. There are mentors in FIRST who never post or read CD and I would listen to them any day over most people on CD.

At BAE we had two matches misscored. In a qualifying match, we placed a trackball on top of our overpass, which then got knocked forward and off the rails by an opponent. This should have been scored as a hurdle, but was not scored at all. We lost the match by fewer than 8 points, so this misscored hurdle was the deciding factor. This was also not the only time we saw this happen at BAE - one side’s refs were consistently not scoring hurdles in this kind of situation on Friday. They did improve, and correctly scored such matches on Saturday.

We also had one match - a semifinal - where the autonomous score was not scored correctly. There was a 2 minute delay while the referees adjusted the score, and I’m still not sure if it ever got corrected properly.

Yep. It’s just that this particular post didn’t sound like a wise old mentor making a sagacious comment. It sounded like an irritated teenager. I freely admit that I might be wrong, &c.

Bitterly complaining about scoring and officiating is a perennial feature of CD, at least in the four seasons I’ve been reading it. Remember the near-hysterical criticism of scoring mistakes and 30-point penalties in 2005? I need to go dig up some quotes from those old threads to help people put Overdrive in perspective.

I had to watch it a few times to see what was happening. Swamp drops a ball, and it rolls across the line. The ref pushed the wrong button and scored it as a hurdle. After everyone is over in the corner, the ref corrected the score, taking away 8 points (and presumably adding 2, although you can’t tell because robots were crossing the line at the same time). Then unfortunately another hurdle is removed by mistake.

I think I misunderstood the poll. We had two quarter finals where the penalties were deducted from the wrong alliance causing the offending alliance to be reported as the winner of the round. Both scores were then corrected.

This was covered in the Florida regional thread. The hurdle before the one that was dropped also did not count because 179 touched the ball before it touched the ground. It just did not get corrected until later.

I don’t believe our team was in any misscored matches. However, we also were getting fairly high scores, so none of us were really that worried about watching exactly how many points we obtained. The drivers would ask how many hurdles they got, and I would answer “a lot”.