Should Pneumatic Riveters be Illegal?

Pneumatic riveters unfairly raise the floor for FRC teams. Think about it. We have teams that perfect their riveting technique over many years for maximum grip strength. And then we have rookie teams that just buy COTS pneumatic riveters and suddenly can rivet to near-perfect grip strength. It’s an absolute travesty is what it is. There’s no reason why some random rookie team should be able to compete with a team that does R&D into riveting techniques over multiple years. This is the issue with FRC. FRC is not an engineering competition. It’s a competition for who has the richer parents to bankroll the team/ who’s business team can get better sponsors.

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Ani go to bed

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This is a joke right?

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Here before the lock

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First of all: this isn’t relevant to the post.

Second of all: I live on the west coast.

3rd of all: :sunglasses:

Thanks!

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What about the Milwaukee battery powered riveter? Surely we can’t let such amazing power rest in the hands of students completely unregulated.

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No. I think that in general FRC should reward teams who place time and effort into researching techniques to improve their robot. I’m perfectly fine with greyt as teams do not always have the manufacturing resources to access complicated systems. However, learning how to properly rivet is an essential skill to learning STEM overall. I would view it almost as important as counting how many balls go into a goal.

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As long as they don’t try to do something crazy like publish documentation on how to use their riveter’s brand of rivets on other rivet guns, it’s fine. That would basically be stealing.

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I completely agree. The Milwaukee battery powered riveter is almost worse than a pneumatic riveter due to it’s nearly $150 higher price tag. However, I think pneumatic riveters are a much more widespread issue and accordingly should be dealt with first. After the conclusion of this campaign, I will work to ban Milwaukee battery powered riveters as well.

How about this:

we no longer use powertools in FRC

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To play devils advocate, if a team has the resources to have a pneumatic riveter, they can spend the time that they would’ve spent teaching how to properly rivet with a hand riveter on teaching a different aspect of frc that the other team doesn’t have time for, which essentially helps this students learn even more as well.

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I think that’s a very interesting concept. Right off the bat, I think that would help with the newly updated rules regarding the fabrication of parts before the season. I think this is extremely promising, as whatever productivity we might loose due to the loss of our cnc can quickly be regained by stockpiling parts that were made in <30 minutes and able to address any game challenge.

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The real hack is to not even do FRC and spend the time that they would’ve spent teaching FRC on teaching a different aspect of engineering that the team doesn’t have time for, which essentially helps the students learn even more.

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I think no one here recognizes the true problem:

FIRST needs to ban students from participating in its programs. Since the average GPA and sleep of a FRC student declines dangerously during build season, they cannot focus on any engineering anyways.

I propose that mentors do all the designing, building, and coding, and then summarize it in a curriculum involving tests and essays that takes the whole year to go through. This is really the only way students will learn anything, as we can see with the present school system.

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I think the prevalence of pneumatic riveters reveals an issue that I fear is common. Engineers often view certain tasks as beneath them. Think about it. Everyone always jokes about making freshmen do all the menial jobs on the robot. However, the robot can not function without these essential workers’ contributions. Yet what respect do freshman receive? Nothing. I believe that the banning of pneumatic riveters would bring respect back to the jobs that are currently undervalued. I am the Titan Gilroy of riveting and I will bring back manual riveting.

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I’m going to suggest banning the use of pop rivets.

All rivets must now be set with a REAL rivet gun* and bucking bar. Generates twice the work as that requires two students (or mentors), one on the gun and one on the bar. Teaches good communication, too.

*These happen to be pneumatic, because electric ones don’t make nearly as much noise if they even exist. They may or may not also end up firing their riveting end across the room if someone makes a mistake, for added hilarity and/or long-range riveting.

Oh, and uh… @Rivet_Man? Care to comment?

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OCCRA has entered the chat

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I would like to propose a conspiracy theory. @Animesh is one of the Boltman Neural Networks created with horse race probability theory. Boltman is using this bot in order to get rivets banned from FRC in an attempt to weaken the power Rivet Man has against him.

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no

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Could you at least have gone to #other:chit-chat like a normal person?